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Maybe we should nail down exactly what these lies are...Spreading lies about using Christmas as an excuse to celebrate the Messiah Jesus's birth. To propagate more lies.
Is it that Jesus' birthday wasn't really Dec. 25? Is that the lie? You know, I really don't think it's that big a deal.To use the excuse that doing so reveals Christian qualities except for the lie part. To use the main excuse that it's the charity that counts when it's still a lie.
And boy did he ever deliver! Wow, that Satan! You don't need any insurance on his promises, because that boy's gotcha covered! We could all learn from his example...Satan seduced Evn and Adam to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and bad because he offered them power of knowing over doing the right thing.
Nope, it doesn't because you are not Santa are you? :jiggy:SoulTYPE01 said:ROFL.
25th December is my birthday. So, does that make ME a minion of Satan?
The whole point about this is that it's a complete fabrication. There is no date of the Jesus' birth in the Bible or any other document of the period. The whole giving thing was done to entice people to consider being a Christian. The whole part about being a true son of God wasn't enough for those who created Christmas because they were false prophets and false leaders. Then twisting words around to fit the fun and caring around the tradition that Christmas has is just like the twisting of the scriptures that Satan did with Adam and Eve and with Jesus in Matthew 4:1-10.Doc said:Santa Claus or Saint Nicholas as I think he was distributed presents sometime around the celebration of Christ's birth. He gave nice toys and things to good children he knew and coal, sticks, and switches to bad children.
Christmas originated in the gift of the Magi, the three wise men bringing gifts to the king Jesus. What do you find so bad one day of the year, where people don't care about their jobs or how much money they have that day. Is it so bad one day of the year for people to give gifts to one another without expecting so much in return back. Is it so bad for people to give many of their gifts to the homeless and poor as I know people who have. To make people feel like some cares about them. Bah Humbug to you, Scrooge! Merry Christmas!
I really don't think that twisting words around to use them to fit your purposes is something that you should be condemning others for.t3gah said:Then twisting words around to fit the fun and caring around the tradition that Christmas has is just like the twisting of the scriptures that Satan did with Adam and Eve and with Jesus in Matthew 4:1-10.
*Snickers* Very nice extension of a short analogy.an instrument used for making tea inferring that an instrument for cooking in is charred in nature.
I just read through Isaiah 63, could you point me out where it condemns the celebrating on December 25?the December 25 celebration is the one condemned in Isaiah 63
I think the Santa/flying reindeer thing.Maybe we should nail down exactly what these lies are
I don't believe anyone says that Jesus was born on Dec. 25.There is no date of the Jesus' birth in the Bible or any other document of the period
No, it was not chosen to entice, it was chosen because the pagan religions pretty much all had a Dec. 25ish holiday. So all the pagans were used to celebrating, we didn't know when Jesus was born, 2+2=4, we have the mass of Christ's birth on Dec. 25.The whole giving thing was done to entice people to consider being a Christian. The whole part about being a true son of God wasn't enough for those who created Christmas because they were false prophets and false leaders.
The kettle thing is hilarious! Oh yeah, my sides are bursting out!FeathersinHair said:I really don't think that twisting words around to use them to fit your purposes is something that you should be condemning others for.
No, wait, I didn't phrase that very well. I tend to err on the side of not offending people, but that's just my nature. I should rephrase it 'I don't think that you, t3gah, should try to condemn them for doing this, at least until you look at yourself and recognize that you are currently an instrument used for making tea inferring that an instrument for cooking in is charred in nature.' (Translation: pot, meet kettle!) The true believers on this forum have gone a long way to reminding me that the majority of Christians are kind, gentle souls who follow the teachings of Christ. If you continue in this vein, I feel you will be doing them a great disservice.
We Pagans celebrate the Winter Solstice (as we have for many, many years), and that falls usually anywhere between December 20th and 23rd in any given year. The Winter Solstice celebration goes on to celebrate Yule (which in the old days wasn't exactly the 25th) and it, like the Solstice had a date that changed every year. "Christmas" was instituted by Christians as a means of converting Pagans to Christianity, while still allowing them to keep some of their holidays, but changing them slightly to fit the beliefs of said "new" religion.No, it was not chosen to entice, it was chosen because the pagan religions pretty much all had a Dec. 25ish holiday. So all the pagans were used to celebrating, we didn't know when Jesus was born, 2+2=4, we have the mass of Christ's birth on Dec. 25.
Everyone posting here has already said WE KNOW it is not a celebration of Jesus' birth. (See my paragraph above)Arguing about my tact, goodness and feelings towards other Christians who are registered with this forum doesn't change the fact that the whole Christmas tradition is a fabrication and not a celebration of the Messiah's birth.
You should be caring for others year round not just around Christmas and the feeling of being blessed is also a year round affair. Why wait for a day that someone says is the right day to practice being a Christian when the people in the scriptures waited for no such date themselves. You and your family are commendable for your fortitude and compassion.Doc said:Shame on me? You think I only enjoy Christmas because it is simply fun for me? I don't love Jesus for the presents I get. I love him for the gift greater than shiny presants and paper. It is the gift of my life and family. Not about the fat man bringing chocolate down the chimney. Christmas means for me to not only recognize how blessed I am, but to try to reach out to those that do not share the same happiness. My dad and I met a very poor bi-polar mother of 4 on the street last week and we have agreed to help her through the cold months this winter. Offer her warm clothing and hope and peace for her and her children.
What do you find so harmful in that. Am I spreading lies and propoganda. Polluting everyone's mind with twisted words and deceit because I only wish to help them? You call yourself a believer. What do you believe in then?
That does, however, presuppose that you know the correct path and that the other person doesn't. I'm not saying that this may not be true, I'm just noting that no one is trying to argue that Christ's birthday was on the 25th, that Christmas was not originally a Pagan holiday, and that no one on this forum that worships the Christian God is distracted enough by twinkly lights and shiny gifts to detract or suggest detracting any attention from God, Jesus, or the Holy Spirit.t3gah said:There is a scripture that says that if one knows the correct path and that his brother is on the wrong path and you know it but don't correct them, you are as guilty as they are for doing the wrong thing because you didn't save them.
I hope I was not arguing about your goodness or feelings. I never question the inherent goodness of anyone. And as for the fact that I wasn't trying to argue with, as Circle One says below:t3gah said:Arguing about my tact, goodness and feelings towards other Christians who are registered with this forum doesn't change the fact that the whole Christmas tradition is a fabrication and not a celebration of the Messiah's birth.
Everyone posting here has already said WE KNOW it is not a celebration of Jesus' birth. (See my paragraph above)
Thus Easter is, too?t3gah said:... Since almighty God nor his son make mention of the details of Christmas, it's an agent of evil...
Are there disciples of Christmas? I've heard of many people being converted to Judeo-Christian religions because of attending Christmas worship services, but never vice versa. (I am not being sarcastic in saying that. This matter is truly confusing and alarming me.) And some who participate in Christmas or Yule aren't hoping or wanting to get into the Kingdom of the Heavens.t3gah said:Not to make disciples of the Christmas celebration of gift giving which by the way won't get you into the Kingdom of the heavens.
One might remember that these pagans weren't being given a choice in the matter. They were being told they would have to convert to Christianity or be killed. It was the Church that decided to have Christmas, as a way to make this new religion more easily accessible to these people. Please don't attack their memory by blaming something they were getting persecuted by on them.Not some pagan's that decided to spruce up Christian livelyhood because they wanted to bring them something new and ungodly.
Luke 2.20: "And the shepherds returned, glorifying and praising God for all they had heard and seen, as it had been told them."We should look to the scriptures for the answers.
Do you have knowledge I don't know of, the Bible gives no number so it could very well be three, or 500, we don't know.Magi astrologers (and the number of them is not three)
The Lord did not meantion, T'V, the computer, airplanes, cars, lightbulbs, radios, cameras, pepsi, bicycles, cds, the printing press, helicopters, ect. ect. the list could go on longer than I want to imagine, I guess every one of these is an agent of evil created to lure people away from the messiah Jesus Christ and the Lord... or not.Since almighty God nor his son make mention of the details of Christmas, it's an agent of evil that the contrivance of men has created to lure people away
This is the most rediculous statement I have read in a long time, No one makes disciples(that I know of) of the Christmas Celebration.Not to make disciples of the Christmas celebration
I said 25ish Also Mithraism, a pagan religion, I believe celebrated Mithra's birth on Dec. 25.The Winter Solstice celebration goes on to celebrate Yule (which in the old days wasn't exactly the 25th) and it, like the Solstice had a date that changed every year.
True.You should be caring for others year round not just around Christmas and the feeling of being blessed is also a year round affair.
True.The "gift of giving" shouldn't be restricted to one day a year... the gift of sharing shouldn't be on one day a year.... What about the rest of the year?
Singing in celebration of Christ being born is bad? "Silent Night, Holy Night" is a bad song? "Hark, the Herald Angel" sings is a bad song? "O, Come All Ye Faithful", a bad song?caroling
Pagans did not bring Christmas to Christianity, Christianity chose the day of celebration of Jesus's birth to help the conversion process, It compromises nothing in the faith, and if it does both those(helps with conversions, and doesn't compromise the faith) then it is a good thing, not bad.Not some pagan's that decided to spruce up Christian livelyhood because they wanted to bring them something new and ungodly
No we say, we are pretty sure that it is not Jesus's real birth day, we(Christians) DO celebrate Jesus's birth on this day.Everyone posting here has already said WE KNOW it is not a celebration of Jesus' birth. (See my paragraph above
Ah, and so your copy of the bible reads thus:t3gah said:Satan seduced Eve and Adam to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and bad because he offered them power of knowing over doing the right thing. Making up excuses to defend the reason to turn a blind eye to the lies of the whole Christmas thing is falling for a trap that Satan started being the 'father of the lie' and all...
Look, at the risk of being told off, I just have to say the following...in small words of one syllable so you understand: GET A LIFE.t3gah said:The kettle thing is hilarious! Oh yeah, my sides are bursting out!
There is a scripture that says that if one knows the correct path and that his brother is on the wrong path and you know it but don't correct them, you are as guilty as they are for doing the wrong thing because you didn't save them.
Arguing about my tact, goodness and feelings towards other Christians who are registered with this forum doesn't change the fact that the whole Christmas tradition is a fabrication and not a celebration of the Messiah's birth.
Everyone that celebrates it with the notion that the Magi astrologers (and the number of them is not three) were an example for people to create the whole "Christ Mass" (Christmas). To supply gifts like that was a set tradition to royalty. All the Jews did this but to royalty only. This is all because Jesus wasn't born on the 25th of December of the Gregorian calendar because no such date of his birth exists. Not the day, month or year. And by the way, the Jews were using the Hebrew calendar which consists of 360 days and one entire month of 30 days added when the stars and moon aligned themselves. A calendar that almighty God created and instituted. So the Catholic's calendar is way off with their use of the Gregorian calendar! Since almighty God nor his son make mention of the details of Christmas, it's an agent of evil that the contrivance of men has created to lure people away from the real goal of the Messiah and that was to alert people about God's Kingdom, God's name, God's way for salvation, Jesus' role in the entire plan, to have others make disciples to make other disciples. Not to make disciples of the Christmas celebration of gift giving which by the way won't get you into the Kingdom of the heavens.
More to follow....:162: it's time for dinner.