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Christmas & Santa are agents of evil sent by Satan the Devil

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by t3gah, Dec 19, 2004.

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  1. Yes. It is ok to celebrate Christmas or Christ Mass

    22 vote(s)
    57.9%
  2. No. It is NOT ok to celebrate Christmas or Christ Mass

    4 vote(s)
    10.5%
  3. I'm not sure

    1 vote(s)
    2.6%
  4. Who cares?!

    11 vote(s)
    28.9%
  1. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    For once someone agreed with me that Satan was the one that tempted Adam and Eve.

    Anyways, so therfore, the celeberation of Christmas is a Satanic one? Which the CHristians tried to cover up?
     
  2. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe we should nail down exactly what these lies are...

    Is it that Jesus' birthday wasn't really Dec. 25? Is that the lie? You know, I really don't think it's that big a deal.

    And boy did he ever deliver! Wow, that Satan! You don't need any insurance on his promises, because that boy's gotcha covered! We could all learn from his example...
     
  3. Doc

    Doc Space Chief

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    Santa Claus or Saint Nicholas as I think he was distributed presents sometime around the celebration of Christ's birth. He gave nice toys and things to good children he knew and coal, sticks, and switches to bad children.
    Christmas originated in the gift of the Magi, the three wise men bringing gifts to the king Jesus. What do you find so bad one day of the year, where people don't care about their jobs or how much money they have that day. Is it so bad one day of the year for people to give gifts to one another without expecting so much in return back. Is it so bad for people to give many of their gifts to the homeless and poor as I know people who have. To make people feel like some cares about them. Bah Humbug to you, Scrooge! Merry Christmas!
     
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  4. SoulTYPE

    SoulTYPE Well-Known Member

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    But did not Christmas also resemble God giving us the "gift" of Jesus, Doc?
     
  5. t3gah

    t3gah Well-Known Member

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    Nope, it doesn't because you are not Santa are you? :jiggy:
     
  6. t3gah

    t3gah Well-Known Member

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    The whole point about this is that it's a complete fabrication. There is no date of the Jesus' birth in the Bible or any other document of the period. The whole giving thing was done to entice people to consider being a Christian. The whole part about being a true son of God wasn't enough for those who created Christmas because they were false prophets and false leaders. Then twisting words around to fit the fun and caring around the tradition that Christmas has is just like the twisting of the scriptures that Satan did with Adam and Eve and with Jesus in Matthew 4:1-10.

    Are you saying you'd prefer to propagate the lie and have fun over being truthful and Christian?

    Shame, shame, shame on you!

    (the tin foil thing was funny, btw... maybe it will be part of the tradition of Christmas in the future :woohoo:)
     
  7. Feathers in Hair

    Feathers in Hair World's Tallest Hobbit

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    I really don't think that twisting words around to use them to fit your purposes is something that you should be condemning others for.

    No, wait, I didn't phrase that very well. I tend to err on the side of not offending people, but that's just my nature. I should rephrase it 'I don't think that you, t3gah, should try to condemn them for doing this, at least until you look at yourself and recognize that you are currently an instrument used for making tea inferring that an instrument for cooking in is charred in nature.' (Translation: pot, meet kettle!) The true believers on this forum have gone a long way to reminding me that the majority of Christians are kind, gentle souls who follow the teachings of Christ. If you continue in this vein, I feel you will be doing them a great disservice.
     
  8. Circle_One

    Circle_One Well-Known Member

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    *Snickers* Very nice extension of a short analogy.
     
  9. Doc

    Doc Space Chief

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    Shame on me? You think I only enjoy Christmas because it is simply fun for me? I don't love Jesus for the presents I get. I love him for the gift greater than shiny presants and paper. It is the gift of my life and family. Not about the fat man bringing chocolate down the chimney. Christmas means for me to not only recognize how blessed I am, but to try to reach out to those that do not share the same happiness. My dad and I met a very poor bi-polar mother of 4 on the street last week and we have agreed to help her through the cold months this winter. Offer her warm clothing and hope and peace for her and her children.
    What do you find so harmful in that. Am I spreading lies and propoganda. Polluting everyone's mind with twisted words and deceit because I only wish to help them? You call yourself a believer. What do you believe in then?
     
  10. Master Vigil

    Master Vigil Well-Known Member

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    "The whole point about this is that it's a complete fabrication."

    I'd like to take this time and remind people that the bible in itself may also be a complete fabrication. So to say santa is satan is truth based on a book that has very little truth value makes your argument almost not worth refuting against.
     
  11. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    I just read through Isaiah 63, could you point me out where it condemns the celebrating on December 25?

    I think the Santa/flying reindeer thing.

    I don't believe anyone says that Jesus was born on Dec. 25.

    No, it was not chosen to entice, it was chosen because the pagan religions pretty much all had a Dec. 25ish holiday. So all the pagans were used to celebrating, we didn't know when Jesus was born, 2+2=4, we have the mass of Christ's birth on Dec. 25.

    Me, if I have children will not lie to them, I will never say that a rotund guy with a beard in a red suit came flying in a sleigh pulled by reindeer to give them gifts.
     
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  12. t3gah

    t3gah Well-Known Member

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    The kettle thing is hilarious! Oh yeah, my sides are bursting out!

    There is a scripture that says that if one knows the correct path and that his brother is on the wrong path and you know it but don't correct them, you are as guilty as they are for doing the wrong thing because you didn't save them.

    Arguing about my tact, goodness and feelings towards other Christians who are registered with this forum doesn't change the fact that the whole Christmas tradition is a fabrication and not a celebration of the Messiah's birth.

    Everyone that celebrates it with the notion that the Magi astrologers (and the number of them is not three) were an example for people to create the whole "Christ Mass" (Christmas). To supply gifts like that was a set tradition to royalty. All the Jews did this but to royalty only. This is all because Jesus wasn't born on the 25th of December of the Gregorian calendar because no such date of his birth exists. Not the day, month or year. And by the way, the Jews were using the Hebrew calendar which consists of 360 days and one entire month of 30 days added when the stars and moon aligned themselves. A calendar that almighty God created and instituted. So the Catholic's calendar is way off with their use of the Gregorian calendar! Since almighty God nor his son make mention of the details of Christmas, it's an agent of evil that the contrivance of men has created to lure people away from the real goal of the Messiah and that was to alert people about God's Kingdom, God's name, God's way for salvation, Jesus' role in the entire plan, to have others make disciples to make other disciples. Not to make disciples of the Christmas celebration of gift giving which by the way won't get you into the Kingdom of the heavens.

    More to follow....:162: it's time for dinner.
     
  13. Circle_One

    Circle_One Well-Known Member

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    We Pagans celebrate the Winter Solstice (as we have for many, many years), and that falls usually anywhere between December 20th and 23rd in any given year. The Winter Solstice celebration goes on to celebrate Yule (which in the old days wasn't exactly the 25th) and it, like the Solstice had a date that changed every year. "Christmas" was instituted by Christians as a means of converting Pagans to Christianity, while still allowing them to keep some of their holidays, but changing them slightly to fit the beliefs of said "new" religion.

    Everyone posting here has already said WE KNOW it is not a celebration of Jesus' birth. (See my paragraph above)
     
  14. t3gah

    t3gah Well-Known Member

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    You should be caring for others year round not just around Christmas and the feeling of being blessed is also a year round affair. Why wait for a day that someone says is the right day to practice being a Christian when the people in the scriptures waited for no such date themselves. You and your family are commendable for your fortitude and compassion.

    The "gift of giving" shouldn't be restricted to one day a year... the gift of sharing shouldn't be on one day a year.... What about the rest of the year?

    There's the lie about Santa (St. Nicolaus), flying reindeer, elves, North Pole, coming down the chimney, cookies and milk for Santa, Rudolf and an illuminated red nose, saying its a blessing because people become more considerate during the Christmas holiday season, mistle toe over the doorway, yule logs, caroling, card giving, bells for angels, the star atop of a pine tree, etc.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas

    I believe in the principles laid out in the scriptures. What the apostles did. How the disciples lived following the words that Jesus laid down. Not some pagan's that decided to spruce up Christian livelyhood because they wanted to bring them something new and ungodly. God had prophets write down to not mix with the unbelievers and take up their ways. I believe what God has penned in the holy scriptures, both Hebrew & Greek text (Bible).:rolleyes:
     
  15. Feathers in Hair

    Feathers in Hair World's Tallest Hobbit

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    That does, however, presuppose that you know the correct path and that the other person doesn't. I'm not saying that this may not be true, I'm just noting that no one is trying to argue that Christ's birthday was on the 25th, that Christmas was not originally a Pagan holiday, and that no one on this forum that worships the Christian God is distracted enough by twinkly lights and shiny gifts to detract or suggest detracting any attention from God, Jesus, or the Holy Spirit.

    I hope I was not arguing about your goodness or feelings. I never question the inherent goodness of anyone. And as for the fact that I wasn't trying to argue with, as Circle One says below:

    Thus Easter is, too?

    Are there disciples of Christmas? I've heard of many people being converted to Judeo-Christian religions because of attending Christmas worship services, but never vice versa. (I am not being sarcastic in saying that. This matter is truly confusing and alarming me.) And some who participate in Christmas or Yule aren't hoping or wanting to get into the Kingdom of the Heavens.

    Similarly,

    One might remember that these pagans weren't being given a choice in the matter. They were being told they would have to convert to Christianity or be killed. It was the Church that decided to have Christmas, as a way to make this new religion more easily accessible to these people. Please don't attack their memory by blaming something they were getting persecuted by on them.
     
  16. Runt

    Runt Well-Known Member

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    Luke 2.20: "And the shepherds returned, glorifying and praising God for all they had heard and seen, as it had been told them."

    It appears that within scripture there is a celebration of the birth of Jesus documented after all...
     
  17. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    Do you have knowledge I don't know of, the Bible gives no number so it could very well be three, or 500, we don't know.

    The Lord did not meantion, T'V, the computer, airplanes, cars, lightbulbs, radios, cameras, pepsi, bicycles, cds, the printing press, helicopters, ect. ect. the list could go on longer than I want to imagine, I guess every one of these is an agent of evil created to lure people away from the messiah Jesus Christ and the Lord... or not.

    This is the most rediculous statement I have read in a long time, No one makes disciples(that I know of) of the Christmas Celebration.

    You know what would be great, if Jesus was born on the day that would be Dec. 25 of the Gregorian calendar.

    I said 25ish :p Also Mithraism, a pagan religion, I believe celebrated Mithra's birth on Dec. 25.

    True.

    True.

    Singing in celebration of Christ being born is bad? "Silent Night, Holy Night" is a bad song? "Hark, the Herald Angel" sings is a bad song? "O, Come All Ye Faithful", a bad song?

    Pagans did not bring Christmas to Christianity, Christianity chose the day of celebration of Jesus's birth to help the conversion process, It compromises nothing in the faith, and if it does both those(helps with conversions, and doesn't compromise the faith) then it is a good thing, not bad.
     
  18. Mister Emu

    Mister Emu Emu Extraordinaire
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    No we say, we are pretty sure that it is not Jesus's real birth day, we(Christians) DO celebrate Jesus's birth on this day.
     
  19. Quoth The Raven

    Quoth The Raven Half Arsed Muse

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    Ah, and so your copy of the bible reads thus:

    Genesis 3:1 Now Santa was more subtle than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not hang baubles from every tree of the garden?
    Genesis 3:2 And the woman said unto Santa, We may hang glass imitations of the fruit of the trees of the garden; and perhaps artfully place some tinsel, thus:
    Genesis 3:4 And Santa said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die, but place wrapped boxes under said trees, containing puppies and other gifts of a nominated value:
    Genesis 3:13 And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, That Santa beguiled me, and I did wrap presents.
    Genesis 3:14 And the LORD God said unto Santa, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon a sleigh shalt thou go, and milk and cookies - with the occasional shot of alcohol of some description for variety- shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:



    Satan/Santa...never seen in the same place at the same time.
     
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  20. Quoth The Raven

    Quoth The Raven Half Arsed Muse

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    Look, at the risk of being told off, I just have to say the following...in small words of one syllable so you understand: GET A LIFE.
    You sound like a person who has no hope of getting anyChristmas presents trying to make the people who will get them feel guilty about that fact.
    December 25th we assume may not be Christs real birthday...ever heard of the Queens Birthday Holiday? Here in Victoria, Australia, we get a holiday on June 10th every year to celebrate the birthday of our beloved constitutional monarch. Guess what:it's not her real birthday! Ban it! Ban it now, before it corrupts the earth with its corrupt corruptness!
    Who gives a toss about the calendar that was in use at the time? Whatever it was, I can assure you it wasn't invented by some supreme being. People need a tool to measure the passing of the days; the infinite does not.
    Or did Moses come down from the mountain not only with a set of laws by which a man should live his life, but also a lovely commemorative calendar with a picture of a kitten in a boot on it?
     
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