To what extent are Islamic terrorists inspired by Muhammad and the Quran?

[sooda]

QuranX.com The most complete Quran / Hadith / Tafsir collection available!
Sahih al-Bukhari - Wikipedia

Bukhari was from Persia 200 years after the death of Muhammed.

This may be helpful.

Age of Aisha (ra) at time of marriage - muslim.org
https://muslim.org/islam/aisha-age.htm

 

[Shad]

Bukhari was from Persia 200 years after the death of Muhammed.

So? Your own source is just as old or post-dates what I have linked. By your argument your counter-point is nullified. Like I said it is just cherry picking based on modern values and views. There is no real method. Just emotions. Embracing X makes me look bad so it must be wrong. Embracing Y makes me look good as it align with modern views thus must be correct. Ad hoc rescue and post hoc rationalizations.

 

[Wasp]

Not according to a Sunni hadith which is considered authentic by Sunni Islam

The Hadith quotes Aisha saying she was 9 years old. But people didn't know their own ages. They didn't have calendars.

Not according to the hadith.

What does does the hadith say then that makes you think that?

Both you just highlight the problem. There is no standard for authenticity. You both just pick what aligns with modern values disregarding past views as it makes you comfortable. Neither of you even questioned the authenticity nor method used.

You haven't quoted the hadiths so I can't go and question the authenticity unless I remember the hadith and its authencity, which I only know about the hadith regarding Aisha. Apostacy, I just know how it is and has been in Islam at all times.

Actually it is historical evidence that brings Aisha's age up to 19-21 and Islamic teaching at all times that talks about apoctacy.

 

[Vaziri]

According to traditions Muhammad experienced His first Revelation from God through the angel Gabriel in the cave of Hira 610 AD. The Quran was revealed over the next two decades. Muhammad taught His people they should turn away from polytheism and be like the Christians and Jews and worship the One True God. This Divine Message was not well received by Muhammad’s people, particularly the Quraysh who arose to destroy Him and His followers. The Muslims fled to Medina, but they were pursued and so had to defend themselves in several battles. Muhammad and the Muslims were ultimately triumphant and went on to unite the tribes of the Arabian Peninsula.

Some of the Quran was composed during war time. Certain verses if taken out of context could be seen as condoning violence. Did the example of Muhammad’s willingness to take up arms when necessary (albeit for self defence) provide inspiration for future generations to take up arms during other times of need?

So with this thread I’d like to explore to what extent Muslim extremists are inspired by the Quran and Muhammad Himself? What about other influences such as the Hadiths, Sira and the early history of Islamic expansion? Are there parallels within Christianity’s expansion and history of violence? How do you see it and why?

Indeed there are verses in every religious scripture that can be taken out of context. Its not so much a person reads Quran on their own and develops these radical and horrible thoughts. Typically there are groups formed and teaching kids at a young age that this violence is ok. The book is no more influential to terrorism than the bible was for Hitler. Its just evil people will always manipulate horrific events as the greater good. The weak mind will fall for anything.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Is there any specific reason why you are replying to me?

It should be clear that I do not agree with your analysis, therefore I do not see the point.


That I file under "lip service", given the exact content.



That is one narrative. Not a particularly convincing one, given the evidence. Quite on the contrary really.


Interestingly, in so doing you deny the self-imposed constraints of Islaam, which is presumably valid to the end of times.

Only saying that I believe the bad spin put on Muslims is completely unjustified and without any merit whatsoever.

A Muslim who obeys the Quran never becomes an extremist or a terrorist because the Quran is diametrically opposed to such things.

 

[sooda]

So? Your own source is just as old or post-dates what I have linked. By your argument your counter-point is nullified. Like I said it is just cherry picking based on modern values and views. There is no real method. Just emotions. Embracing X makes me look bad so it must be wrong. Embracing Y makes me look good as it align with modern views thus must be correct. Ad hoc rescue and post hoc rationalizations.

What does it have to do with emotions?

 

[Augustus]

Which hadith? She was born before the Call.

Here is Muslim professor and author Jonathan AC Brown discussing her age and rejecting the idea that she was older.

 

[sooda]

Here is Muslim professor and author Jonathan AC Brown discussing her age and rejecting the idea that she was older.

https://www.amazon.com/Slavery-Islam-Jonathan-C-Brown/dp/1786076357

Jonathan A.C. Brown is Associate Professor of Islamic Studies and the Alwaleed bin Talal Chair of Islamic Civilization in the School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University. He is also Director of the Alwaleed bin Talal Center for Muslim–Christian Understanding.

 

[sooda]

Here is Muslim professor and author Jonathan AC Brown discussing her age and rejecting the idea that she was older.

Historically Arabs never married girls who had not reached puberty. It was too dangerous for the girls.

Further, up until the 1960s Arabs in Arabia didn't know when they were born.

 

[sooda]

Apparently Johnathan AC Brown converted to Islam when he was 20.

Jonathan A. C. Brown - Wikipedia

 

[Wasp]

Further, up until the 1960s Arabs in Arabia didn't know when they were born.

That's a bit difficult to believe. Source?

I don't know who they married before but I wish they'd stop marrying little children now.

 

[Wasp]

Here is Muslim professor and author Jonathan AC Brown discussing her age and rejecting the idea that she was older.

And?

 

[sooda]

That's a bit difficult to believe. Source?

I don't know who they married before but I wish they'd stop marrying little children now.

I lived there for 20 years. Not only didn't they know what year they were born, but if you asked an Arab man how many children he had, he might say 5 sons but he would never say how many daughters he had. In 1940 they had no concept of a work week or of getting paid every week. They had no concept of a work DAY. They would work a few hours, take a nap or wander off the job.

The marriage age for women in KSA has gone up from 17 to 22 in the past 25 years.

I think Johnathan CK Brown is a convert who knows about Islam without having any concept of what life was like in the Gulf States.

 

[Wasp]

I lived there for 20 years. Not only didn't they know what year they were born, but if you asked an Arab man how many children he had, he might say 5 sons but he would never say how many daughters he had. In 1940 they had no concept of a work week or of getting paid every week. They had no concept of a work DAY. They would work a few hours, take a nap or wander off the job.

The marriage age for women in KSA has gone up from 17 to 22 in the past 25 years.

I think Johnathan CK Brown is a convert who knows about Islam without having any concept of what life was like in the Gulf States.

I think he looks like a d*** - haven't watched the video yet.

 

[sooda]

I think he looks like a d*** - haven't watched the video yet.

I think he's pretty cerebral... but probably has no experience on the ground.

 

[Shad]

The Hadith quotes Aisha saying she was 9 years old. But people didn't know their own ages. They didn't have calendars.

Wrong. Look up the lunar calendar. Ramadan uses the Islamic calendar which is a lunar one.
.

What does does the hadith say then that makes you think that?

As it was about execution for leaving the religion.

You haven't quoted the hadiths so I can't go and question the authenticity unless I remember the hadith and its authencity,

No worries. I do not expect you to argue against something I haven't cited.

Apostacy, I just know how it is and has been in Islam at all times.

Assertion.

Actually it is historical evidence that brings Aisha's age up to 19-21 and Islamic teaching at all times that talks about apoctacy.

What evidence? One that is even newer than the one I cited like Sooda linked? One that put forwards no standard itself nor criticism of the contradicting hadith?

 

[Shad]

What does it have to do with emotions?

Well promoting marriage of children with 54 year old men is frowned upon these days. So Muslims have to embrace the idea or find a way to discredit the idea that was authentic until Western values said otherwise.

 

[sooda]

Well promoting marriage of children with 54 year old men is frowned upon these days. So Muslims have to embrace the idea or find a way to discredit the idea that was authentic until Western values said otherwise.

You still don't get it.. They raised animals and used camels and donkeys.. They raised falcons and Salukis.. They didn't marry children.. That's why its so unbelievable that Muhammed married a child. Life was hard as hell.. Most babies died before their second birthday and the maternal mortality rate was high.

 

[Shad]

You still don't get it.. They raised animals and used camels and donkeys.. They raised falcons and Salukis.. They didn't marry children..

Assertion

That's why its so unbelievable that Muhammed married a child. Life was hard as hell.. Most babies died before their second birthday and the maternal mortality rate was high.

Argument from incredibility

 

[sooda]

Assertion



Argument from incredibility

OK.. get on the internet and see if you can find any birthdates on any of Abdulazizz's sons.. All they have is approximations and best guesses.