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Who are you to question God? really...
- Thread starter Lady B
- Start date
Draka
Wonder Woman
Funny story, I had originally typed Shiva in there, but for some reason thought I misspelled it (though I hadn't) so erased itHow dare you forget Shiva! blasphemer! :149:
Evil ! Evil... *drums * WITCH!
duh:areyoucra
cry me a river
You sound so certain
You clearly haven't had much contact with atheists and agnostics then
It'd hardly be an argument, unless you can read minds of course
I give respect where respect is due and no my parents created me
no but I know about as much as you do
Of course not, hence the term apathetic agnostic
*Yawn* are you done preaching now?
To increase my understanding.
You could have given some example reasons that don't make us sound like ********
Then maybe it's time you called it a day...
Lady B
noob
Well I have read over all the posts since I left last night, some of you have made rational arguments and some of you have only increased my fear for you. I am not really sure how to argue with some of you who just missed my point entirely, I have stated repeatedly that this is not about questioning scripture or even a particular view of God. It is about the person who can boldly say " I would walk right up to God and say it to his face" No you will not, sorry....
If that is arrogant on my behalf, so be it. I will not take back my concerns for you, I do not go around this site and Blaspheme your God's as you have claimed. Try to find one post from me calling your God evil, unworthy, despicable, narcissistic, a liar an animal, a power hungry being even sex crazed,sadistic and so much more.I have stated many times here, it is about lack of respect, seeing God as beneath you, and Boldly arrogantly seeking to dismantle any authority above your own.
Perhaps I have misspoken, perhaps I have taken too much upon myself, insulted you even, forgive me If that is how you see me.But be assured, I am not speaking to all of you who question rightly,You of course have this God given right, I didn't try to take it from you at all, I am trying to reach out to those who claim they will walk right up to God and spit in his face, that is all.
If that is arrogant on my behalf, so be it. I will not take back my concerns for you, I do not go around this site and Blaspheme your God's as you have claimed. Try to find one post from me calling your God evil, unworthy, despicable, narcissistic, a liar an animal, a power hungry being even sex crazed,sadistic and so much more.I have stated many times here, it is about lack of respect, seeing God as beneath you, and Boldly arrogantly seeking to dismantle any authority above your own.
Perhaps I have misspoken, perhaps I have taken too much upon myself, insulted you even, forgive me If that is how you see me.But be assured, I am not speaking to all of you who question rightly,You of course have this God given right, I didn't try to take it from you at all, I am trying to reach out to those who claim they will walk right up to God and spit in his face, that is all.
no-body
Well-Known Member
Well I have read over all the posts since I left last night, some of you have made rational arguments and some of you have only increased my fear for you. I am not really sure how to argue with some of you who just missed my point entirely, I have stated repeatedly that this is not about questioning scripture or even a particular view of God. It is about the person who can boldly say " I would walk right up to God and say it to his face" No you will not, sorry....
If that is arrogant on my behalf, so be it. I will not take back my concerns for you, I do not go around this site and Blaspheme your God's as you have claimed. Try to find one post from me calling your God evil, unworthy, despicable, narcissistic, a liar an animal, a power hungry being even sex crazed,sadistic and so much more.I have stated many times here, it is about lack of respect, seeing God as beneath you, and Boldly arrogantly seeking to dismantle any authority above your own.
Perhaps I have misspoken, perhaps I have taken too much upon myself, insulted you even, forgive me If that is how you see me.But be assured, I am not speaking to all of you who question rightly,You of course have this God given right, I didn't try to take it from you at all, I am trying to reach out to those who claim they will walk right up to God and spit in his face, that is all.
If it is the literal God of the bible that Christians describe then yeah, I will. At least I will make my point in how badly he has failed his creation. Unless when I die I lose my free will in which case I will at least think of what an evil monster he is before he condemns me and hypnotizes me into doing what he says.
Magic Man
Reaper of Conversation
That sure seemed to be the point of your first few posts here.
Maybe, maybe not, but why are you addressing this? So what if people pretend they'd do something they wouldn't actually do? I mean, sure, maybe they wouldn't and it's a silly thing to say, but I don't understand why you're so passionate about them claiming it.
See, this is why it seems to be more than just calling someone out for saying they'd tell God something to his face if he existed, when in fact they wouldn't. This is an argument for people respecting your god. First, it's only a concept. Second, the way the OT depicts your god, it's reasonable for people to disrespect the concept and consider it beneath them. Third, it's not any authority above their own, just the one portrayed in the OT.
So you are only worried for those of us who claim we'll say this to God's face? So simply claiming that your interpretation of God doesn't paint a pretty picture is fine?
We have no God for you to blaspheme. That's sorta atheism's thing.
But saying stuff like "Atheists secretly do believe in God" is pretty darn rude and awfully arrogant, not to mention completely and utterly wrong.
I wonder. Do you give Muhammad the respect that Muslims claim is his right? Who are you to so arrogantly ignore his teachings? This, of course, is the case for any religion except the one you have chosen to believe. I'm really curious as to your response to this. Do you not see that you are just as guilty of disrespect and "blaspheme" to every single other religion in the world?
I'm also curious how you address the claim, made by multiple posters, that we really aren't talking about God. We are talking about your interpretation of God, your conception of God. Does that soothe your fears at all?Perhaps I have misspoken, perhaps I have taken too much upon myself, insulted you even, forgive me If that is how you see me.But be assured, I am not speaking to all of you who question rightly,You of course have this God given right, I didn't try to take it from you at all, I am trying to reach out to those who claim they will walk right up to God and spit in his face, that is all.
See, if God exists, I highly doubt that he is anything like the God your religion depicts. I probably wouldn't have an issue with the real God, if it turns out he exists, and I also highly doubt that he'd have any issue with most of us.
It's your beliefs about God that I find strange, improbable, and unappealing. Just like you probably find the beliefs about Zeus, Shiva, and Thor unappealing.
I don't intend to mock or disrespect "higher authority" if I criticize the god concept you believe in; I merely view it as criticizing an idea, an abstract thought, not an actual being that has the ability to affect the real world in any way. I judge concepts and ideas by the influence they appear to have on people, not the abilities or attributes they are claimed to have.
And I think this perceived disrespect dovetails into the belief you confessed earlier: that everyone deep down 'knows' that there is a god but chooses to deny it. I disagree with that, as I believe that every one of us "denies" the existence of at least a number of deities. As such, criticizing any of the concepts I don't believe in isn't disrespecting any actual being in my view. It is only criticizing certain ideas about how a deity is supposed to be. Why should I be in any more awe of your god concept than the other ones that are also claimed to be powerful and seeking worship from people?
YmirGF
Bodhisattva in Recovery
Well, to be generous, fear is all you have to offer, so this is hardly unexpected.
Actually, it is, but you pretend that it is not.
Sadly, you confuse your um, shall we call it "vision" of "god" with the reality. It appears that you are so utterly convinced of the inerrancy of your own view that their is no room for other views. It is probably inconceivable to you but some of us have met our "vision" of "god" and found, first hand, it was like nothing you describe. In my own case, I was so flooded by feelings of love AND FORGIVENESS... that fear never even entered my mind. Looking into those eyes... well... you simply cannot imagine...
It is an arrogance due to unnatural fixation on a delusional view... that has, over time, been accepted as reality.
"The lady doth protest too much, methinks."
Would it be more helpful if we were all to subscribe to your especially dismal view of humanity? I understand how some need a rigid framework to keep themselves in check, but one must also try to appreciate that others are quite happy without such rigid frameworks.Perhaps I have misspoken, perhaps I have taken too much upon myself, insulted you even, forgive me If that is how you see me.But be assured, I am not speaking to all of you who question rightly,You of course have this God given right, I didn't try to take it from you at all, I am trying to reach out to those who claim they will walk right up to God and spit in his face, that is all.
If the truth be told, it's people who are utterly convinced about the inerrancy of their beliefs that worry me. I am concerned for their sanity and their ability to act rationally in a modern world. Reaching out to such people is #myJihad.
I think you might have put people off with the titleWell I have read over all the posts since I left last night, some of you have made rational arguments and some of you have only increased my fear for you. I am not really sure how to argue with some of you who just missed my point entirely, I have stated repeatedly that this is not about questioning scripture or even a particular view of God. It is about the person who can boldly say " I would walk right up to God and say it to his face" No you will not, sorry....
If that is arrogant on my behalf, so be it. I will not take back my concerns for you, I do not go around this site and Blaspheme your God's as you have claimed. Try to find one post from me calling your God evil, unworthy, despicable, narcissistic, a liar an animal, a power hungry being even sex crazed,sadistic and so much more.I have stated many times here, it is about lack of respect, seeing God as beneath you, and Boldly arrogantly seeking to dismantle any authority above your own.
Perhaps I have misspoken, perhaps I have taken too much upon myself, insulted you even, forgive me If that is how you see me.But be assured, I am not speaking to all of you who question rightly,You of course have this God given right, I didn't try to take it from you at all, I am trying to reach out to those who claim they will walk right up to God and spit in his face, that is all.
. Other then that, its not about God being beneath anyone, at least not to me. Its about values. I cannot consider anyone moral who would, say, kill children. My heart would never allow me to. If its God or not doesnt matter to me. Another thing I dont approve of eternal punishment, not even for someone like Stalin or Jack the Ripper. It just seems too cruel. Doesnt mean I shouldnt be respectful, though.That said, some people are disrespectful and arrogant, and I do not condone that. I think a lot of people needs to open their minds a bit to other perspectives, no matter their faith or lack thereof.
And for the record I prefer when someone is arrogant and honest then humble but dishonest.
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Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Some people would stand up to god, some would cower in fear. This is no different than many situations in real life where some people fearfully acquiesce at the slightest intimidation, while others will boldly and readily put their lives at risk at the slightest injustice. Assuming that other people would all share your fearful view and behavior is both narrow-minded and naive.
davidthegreek
Active Member
I understand what you are saying however I do not accept anyone can say God is cruel so therefore there is no God and if he does exist, well what good is he to be worshipped and respected. Who are we to judge God as cruel? From our own understanding? From our view of fairness? Because Tommy gets the best toys and betty plays with sticks philosophy? From where do we get the arrogance to judge God? From where do we see our minds so high in intellect to surmise God's decisions? I can handle questioning scripture, I can.I can even question my own at times, we are told to study to show ourselves approved, to be sure in our salvation, God does not ask we go as blind idiots.what I cannot handle is men's arrogance , I just can't.
If they have been raised by cruel people who use the name of God, as their excuse to make their life miserable. How do you expect them to believe differently? What they hear is that God made people in his image, so maybe subconsciously they are thinking "well, the people around me are cruel, and since they were made in the image of God. That must mean that God is cruel".
Not to take objection to your post per se, but honestly, is it hard to accept that there are people who just don't believe in any god and are treating god concepts as ideas rather than actual entities? There was an earlier statement in this thread that everyone "knows there is a god," and now there is this "they think God is cruel because of the way they were raised" theory. Couldn't it be that they just don't believe in a god, no strings attached?
Copernicus
Industrial Strength Linguist
It appears to me that you are easily offended by people who reject your religious beliefs. I'm sorry if it offends you that I reject your beliefs, but I have a hard time fearing the wrath of a being that I don't believe exists. And you aren't even trying to justify the existence of your God. You are just trying to frighten me, or anyone else who will listen, into accepting your way of thinking. At some level, you must realize how ineffective that approach is. I continue to believe that heaven and hell exist in the minds of some believers in order to keep their own faith from weakening. That is, what you are telling me is how you convince yourself that God exists. If I already believed in God, your argument might work better to prevent me from entertaining doubts. It does nothing to counteract the doubts already entertained.
I don't see myself spitting in God's face or anyone else's. To me, deities and other spiritual beings are extremely implausible. I cannot take claims of their existence seriously. But, if your God did exist, I would be curious as to why such a being would be insulted by my failure to realize he existed. I can easily understand why you might be insulted that I reject your belief in his existence, but I would expect that kind of being to be less easily insulted.Perhaps I have misspoken, perhaps I have taken too much upon myself, insulted you even, forgive me If that is how you see me.But be assured, I am not speaking to all of you who question rightly,You of course have this God given right, I didn't try to take it from you at all, I am trying to reach out to those who claim they will walk right up to God and spit in his face, that is all.
Me Myself
Back to my username
I think most people here accept authorities above themselves given proper context (bosses, parents, w/ e)
But if we hear of terrible and despicable qualities coming from an entity, are we supposed to call them charming because someone decided this spirit is "THE" "G"od? I am not yielding against tyranic attitude.
You call a spade a spade. If you wouldn´t then that´s you, but for a lot of people here and certainly for myself, we´ll say it as we see it. If a spirit is saying that some humans deserve eternal torture, then this spirit is having a demonic stance.
That´s it.
Me Myself
Back to my username
WARNING:
Blatant generalization:
Maybe they are just thinking "wow, what kind of being would send his own children to be eternally tortured?" and they just got their idea of him after that.
Blatant generalization:
Maybe they are just thinking "wow, what kind of being would send his own children to be eternally tortured?" and they just got their idea of him after that.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Well all, I have decided to leave this forum, not dramaticly, just leaving. Thank you for your time, I wish the best for all of you, sincerally,B
It's going to be a rough life if you want to run away every time people disagree with you. Often, this isn't an option. I wish you luck and, for your sake, hope at some point you learn the wisdom of understanding, equanimity, and acceptance.
Well all, I have decided to leave this forum, not dramaticly, just leaving. Thank you for your time, I wish the best for all of you, sincerally,B
Do what you think is best. The door is open for your return if you should wish to.
One thing before you go, though. There are plenty of things and plenty of subjects that are upsetting us if we remain focused upon them -- especially those things over which we have absolutely no control. The thoughts, beliefs and attitudes of other people are completely outside of your control. Your's are the only ones that you can directly affect.
It is not an act of denial to recognize the existence of something that seems wrong to you, and find that it is best to place your own focus upon something else -- especially in those areas that it is not your right or duty to make the choice for another person. You may have the best of intention, and I believe that you really do. But, having a good intention does not mean that you really get to make that choice -- so what you are left with if you refuse to let go of it, is the frustration over something you do not have the power to do.
Perhaps you might consider simply remaining in the DIR's and other threads that are not so upsetting to you until you find that you can tolerate that many others will NEVER see things, even the existence of God, the way that you do.
(Have you considered that God may be OK with disbelief and outright rejection as a exercise of free will. That is a concept that is considered valid by some Christians.)