Who do you believe Jesus was/is?

[Revasser]

I went for "Jesus may have existed, but the details of his life have been distorted/overblown by Christianity."

Jesus/Jeheshua/Yeshua may well have existed, or the character may be based (loosely or otherwise) on a single person or even multiple people that were around at the time but, for myself, I invest no particular significance in him aside from the fact that there are some decent ideas about how to treat your fellow human beings attributed to him.

That said, I have no problem with the myth of him being the son of a god (in a Heraklesian manner) or even an avatar of a god walking around on Earth. History is littered with such myths with different people taking different myths to heart. But I do see the stories of his divinity and such strictly as myths.

Myths aren't "false" or "lies", but they aren't "fact" either. It's actually a little difficult to explain the way I see myths, but there you go, anyways. That's how I feel about Jesus.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Believe what you wish - the 'evidence' is precisely what one might expect if confonted by a fabrication.

 

[Peace]

I voted for the third option. I believe that Jesus peace be upon him was a Messenger and Prophet of God.

Peace

 

[retrorich]

b. He may have existed, but the details of his life have been distorted/overblown by Christianity.

There may have been a person known as Jesus, or he may be just a fictional character. Since I do not believe that God exists, I do not believe that Jesus could be the son of God.

 

[Green Gaia]

Jesus may have existed, but the details of his life have been distorted/overblown by Christianity

 

[Opethian]

Jesus may have existed, but the details of his life have been distorted/overblown by Christianity

My thoughts about the topic are about the same as Revasser's.

 

[BruceDLimber]

Hi!

>Jesus was a prophet or messenger of God, but not equal to God.

As a Baha'i, I would select this answer.

He was a God-sent Divine Messenger, and as such both spoke for God and could legitimately be called God because He was God's mouthpiece on earth for that Age! But as He Himself stressed, He was not God Himself!

Works for us.

Bruce

 

[michel]

Sheesh, I thought I would be in the minority!

Jesus is God (i.e. the Trinity)

 

[Master Vigil]

I believe Jesus was a man who taught peace, love, and humility. But as with any legend, his story was blown way out of proportion.

 

[robtex]

I would say it is really difficult to pick the option of Jesus possibly existing but details are an object of question considering

1) He never wrote a single word in his lifetime that was ever found, despite being a prophet or messiah.

2) No sketches or drawings were done of him when Paul said he was alive (for 30 years)

3) Jewish writings at the time never talked about a rabbi named Jesus

4) The town of Nazareth has no documentation of his existance there.

5) in the Bible in Corinthians 1 chp 15 versus 6 mentions 500 witness....of which not a single one was ever identified or came forward.

6) Other than the gospel of Thomas, which has been rejected by Christianty no history is ever presented to the existance of Jesus other than his death rebirth and ascention, all of which are not collaborated outside of the Bible and by only one postulated author..Paul. The same man who rejected the notion of Jesus being a messiah until Acts 9:9, which was years after the proposed resurrection.

I am mean this guy is a ghost. I realize it was quite a while back and records of people existance were scarce but people of importance were recorded even in those times, and you figure the person speculated to change all of humanity would even be a higher priority for record keeping purposes. It makes skeptical of his existance.

footnotes:

1) Bible notes from biblegateway.com
2) good footnotes and trailer on Jesus from http://www.thegodmovie.com/
3) The Jesus myth website: http://home.ca.inter.net/oblio/home.htm
4) sacred destinations website for nazareth http://www.sacred-destinations.com/israel/nazareth.htm
5) nazareth travel info: http://www.wordtravels.com/Attractions/Countries/Israel/Attractions/Nazareth/

 

[Feathers in Hair]

I think that he may have existed. Whether he did so or not does not matter to me so much. What he was reported as saying, however, does mean some to me. I just wish that more of the people that claim to worship him would actually bother to practice what he 'preaches'.

 

[Comet]

Sorry, I didn't put that option because I didn't think that many people believed that. I certainly have not heard that view on these forums. Are you a Mandean? Do you believe Jesus was a false prophet? If so, why?

FerventGodSeeker

I am not Mandean, and there are very few of them left. They still exist in certain areas of Iran, but they are secluded and a secretive people. They are considered to be the last surviving Gnostics of old and the origional followers of John the Baptist. By their views it was John the Baptist that was the true messanger of GOD and Jesus was what many today would call the "anti-christ". To them Jesus is the false one, as he was considered false or undivine by many Gnostics of old.
I am not a Christian, though my family tried to raise me to be one. I only believe in the divinity of the one called Jesus, should he have existed, for we are all divine and "sons and daughters" of GOD. I know not how to answer the question you posed, but to say that if he were here today I would not be one of his followers, nor was he any more GOD than any of us.

 

[robtex]

I think that he may have existed. Whether he did so or not does not matter to me so much. What he was reported as saying, however, does mean some to me. I just wish that more of the people that claim to worship him would actually bother to practice what he 'preaches'.

I think his non-evidencable existance creates that problem though. Because he didn't write anything and his princples were never codified other than in abstract stories which may or may not have happened Jesus becomes whatever anyone wants him to be. He is today just a metaphor for a code of morality which is open to interpretation. People read a NT story attach a moral to it and said, "Jesus said" or "Jesus taught". Jesus didn't say (aka write down) anything. His stories, told as analogies create further abstractions that make it important to assess if the stories attributed to him can teach anything at all. There are scores of bibles, and hundreds of different Christian groups percisely because the messages of the new testiment are muddled in presentation. Worshipping Jesus seems to be a difficult point because the messages attributed to him, and never ever written by him, are interpreted in so many different ways.

Let me give you a parallel. In martial arts, we as a community, have information that ranges in time periods to really recent (like gun defense) to thousands of years old. To validify the relevancy and use of the information it is "toyed with" in martial arts practices. The validity of any idea or movement is completely subjective and open to peer evaluation not unlike Christianty. What is different and important, is that technical aspects are drafted out in print or illustrations (or advanced media today) as opposed to presented in abstracted narratives. This gives the information clarity that keeps it presentable century after century. If for instance, instead of having instructions on body movement for thrusting a bo (5 foot stick) we had narratives of some famous fella who used it in self-defense but didn't dictate precisely the body movements neccessary for the movements the info while entertaining would not be useable in a practical, applicable sense. The NT is similar in this aspect because instead of having an organized idea of morality (like most secular philosophy does) it creates stories, which I suspect are works of fiction, without a well defined plot or central idea. The net result can clearly be seen today in two distinct ways

1) No organized code of morals is presented as a product of the NT. The catholic church and others use canon, which is after-writings to the bible, and other groups have supplemental data but a systematic theory of morality is not outlined in the narratives of the NT

2) Interepretation to the high points and theories of the Bible are open to speculation leading to a very diverse populace of people who practice the religion.

In this abstraction Jesus has become a metaphor for morality but as a person, weather real or imagined, cannot be a morality, the ideas attributed to morality are speculated on the side and than assigned to Jesus. In this say Jesus is the chrisitan metaphor for morality but the question becomes what attributes are assigned to Jesus by his followers and why is it so hard for this faith, which is at this point, the most diverse in the world (hinduism likely being second), to come to a common concensus?

 

[Super Universe]

How is it that humans decide that a man is a false prophet when this prophet teaches the word of God?

Would you turn your back on the truth even if it comes from a source you do not like?

Is the package more important than the gift?

Jesus is a true Son of God. Created to descend from heaven and assume a leadership role of this area of the universe. In this role Jesus must take life experiences so that He will have knowledge of the material beings with which He oversees.

 

[robtex]

How is it that humans decide that a man is a false prophet when this prophet teaches the word of God?

In the same way that humans determined he was the true prophet/son of God. By interpretation.

Would you turn your back on the truth even if it comes from a source you do not like?

There is no information on Jesus. Just some book of abstract stories attributed to him.

Is the package more important than the gift?

Jesus is a true Son of God. Created to descend from heaven and assume a leadership role of this area of the universe. In this role Jesus must take life experiences so that He will have knowledge of the material beings with which He oversees.

If you believe in God, and believe he created everything including you and I, than why would you consider Jesus to be the son of God and not the rest of humanity? Why would an-all powerful God/son need "life experiences"?

 

[Super Universe]

There is no information on Jesus? Google shows 237 million hits. I think there is plenty of information on Jesus.

The bible an abstract book? Perhaps in your view. If you are not touched by the stories then your purpose is not to be touched by it. Then you should go on with your life and look for nothing that is not in front of you, proven with your own eyes.

Jesus is the Son of God created for a specific purpose. Human soul's are created Sons of God as well but they make their own purpose, they can choose where to go and what life form to join with and learn from.

After the death of the material form they can choose to return to God or continue their individual exploration of the universe or participate in universal service. Jesus has a job to do.

Why would an all powerful God's Son need life experiences? Why does a wife read a book on relationships? Isn't she already an expert?

Why does an old ex-football player still watch football? Hasn't he seen it all from the best view?

 

[Comet]

Were we not all created with purpose?

If you believe in Jesus, I say more power to you. If you do not, I should say the same thing. Some need a life vest to swim, while others have learned how to already. Should you take the life vest of one who cannot swim? NO.

Straight to the source, GOD itself by your own relationship with GOD. Just because one of us undstands GOD in one way does not mean that any other will. Therefore it is by all our rights to follow, condemn, or ignore Jesus. As you said, we choose. Is a path back to GOD by Jesus more valuable or any less effective than a path back that does not invovle him? It does depend on what is in front of your eyes, not all see the same...... or maybe I am in the wrong part of the galaxy this go round......

 

[Comet]

How is it that humans decide that a man is a false prophet when this prophet teaches the word of God?

Would you turn your back on the truth even if it comes from a source you do not like?

Is the package more important than the gift?

Jesus is a true Son of God. Created to descend from heaven and assume a leadership role of this area of the universe. In this role Jesus must take life experiences so that He will have knowledge of the material beings with which He oversees.

The God-knowing man describes his spiritual experiences, not to convince unbelievers, but for the edification and mutual satisfaction of believers. - Urantia

GOD and GOD believers, not Jesus believers. Is that not of your ways? or is it to convince non-believers of Jesus of him?

(Hope I am not coming across as rude, I mean not to be)

 

[Katzpur]

How is it that humans decide that a man is a false prophet when this prophet teaches the word of God?

Would you turn your back on the truth even if it comes from a source you do not like?

Is the package more important than the gift?

Believe me, as a Latter-day Saint, I've asked people these questions many times.

 

[Halcyon]

I would say it is really difficult to pick the option of Jesus possibly existing but details are an object of question considering

1) He never wrote a single word in his lifetime that was ever found, despite being a prophet or messiah.

2) No sketches or drawings were done of him when Paul said he was alive (for 30 years)

3) Jewish writings at the time never talked about a rabbi named Jesus

4) The town of Nazareth has no documentation of his existance there.

5) in the Bible in Corinthians 1 chp 15 versus 6 mentions 500 witness....of which not a single one was ever identified or came forward.

6) Other than the gospel of Thomas, which has been rejected by Christianty no history is ever presented to the existance of Jesus other than his death rebirth and ascention, all of which are not collaborated outside of the Bible and by only one postulated author..Paul. The same man who rejected the notion of Jesus being a messiah until Acts 9:9, which was years after the proposed resurrection.

I am mean this guy is a ghost. I realize it was quite a while back and records of people existance were scarce but people of importance were recorded even in those times, and you figure the person speculated to change all of humanity would even be a higher priority for record keeping purposes. It makes skeptical of his existance.

That's interesting rob. Do you know if the case is the same for the Buddha, or are there records of him outside the Buddhist community?