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Fuhrer Trump: No muslim welcome for 4 months

Discussion in 'Political Debates' started by Servant_of_the_One1, Jan 28, 2017.

  1. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

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    I rather doubt any intelligent person would want to be associated with your views.
     
  2. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Well-Known Member
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    No, I won't. Because results aren't the most important thing. Establishing actual causation is. If Christians are given a free pass while everyone else is stuck (for no good goddamn reason), then that WILL effect the numbers, but not tell you why the numbers were presenting that way in the first place.
     
  3. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    Boy oh boy, if intent is no longer needed to prove discrimination when a law or act leads to disparity, the u.s. will be rife with lawsuits. So, yes you do need intent.
     
  4. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

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    Ghandi? You think he's just as comparable to Ghandi? Well, that says a lot right there? Other than posting the fewer meme, I don't think I've called him Hitler. However, if you read my previous link, you would see that this is how Hitler got his start... sort of. Hitler was a bit more popular than Trump, but for the very same reasons. He pandered to religious bigotry only it's Muslims this time instead of Jews. Don't make the same mistake and -wait-. ACT NOW!!!
     
  5. Scuba Pete

    Scuba Pete Le plongeur avec attitude...

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    Citation needed. I don't believe that there was ever an Executive Order for this. Furthermore, it smells like this is the same sort of hateful invented crap that was leveled at Obama for the last eight years.
     
  6. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    Ahh, that's too bad. Not that I expected it.

    Which is exactly what I am describing. If the main thing that changes is American policy and all of the sudden lots of Syrian Christians come in, then obviously American policy was at issue. Basic experimental theory, change a variable and see what happens.
     
  7. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

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    I do not see that there was any intent to discriminate against Christian refugees.
    More likely, it is that there were fewer applicants offering them selves to be processed.

    No country has so far sent teams in, to locate and extract potential Christian refugees.
    It would be dangerous both to them and the extraction teams and would require a massive military support on the ground.
    It is true that many Christians are in great danger in the Middle East. but it is exceedingly difficult to help them with out increasing that danger.
     
  8. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    I introduce to you: Disparate Impact. The U.S. legal theory that even a formally neutral rule is illegally discriminatory if it disparately impacts a protected group, such as members of a religion. There is no need to show intent.

    I already gave the numbers. 10% of Syrians are Christian, 1/2 of 1 percent of our refugees from Syria are Christian.

    Effective vs. directly ordered. It was an impact in his method of selecting refugees, and it weeded out Christians.

    Well, it is a factual reality. We only let in 68 Christian Syrian refugees compared to a total of 12,587.
     
  9. Terrywoodenpic

    Terrywoodenpic Oldest Heretic

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    How many Christians applied to enter?
    How many Christians were processed?
    How many Christians were rejected?
    To arrive at that 68 figure.
    That 68 might represent 100% acceptance for all you or I know.
     
  10. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    Absolutely. Let's wait until the worst is accomplished before warning that the worst is yet to come.

    Nor do we need to falsely categorize informed and informative comparisons as false equivalencies. There is some truth in Santayana warning: "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
     
  11. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Rival's Creepy Uncle
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    If you're convinced that the death camps are inevitable,
    & that we can't wait for him to even begin talking of them,
    this suggests taking action more extreme than simply
    advocating for civil liberties. After all, he is Hitler reanmiated.
    What different action should we take to prevent this?
     
  12. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    I do not recall ever saying such a thing.
     
  13. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Rival's Creepy Uncle
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    No, but your response to Tumah about not waiting for such talk strongly suggests inevitability of what he broached.
    If we can't wait, what is it we should do now?
     
  14. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    Rubbish.
     
  15. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Rival's Creepy Uncle
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    No, that won't do.
    You & many others here make some terrifying predictions.
    It's not politics as usual, so this strongly suggests doing
    something different from usual. What would this be?
    Or do you not advocate any change in our actions?

    These are real questions....neither rhetorical nor traps.
     
  16. pearl

    pearl Well-Known Member

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    Fuhrer Trump has done it again, as the Joint Chiefs are dropped from security meetings, Banon is added!

    There was a clear warning from Ben Franklin;
    Upon exiting the Constitutional Convention Benjamin Franklin was approached by a group of citizens asking what sort of government the delegates had created. His answer was: "A republic, if you can keep it." The brevity of that response should not cause us to under-value its essential meaning: democratic republics are not merely founded upon the consent of the people, they are also absolutely dependent upon the active and informed involvement of the people for their continued good health. Another warning from Thomas Jefferson, 'even under the "best forms" of government, those entrusted with power have, in time...perverted it into tyranny. The most effectual means of preventing this is to illuminate...the minds of the people."

    "That is how the Roman republic fell," Augustus became emperor not because he arrested the Roman senate. He became emperor because he promised that he would solve problems that were not being solved." Justice Souter
     
  17. esmith

    esmith Veteran Member

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    No we are talking about taking a closer look at our immigration and refugee policy and until a better means, if possible, of insuring that those that wish us dead are not getting into the country.
    As far as terrorist of any ilk, I put them in the non-human category.
    Take a closer look at what is going on in Europe, do you want those problems here.
    Another example of what could happen here
    Report: Afghan Migrants Arrested in Facebook Live Rape Case
     
  18. pearl

    pearl Well-Known Member

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  19. Drolefille

    Drolefille PolyPanGeekGirl

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    Thanks CG

    If I have hurt you in some way I cannot fathom, I apologize. I genuinely don't hate anyone in this world and frankly I pity people with bigoted, shortsighted, biased beliefs.
    However I ask you to take responsibility for your own actions, because neither me nor my attitude will take that blame. Continuing to call me unintelligent and make other personal attacks will be reported in violation of forum rules.
     
  20. Curious George

    Curious George Veteran Member

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    You should understand more about the legal theories involved here. You need intent/purpose as well. Sorry to burst you bubble. Now there are a few instances where this may not be the case but the general rule is that the plaintiff must show more than disparate Impact or treatment alone. This is going to be especially necessary when looking at immigrants and refugees. Given the religious makeup of other immigrant populations allowed to enter, i.e. Iraq, your argument holds little water. The question you are asking is why didn't the u.s. pay special favor to Christian refugees.
     
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