Should Biden Pardon Trump?

[tytlyf]

So, as of this posting, no charges?

SDNY has a broad investigation going on right now. Covering lot's of things. Tax evasion, money laundering, financial corruption, etc.
If you didn't watch Fox, you'd know that

 

[Revoltingest]

I think it would be political suicide to be a politician responsible for convicting a former president. The government will never accept such a record id wager.

Rage can make people do dysfunctional things.

 

[ecco]

It's fascinating to watch Trump haters frighten themselves
by imagining these extreme scenarios, & treating them as
real. He was to become a dictator like Hitler. He was a
Russian agent, implementing Putin's agenda. And now
he'll refuse to leave the White House after losing re-election.
Even mainstream leftish media push these beliefs. None have come true, yet each failed prediction is replaced by a new one.

Paraphrasing...

It's fascinating to watch Trump Sheeples support each other by pretending that their minigod is flawless.​

I doubt many said Trump would "become a dictator like Hitler". Many, including me, said he would like to be a dictator. He's actually much more reminiscent of Mussolini who stated:

Democracy is beautiful in theory; in practice it is a fallacy. You in America will see that some day.
​

One of the first things any wannabe dictator does is denigrate all press that he fears is against him. Trump has done that. He has convinced his Sheeples that only Fox and Breitbart are trustworthy.

Few said he was "a Russian agent, implementing Putin's agenda". Many believed (and believe) that he was pandering to Putin.

Case in point is his refusal to admit that Russia interfered in the 2016 election process. Case in point is his attempt to relax Congressionally imposed sanctions against the Russians for election interfering.

Acknowledging that he denigrated the press like no other President is not a failed prediction, it is a fact. Acknowledging that he denied Russian interference in the 2016 election is not a failed prediction, it is a fact.

Accepting that many Americans support an egomaniacal pathological liar is difficult.

Believing that he may fail to step down voluntarily is indeed a prediction. A dire prediction. We'll see.

 

[Revoltingest]

Yeah, the Donald has a talent to polarize. And for not being "the loyal opposition", he has often steped near and sometimes over the line of consent what should be allowed and possible in a democratic republic. As long as people agree on the rules the other guy is an opponent, but once you leave the agreement, you're the enemy.

The "master negotiator" is indeed a poor negotiator.

 

[Revoltingest]

Paraphrasing...

It's fascinating to watch Trump Sheeples support each other by pretending that their minigod is flawless.​

My Saturday helper is one of those.
Trump is great...fighting the gay marxist & Muslim takeover.
Crazy knows no single party affiliation.

 

[Windwalker]

I think it would be political suicide to be a politician responsible for convicting a former president. The government will never accept such a record id wager.

You mean it would be political suicide for the district attorney and the grand jury who brings charges against him for crimes he committed before office? Are you say the upholding of the laws of this land, is the job of a politician, not the job of the law? When someone gets charged for embezzlement for instance, it has nothing to do with actual crimes committed and the trail of evidence supporting it, but it's purely political instead?

That's quite reminiscent of evolution deniers, claiming evolution is false because scientists hate God.

 

[Twilight Hue]

You mean it would be political suicide for the district attorney and the grand jury who brings charges against him for crimes he committed before office? Are you say the upholding of the laws of this land, is the job of a politician, not the job of the law? When someone gets charged for embezzlement for instance, it has nothing to do with actual crimes committed and the trail of evidence supporting it, but it's purely political instead?

That's quite reminiscent of evolution deniers, claiming evolution is false because scientists hate God.

No I mean the country's ego. To have such a blemish in our history will be too much by way of tarnishing a perfect record of no convictions of a US president. I think the Government will not tolerate such a blemish on a perfect record. That's why Nixon was pardoned as I see it.

 

[Windwalker]

No I mean the country's ego. To have such a blemish in our history will be too much by way of tarnishing a perfect record of no convictions of a US president.

So, law means nothing, so long as you are politically powerful enough. It only means anything if you are poor and unconnected? Maybe if we hold a president accountable, it sends the message America really should hear, which is "nobody, not even the president of United States, is above the law".

I think that would be good for the country's sense of truth and justice. It would show integrity. And integrity is part of a healthy ego. I think ignoring that, throwing the law away for certain powerful individuals actually damages our collective sense of worth and value as a country.

I think the Government will not tolerate such a blemish on a perfect record. That's why Nixon was pardoned as I see it.

It's not up to the politicians. That's why there are three branches of government, not just one. The judicial branch needs to be about the law, not politics.

 

[Twilight Hue]

So, law means nothing, so long as you are politically powerful enough. It only means anything if you are poor and unconnected? Maybe if we hold a president accountable, it sends the message America really should hear, which is "nobody, not even the president of United States, is above the law".

I think that would be good for the country's sense of truth and justice. It would show integrity. And integrity is part of a healthy ego. I think ignoring that, throwing the law away for certain powerful individuals actually damages our collective sense of worth and value as a country.


It's not up to the politicians. That's why there are three branches of government, not just one. The judicial branch needs to be about the law, not politics.

Its just a feeling on how government mentality works. So much of it is ego driven.

I started to view it that way since witnessing the race to put the first man on the moon. The US must be the first and best without blemish come hell or high water.

We can't be a nation with a tarnished presidential lineage.

 

[Daemon Sophic]

I remember some on the right having such paranoid
thoughts about Obama....Muslim agent...planning to
refuse to leave office....becoming dictator.

But the Trump paranoia is far far greater than it was
for Trump, with even mainstream NPR devoting an
entire segment to Trump becoming Hitler.
As for insults....
Survey posts on RF....Trump has endured far more
& far worse than did Obama. The Donald sure is
inspiring that way.

Obama sowed much division...except in the eyes of his fans.
Delusions are always justifiable....but delusions they remain.

Partisans....they amaze me...always getting so wrapped up
in either loving or hating their leaders. I find it useful to
avoid personal feelings. Love & hate policies. It's easier.

That is why I remain non-partisan.

 

[ecco]

That's why Nixon was pardoned as I see it.

He was pardoned for crimes committed while he was President. Trump will be indicted for crimes committed as a private citizen.

 

[ecco]

The US must be the first and best without blemish come hell or high water.

We can't be a nation with a tarnished presidential lineage.

Donald Trump's presidency tarnished the presidential lineage.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Donald Trump's presidency tarnished the presidential lineage.

Yea, but when has a bureaucracy ever acknowledged anything like that.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

So, as of this posting, no charges?

And, as of this posting, no pardon. Guess we’ll see huh?

 

[Windwalker]

Its just a feeling on how government mentality works. So much of it is ego driven.

I started to view it that way since witnessing the race to put the first man on the moon. The US must be the first and best without blemish come hell or high water.

We can't be a nation with a tarnished presidential lineage.

But yet, we impeached him. That is a stain upon his presidency forever. We wanted him removed from office, but the weak-willed Republicans decided to let him slide. This is not a show of defending American pride. It's cowardice to act because of political fears.

That's not how the law works for us, or what Americans expect. American pride, for normal Americans like me, expect some sense of truth and justice to prevail over politics and their compromises with truth. To diminish our integrity, corrodies American pride. If you have to lie to win, you've won nothing.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Thinking ahead to the day the Orange Death Cloud clears over Washington and Biden is president. There are already investigations going on into Trump for many crimes, and they have his previously denied tax returns in hand. Assuming, which is likely safe to do, they will find punishable criminal activities, should Biden pardon the criminal Trump like Ford pardoned Nixon for his far lesser crimes, because he just wanted to move ahead and not deal with the past?

Should Biden do that too, when the day of Trump's reckoning arrives shortly after he gets booted from office? Would it be good for America, or bad for a former president to have to serve prison time for crimes committed before he took office? Or should he be allowed to end his days in a federal prison? Will the orange prison suit go better with Trump's face than the red tie?

The short answer is no. The long answer is nooooo!

If Biden wins (I’m not assuming he will), it would be an enormous distraction to prosecute Trump. It would continue to divide us even further.

However, with Nixon, he was going to be impeached and removed from office on a bipartisan basis. So, there was bipartisan acknowledgment that what Nixon did, was gravely wrong and can’t happen again.

That is not at all the case with Trump. That’s why pardoning him would be the wrong choice - it will leave the issue unsettled going forward.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

It's fascinating to watch Trump haters frighten themselves
by imagining these extreme scenarios, & treating them as
real. He was to become a dictator like Hitler. He was a
Russian agent, implementing Putin's agenda. And now
he'll refuse to leave the White House after losing re-election.
Even mainstream leftish media push these beliefs. None
have come true, yet each failed prediction is replaced by
a new one.
It reminds me of religions predicting some armageddon.
Faith is never defeated by failure because there's always
another horrible prognostication waiting in the wings.
It's a kind of team building exercise.

I’ve been saying since he was elected, I sure hope our country doesn’t face some unexpected crisis while he’s in office.

Boy, was I right.

 

[BSM1]

SDNY has a broad investigation going on right now. Covering lot's of things. Tax evasion, money laundering, financial corruption, etc.
If you didn't watch Fox, you'd know that

So, up to this posting, what charges?

 

[BSM1]

And, as of this posting, no pardon. Guess we’ll see huh?

Most people realize you have to be charged with something to be pardon from said charge....

 

[Windwalker]

I’ve been saying since he was elected, I sure hope our country doesn’t face some unexpected crisis while he’s in office.

Boy, was I right.

Same here. But this brings to light in a most unequivacable way, just how unfit for the office he is.

I was just saying last night to someone, any other president in history, including W. Bush, I would feel a whole lot more safe. Not with this guy. It has nothing to do with politics, but basic leadership - as well as basic humanity; both of which he sorely lacks. He is incapable of basic empathy with others, and it is always, without fail, about himself only. Hence, he is unfit for office during a time when we need a leader to pull us together. All he knows is division and attention seeking. Not the right guy for now.