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One atheist’s idea on how to prevent evil

Koldo

Koldo

Outstanding Member
Trailblazer said:
Why do you think God could prevent it?
Why do you think God should prevent it?
Oh, because God is omnipotent so God can do anything.
That is just not reality. God did not set the world up so He could intervene and prevent all suffering.
Humans are responsible to prevent their own suffering when they can and if they can't that's the breaks.

It is always God's fault isn't it? ...
Only it isn't.
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I don't quite understand where you are coming from. If I saw a children suffering all alone, should I help ease that suffering ? If yes, why shouldn't God do the same ?

If God set up the world in a manner where he wouldn't reduce suffering even though he could, he doesn't get a free moral pass for doing so. He is as much responsible for the suffering that occurs as a parent that just watches his children suffering and does nothing about it. Can you explain why this comparison wouldn't be applicable in your view ?
 
Koldo

Koldo

Outstanding Member
Trailblazer said:
There is not some magic wand God can wave because He is omnipotent.
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But that is literally how the word omnipotence is used. You just mentally use a magic wand and that's it. It is done. That's the way the term had been used for centuries and it's not like atheists were the ones that came up with that.

I would like you to consider the ontological argument from Anselm ( which is an argument to infer God's existence ) for instance where God is referred as 'a being than which nothing greater can be conceived'. If God doesn't have some sort of in-built magic wand then he is not the greatest being in, terms of power, that could exist which would make him not the God that Anselm was talking about.
 
Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Trailblazer said:
Do you mean God would have made us all good with no ability to do anything bad?
In that case we would just be robots with no free will to choose.
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That's wrong.
We don't have wings, so we don't have the choice to flap them & fly.
We don't have gills, so we don't have the choice to breathe underwater & live there.
Clearly, there are choices unavailable to us, but that doesn't negate free will.
So if we don't have evil desires, we only lack the choice to do evil.
We can still make choices from among the many good things available.
 
LuisDantas

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Trailblazer said:
I agree, but all I have to work with is what this atheist says.
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And your own premises.

I do not see how that limits God.
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If you say so. Still, the contradiction is self-evident.

I fully agree. That is the solution to evil, but I can't make this atheist see that. He thinks evil is god's responsibility because god (if he exists) is omnipotent.
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Nope. You are confused. He is only confused to the extent that he tries to humor your premises.

I may be mistaken, but from seeing the opening post of this thread and how you chose to name the thread itself I have to wonder if you have even noticed that this atheist that you exchanged messages with was not proposing a solution for any real problem other than the use of a self-contradictory conception of divine power.

He was not presenting a solution for anything, just pointing out a flaw in your premises and proposed model.
 
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L

LightofTruth

Well-Known Member
Koldo said:
So he died to save himself from death...
That... really needs major explanation. I hope you see it. I really do.
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It's very simple. Jesus was a mortal man when he was born of Mary. He was mortal because all man is mortal. The reason man is mortal is because of Adam's sin. Death passed to all man because he sinned in Adam.
 
Koldo

Koldo

Outstanding Member
LightofTruth said:
It's very simple. Jesus was a mortal man when he was born of Mary. He was mortal because all man is mortal. The reason man is mortal is because of Adam's sin. Death passed to all man because he sinned in Adam.
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Not enough explaining. How does someone save oneself from death by dying ? Error. Error. Reboot system.
 
Road Less Traveled

Road Less Traveled

Active Member
Trailblazer said:
No, God did not do the evil so God is not responsible for the evil.
God is purely good. Man is responsible for all the evil in the world.
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If I were an evil god, I’d love nothing more than for my created pawns to blame each other for evil and turn a blind eye to me. Rather, my obedient servants would be defending me at all costs and blaming each other, fighting with and arguing with each other while they are deluded into thinking that they are doing something good.
 
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Curious George

Curious George

Veteran Member
Erebus said:
"Evil exists because God wanted us to have free will" doesn't work if God is omnipotent. To illustrate:

Let's assume that having both an absence of evil and the presence of free will is impossible. That's the approach usually taken here.
God is omnipotent and can therefore do anything.
Doing anything means being able to do the impossible.
Therefore an omnipotent God can have both the absence of evil and the presence of free will.


If God chooses not to use his omnipotence to create such a state, you have a few options available:

He might want evil to exist. If that's the case then God is not wholly good. He may in fact be evil.
He's unaware that evil exists. Seems odd for an omnipotent being but it's not impossible.

This is the problem of evil in a nutshell. The absolute easiest way to get around it is to remove one of the following traits from your concept of God: omnipotence, omniscience or omnibenevolence.
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Ehh, i would say it is easy to remove "evil" also in the post you have outlined.
 
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