Why I detest the JW

[savagewind]

For Media | National Blood Authority

Watch the video......it wasn't me who said it......it was the specialists in the field of transfusion medicine.

It wasn't said like you said it was said.

4:45 you can see the professor (not doctor) say, "probably".
I think that anyone in the medical profession knows that medicines which are given incorrectly cause the greatest adverse clinical outcomes.

 

[ChristineM]

Well, in that case best put up signs to warn intended visitors of your confrontational and aggressive nature. Best commence your security at boundaries of property, and invest in decent access control system, rather than penny pinch on your loss prevention, thus resulting in hysterical rants on front door and unnecessary chasing around grounds.


Receive who you wish at your home, but save your rants against harmless callers for the real bad-folks, is my suggestion.


Yet I learn a little more, every time we meet.

Sorry, have you not been reading my posts... There is a sign, not my problem if you guys don't read. And again with the hyperbole. You really are a whining one aren't you? Not one have i been aggressive or confrontational. However you have done your best to push the big bang button and failed.

I am not ranting, i am telling how it is, you don't like the facts then you have a choice.

Harmless? Are you crazy? Ive seen jws rip families apart and allow innocent children to die. You want to take this some where else and discuss just how harmless jws are?

You learn? That surprises me.

 

[savagewind]

i

.... carrying more risk of morbidity and death than any other procedure in medicine.

Is there other statistics which prove this? The video didn't prove it. It was only one man, not clinicians, and he said, probably.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

That is just a straight-up lie, Deeje. Blood transfusions have a 0.0008% mortality rate, and a 0.0004% chance of infection. By comparison, JWs die at a 1% higher rate than non-JWs due to complications from bloodless surgery.

Are transfusions overrated? Surgical outcome of Jehovah's Witnesses. - PubMed - NCBI

Keep your beliefs, but deliberately spreading lies is unacceptable.

You do realize that your link is to an article in 1993, 24 years ago?!

Even within the last decade, huge advances have been made in bloodless surgery procedures, making them very safe, even for the elderly.

Were you aware of how old the article is?

 

[Scott C.]

...Mormons might also be into social death sentences for those that leave the group.

I have extended family who left the Mormon Church. No social death sentence. Still family. Lots of love. Respect each other's choices.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

....they (JW’s) preach death and destruction

Then,

They approach you with, 'so what do you think of the condition of the world today?' Or, 'did you know that one day, God is going to make everything good again?'

“Preach death and destruction,” eh? LOL

 

[Hockeycowboy]

....the Studd Hill Full Moon Frolickers

Wow! Sounds like a lively group, lol!!

 

[oldbadger]

Cute! Being shot was what was done, not what wasn't done, but, good try!

I gotta try, Savage. Duty 'n' all.....
The thing is, these self righteous hysterics who grab the 'they kill babies don't they?' posters and wave them high are just freaks imo, because I have never heard of a JW baby dying (where I live) in many many years, but I hear of our NHS wanting to turn off the switches quite often. Our NHS has, in recent years(70's), felt the need to put very severely incapacited and disabled babies on 'Feed on Demand' which will mean death if the baby does not ask for food. Whe one has experienced these dreadful situations first hand one tends to lose the 'I'm so righteous' mindset.

Thank you. It sounds good!

It's only a silly joke, of course. Mt wife is an agnostic and I am a Deist sio neither of us believes in a God that has the slightest interest in human beings above all else. We think the idea is absurd, but that's us.

Honestly, If I could go back in time and change that I got baptized as JW I would not. I mean, oh my goodness! It is the fact that I was a JW which led me here. I wouldn't give up you guys for the world. Also, I get to be annoying everybody about the Bible. Can nobody imagine how much fun that is?

...if I could turn back time....... I'd start again and try not to make so many utterly daft decisions. But I'm glad about some of them.
And yes, you would not be the person that you are had you not walked the walk, every step of the way, through your life.
We are the result of our mistakes and successes.

 

[oldbadger]

From memory (it was back in 1994) these children had terminal conditions (like leukemia) and blood transfusions were routinely administered to patients, not to save their lives but to prolong them marginally in association with chemotherapy. All of the children in that article went before a judge and personally testified to their own conviction that consuming blood was against the law of God and that it was their personal conviction to refuse that therapy.

They had no fear of death because each of them knew that there was nothing medically that could be done to save them. More treatments that made them sicker and only prolonged their suffering was not something they, or their parents wanted to endure. Adults can make those determinations for themselves, but children are at the mercy of the medical system.

What the poster failed to determine is that the children of Jehovah's Witnesses are legally taken out of their care if medical authorities deem that a certain treatment is in the best interests of minor patients. Legally forced treatments can then be administered against the parent's wishes and indeed against the child's express wishes.
One of the young girls testified that administering a blood transfusion against her will was virtually the same as rape.

In each case the judge deemed that the child was sincere in their own conscientious beliefs and could stand before him and express those beliefs without their parents being present. The children all died because their conditions were terminal, not because they refused a transfusion.

A little more information and a lot less prejudice would make people take notice of what many in the medical profession already know....blood is tantamount to a liquid organ transplant. As with any foreign substance administered to a body, it throws the immune system into immediate action to fight off the invader. Blood is not a drug.....it is living tissue that is going to interact with other living tissue in a foreign body. Our immune system is the only thing between us and death and transfusion has the immune system fighting the foreign invader rather than helping fight the disease.

Blind prejudice is never a good platform from which to launch an attack. Misinformation is what is being disseminated here.

What people also fail to consider is the financial interests of the blood industry. It is a multi-million dollar cash cow which its administrators are not in a hurry to lose. Propaganda makes sure that people's fears are put to rest despite the medical authorities stating that there is 'increased morbidity and mortality attached to blood transfusion medicine than any other procedure'.

If you were offered a procedure that had increased morbidity (made patients' conditions worse) and mortality (death) how could anyone choose it without being deceived as to a likely outcome.

Please watch this video from the National Blood Authority in Australia. (link below) See what happens when a blood transfusion is administered as opposed to when a saline solution is used as a volume expander.
Listen to what these clinicians have to say who are experts in their field. How anyone can say that blood transfusions are safe is beyond me. The medical establishment has this under the banner of "still saving lives" and yet the information in the video says the opposite. I wonder why? To any logical thinking person, the risks far outweigh the benefits as these doctors clearly state.

For Media | National Blood Authority

Thank you again OB for defending us as brilliantly as you do. It is rare to find someone who has no malice towards someone just because you disagree with them or their beliefs.

Thankyou very much for the care and time that you took to show the true background of those cases.

And 'yes', I understand that in most Western countries the legal system has the power to step forward and take control of infants where it has judged such actions as in the best interests of the infant.

In my opinion, one very accurate way of judging a person's character is how they greet visitors. I don't care if it's a charity worker, salesperson, evangelist, official, neighbour or anybody else, everybodywho knocks upon our door will receive visitor-care.

In my experience, people who mistreat visitors with rudeness, threats, aggression, violence, contention or self righteous fury have got a problem, and the kindest 'thing' that I can do for them is to introduce them to themselves. Hence my aggression towards them.

 

[oldbadger]

Wow! Sounds like a lively group, lol!!

...just a silly joke. Honest!
Thankyou for your 'likes' etc.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

For Media | National Blood Authority

Watch the video......it wasn't me who said it......it was the specialists in the field of transfusion medicine.

I've already seen that video, Deeje - it does not say that blood transfusions have "more risk of morbidity and death than any other procedure in medicine".

 

[Hockeycowboy]

neither of us believes in a God that has the slightest interest in human beings above all else. We think the idea is absurd, but that's us.

I think, one day soon, you and your wife will be pleasantly surprised! I look forward to meeting you then.

I really thank you and am amazed at your support for us. Because, as you know, we teach that God does care, very much....there's just some issues that have to be settled, without God interfering right now. For you to view "that idea" as "absurd", and yet staunchly defending us, on a very sensitive subject...... that is so rare.....I'm at a loss for words!!


Take care, my cousin.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

You do realize that your link is to an article in 1993, 24 years ago?!

Even within the last decade, huge advances have been made in bloodless surgery procedures, making them very safe, even for the elderly.

Were you aware of how old the article is?

Do you have a more recent study we can use?

 

[Deeje]

Ive seen jws rip families apart and allow innocent children to die. You want to take this some where else and discuss just how harmless jws are?

Good grief! Are you for real?

What dreadful people we are, wanting to spend our time making sure our families are strong and secure by actually trying our best to stay faithful to our marriage mates and raising our children to be honest, law-abiding citizens who care about others. Such criminals we are!

You've seen what? Or have you merely heard second hand, one sided sob stories.....?

I sure am glad not to have you as my judge.

 

[Faithofchristian]

The JW [***staff edit***] is a very nasty one and has caused a lot of unnecessary suffering by forbidding blood transfusions. Our adopted Down's Syndrome son, of Greek-Cypriot origin, was 16 months old when he needed a blood transfusion to save his life, as he has blood condition, which is rare here in the UK. A couple of days after he had the transfusion two JWs turned up on our doorstep. Normally I would say, 'No thank you', as I shut the door, but that day I challenged them. I told them our lovely boy would be dead if he hadn't the transfusion, they said he would have been better off dead rather than having blood from a donor! As you can imagine my response was less than polite as I chased them off our property!

Our son is now 32, and whilst he is quite severe learning difficulties he is the most wonderful person you could wish to meet, and loved by everyone who knows him. My husband, myself, our birth daughters and grandchildren are thrilled to have him in our lives.

Is it any wonder why JWs are labeled as a cult.
If you have the means to save a life, God is not against that. Even Christ said those who are sick are in need of a physician.

Christ is our example, Christ came healing the sick and blind. Are we to do any less,No,
We are to do what we can for the sick and blind. As Christ Jesus did.
So I guess according to the JWs, They would curse Christ for healing the sick and blind?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Do you have a more recent study we can use?

Article from Feb., 2016:
"The research also found that Witnesses who underwent bloodless surgeries spent less time in the intensive care unit and less time in the hospital when compared to patients who had transfusions. They also had a higher survival rate at 95 percent, compared to the other group at 89 percent."
Excerpt from Doctors explore benefits of "bloodless" surgery - CBS News

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From an 2013 article:
"Recently, doctors from the Cleveland Clinic in Ohio reported that Jehovah’s Witnesses who refused blood transfusions while undergoing cardiac surgery were significantly less likely to need another operation for bleeding compared with non-Witnesses who were transfused. They were also less likely to suffer a post-op heart attack or kidney failure."
From 'Bloodless' surgery option reveals unexpected benefits

/////////////////////

Advantages of Bloodless Medicine

(This is a 15-minute audio...about 7 minutes in, the Dr / Director discusses some of her breakthrough procedures, even using them on those willing to take blood.)

There are other related articles, anyone can Google under "Bloodless Medicine "

The reason we adhere to this choice, is, not for health reasons (although there seems to be many), but for the issue of obedience. -- Acts of the Apostles 15:28-29 "necessary things"; Genesis 9:6.

Hope you have a good day!

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Article from Feb., 2016:
"The research also found that Witnesses who underwent bloodless surgeries spent less time in the intensive care unit and less time in the hospital when compared to patients who had transfusions. They also had a higher survival rate at 95 percent, compared to the other group at 89 percent."
Excerpt from Doctors explore benefits of "bloodless" surgery - CBS News

//////////////////

From an 2013 article:
"Recently, doctors from the Cleveland Clinic in Ohio reported that Jehovah’s Witnesses who refused blood transfusions while undergoing cardiac surgery were significantly less likely to need another operation for bleeding compared with non-Witnesses who were transfused. They were also less likely to suffer a post-op heart attack or kidney failure."
From 'Bloodless' surgery option reveals unexpected benefits

/////////////////////

Advantages of Bloodless Medicine

(This is a 15-minute audio...about 7 minutes in, the Dr / Director discusses some of her breakthrough procedures, even using them on those willing to take blood.)

There are other related articles, anyone can Google under "Bloodless Medicine "

The reason we adhere to this choice, is, not for health reasons (although there seems to be many), but for the issue of obedience. -- Acts of the Apostles 15:28-29 "necessary things"; Genesis 9:6.

Hope you have a good day!

Thanks for the info - I'll do some more digging.

 

[savagewind]

I've already seen that video, Deeje - it does not say that blood transfusions have "more risk of morbidity and death than any other procedure in medicine".

It actually did. But, the one man said, "probably". It is at about the 4:45 mark, I think. I posted it.

 

[ChristineM]

Good grief! Are you for real?

What dreadful people we are, wanting to spend our time making sure our families are strong and secure by actually trying our best to stay faithful to our marriage mates and raising our children to be honest, law-abiding citizens who care about others. Such criminals we are!

You've seen what? Or have you merely heard second hand, one sided sob stories.....?

I sure am glad not to have you as my judge.

That's fine if the whole family wants to be involved in your faith. My friends family did not, only the mother chose to become a jw. It caused the breakup of the family so don't give me that family values bs. A family is a unit and takes family decisions, it is not a dictatorship ruled from a kingdom hall.

Yes i've seen, are you calling me a liar? If so state your reasons.

 

[oldbadger]

Is it any wonder why JWs are labeled as a cult.

Because you don't like them?
A bit prejudiced, maybe?

If you have the means to save a life, God is not against that. Even Christ said those who are sick are in need of a physician.

I thought he told all in need to come to him?

Christ is our example, Christ came healing the sick and blind. Are we to do any less,No,
We are to do what we can for the sick and blind. As Christ Jesus did.

I don't think so.
Most Christian Creeds that I know of engage in wars, military actions and aggression.

Now the JWs do not, will not, have not..... killed.

So I guess according to the JWs, They would curse Christ for healing the sick and blind?

You see that? I reckon that this is how unnacceptable bigotry gets going.
At first you make a stupid and insulting guess, and as the sentence is repeated the 'guess' is removed.

Not good. Not....Christian, really.