John William Draper, a contemporary of Darwin, called it the "Mohammadan Theory of Evolution..!!!

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Before beginning my post I want to say that I used to engage in lots of debates with the atheists. Indeed I used to read the atheists writings in order to reply to them…reading the atheists writings made me more firm in my belief in God!

However, after all of these years I came into a realization that people don't disbelieve in God because of lack of evidences. So I almost stopped debating atheists..

I didn't get any further in your post than this, because if what you wrote above is what you've gleaned from reading "the atheist writings," then clearly you are not much of a reader. As an atheist myself, living in society that is mostly made up of atheists like myself, there are only two real bases for our disbelief: the lack of evidence for any god as proposed by the world's religions, and the plenitude of evidence against such a god.

For myself, everything I've learned from reading what theists have written during their debates with me, is that they have the most amazing ability to disregard anything, any evidence, however, obviously true, that contradicts their belief. not so much that they ignore the evidence itself, just that they suspend its applicability within the context of their belief system.

This is called, by the way, "cognitive dissonance."

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Before beginning my post I want to say that I used to engage in lots of debates with the atheists. Indeed I used to read the atheists writings in order to reply to them…reading the atheists writings made me more firm in my belief in God!

However, after all of these years I came into a realization that people don't disbelieve in God because of lack of evidences. So I almost stopped debating atheists..

I didn't get any further in your post than this, because if what you wrote above is what you've gleaned from reading "the atheist writings," then clearly you are not much of a reader. As an atheist myself, living in society that is mostly made up of atheists like myself, there are only two real bases for our disbelief: the lack of evidence for any god as proposed by the world's religions, and the plenitude of evidence against such a god.

For myself, everything I've learned from reading what theists have written during their debates with me, is that they have the most amazing ability to disregard anything, any evidence, however, obviously true, that contradicts their belief. not so much that they ignore the evidence itself, just that they suspend its applicability within the context of their belief system.

This is called, by the way, "cognitive dissonance."

 

[Polymath257]

With respect,

Putting What you call "Gods" with the "unicorns" in one Basket, just does not reflect an unbiased approach for searching the truth..

I must say that my reply here is also applied to most of the other posts here that i chose not to reply to.

Yes, actually, it does show a lack of bias. The evidence for all of these is the same: nothing. So an *unbiased* person would treat their existence equally.

 

[Milton Platt]

John William Draper, a contemporary of Darwin, called it the "Mohammadan Theory of Evolution..!!!

Before beginning my post I want to say that I used to engage in lots of debates with the atheists. Indeed I used to read the atheists writings in order to reply to them…reading the atheists writings made me more firm in my belief in God!

You must have poor reading comprehension then.

However, after all of these years I came into a realization that people don't disbelieve in God because of lack of evidences. So I almost stopped debating atheists..

This is incorrect and demonstrates that you have not in fact read writings by atheists. I know, because I am an atheist and lack of evidence is precisely why I do not believe theistic claims.

I must say however, that the society may also influence the people choice to became atheists..

It might persuade them to follow the evidence or lack thereof and to exercise critical thinking, yes.

Anyhow Here is my post for today..Enjoy!

The question of how old atheism is, is attached to the question of how old the Human civilization is..

Atheists have always struggled with the question of the origin of the living creatures..

Not really. That question has nothing to do with atheism itself.

So when Darwin came with his theory of Evolution, they hastily gripped it and thought that finally they found the answer..

No, they accepted the evidence, which has been growing steadily for over 100 years in several branched of science. If theists could provide equally robust evidence for their god, they might have something to talk about.

However, many people didn't not know that evolution theory in general, is centuries old..

And as you will see below, Some ancient Muslims have talked about it and "John William Draper, a contemporary of Darwin, called it the "Mohammadan Theory of Evolution"!

But the evolution theory provide no answers to the question of the creation..

Well, Duh!!!!! That would be abiogenesis.....not evolution.

With evolution, and without evolution an ultimate explanation of this intelligent existence is needed..!

Well, it would be nice. You might stop trying to stuff a god into the cracks between what we know and wait until that crack is filled with evidence based knowledge.

We see that the child evolve in the womb of his mother in 9 months...But who created him/her?!!

The parents???



http://pu.edu.pk/images/journal/uoc/PDF-FILES/(11) Dr. Sultan Shah_86_2.pdf

 

[Shia Islam]

We see that the child evolve in the womb of his mother in 9 months...But who created him/her?!!

The parents???

No comment.

 

[LuisDantas]

No comment.

That is too bad. It really would take some form of comment to rescue the respectability of that question you made.

 

[LukeS]

The closest to evolution in the quran, afaik:

And within the land are neighboring plots and gardens of grapevines and crops and palm trees, [growing] several from a root or otherwise, watered with one water; but We make some of them exceed others in [quality of] fruit. Indeed in that are signs for a people who reason.

Surah Ar-Ra'd [13:4]

 

[HonestJoe]

Although we hold far different views..
Unlike many other respondents here, You responded directly to my post without trying to diverge the subject and hide behind the scientific details that I clearly did not went into..

Well that’s nice of you to say but maybe you’d get more of this kind of reply if you actually responded to the points I made in any way, either acknowledging the flaws in your arguments I highlighted or establishing where our views differ and actively backing up your beliefs and opinions.

The main problem with posts like yours is that it comes across as a simplistic attack on atheists (in the form of a false strawman at that) and that’s the kind of thing that is inevitably going to inspire angry and negative responses. You’d do much better expressing some kind of interest in actually understanding people with different beliefs rather than just assuming and unconditionally condemning. Given the way things are in the world at the moment, you’d expect that kind of attitude would be the last thing a Muslim would want to encourage.

 

[viole]

But the evolution theory provide no answers to the question of the creation..

What creation? You are begging the question.

With evolution, and without evolution an ultimate explanation of this intelligent existence is needed..!

What intelligent existence? You mean God Himself?

We see that the child evolve in the womb of his mother in 9 months...But who created him/her?!!

With evolution is clear. Without it, I would say the same being that aborts it prematurely as in the case of miscarriages. Who else?


Ciao

- viole

 

[Shia Islam]

Hi all,
I must say this..
I have written the OP in a hurry...
So I did not use the terms precisely..
I am sorry if this lead to any confusion..

Looking forward to more participations in this great RF in the future..
We may differ in our views..
However we must respect each others..

And I would like to conclude with a saying by Imam Ali, the man upon whom Muslims are divided into Shiites and Sunnis, as the Shiites say prophet Muhammad has appointed him as his successor based on God's choice, while the Sunnis in general say that the prophet appointed nobody! Now here is what imam Ali said:

"Man is either your brother in faith or your equal in humanity/creation."

All the best

 

[Milton Platt]

John William Draper, a contemporary of Darwin, called it the "Mohammadan Theory of Evolution..!!!

Before beginning my post I want to say that I used to engage in lots of debates with the atheists. Indeed I used to read the atheists writings in order to reply to them…reading the atheists writings made me more firm in my belief in God!

However, after all of these years I came into a realization that people don't disbelieve in God because of lack of evidences. So I almost stopped debating atheists..

You are wrong. This is precisely why people do not accept god claims.

I must say however, that the society may also influence the people choice to became atheists..

The society in which you live influences you. You are just stating the obvious.

Anyhow Here is my post for today..Enjoy!

The question of how old atheism is, is attached to the question of how old the Human civilization is..

Of course, bucause without humans, there is nobody to invent the various gods.

Atheists have always struggled with the question of the origin of the living creatures..

Atheism is the lack of belief in god claims. It has nothing to do with questions about the origin of life.
The theory of evolution does not address the origin of life.That would be abiogenesis, or panspermia, etc.
If you want to discuss the origin of life, you need to address one of those theories.

The theory of evolution does not address the origin of life.That would be abiogenesis, or panspermia, etc.
If you want to discuss the origin of life, you need to address one of those theories.

So when Darwin came with his theory of Evolution, they hastily gripped it and thought that finally they found the answer..

You do not have to believe in the theory of evolution to be an atheist.

However, many people didn't not know that evolution theory in general, is centuries old..

And as you will see below, Some ancient Muslims have talked about it and "John William Draper, a contemporary of Darwin, called it the "Mohammadan Theory of Evolution"!

First, it does not matter what Deaper called it. Second, I could not find this quote anywhere, can you provide the original source or at least provide decent context?

But the evolution theory provide no answers to the question of the creation..

It isn't supposed to. Origin of life is not part of that theory.

With evolution, and without evolution an ultimate explanation of this intelligent existence is needed..!

As stated, evolution does not address the origin of life. It isn't supposed to.

We see that the child evolve in the womb of his mother in 9 months...But who created him/her?!!

A good question. The answer lies in the scientific understanding of how the sperm of the father fertilizes the egg, providing additional genetic material and spuring cellular division. So the "who" would be the father and mother, or the sperm and egg, depending on which level you wished to look at it.



http://pu.edu.pk/images/journal/uoc/PDF-FILES/(11) Dr. Sultan Shah_86_2.pdf

 

[Revoltingest]

.....don't disbelieve in God because of lack of evidences.

No, that's exactly the reason that I & so very many others don't believe.
Id est, if there's no evidence that something exists, then I won't believe it exists.

I must say however, that the society may also influence the people choice to became atheists..

It certainly could influence, but most of us live in countries where religion dominates.

Atheists have always struggled with the question of the origin of the living creatures..

I've never struggled with it.
When some question about life, the universe & everything presents itself,
If I don't have the answer, I'm comfortable with that.
There's no need to leapt to certainty of an easy answer.

So when Darwin came with his theory of Evolution, they hastily gripped it and thought that finally they found the answer..

Was it so "hasty"? How would that be measured, as opposed to "reluctantly".
I don't think so.
His work was extremely wide ranging, thorough, considered & compelling.

But the evolution theory provide no answers to the question of the creation..

A theory needn't answer every question raised.
It speaks to evolution, & only evolution.

With evolution, and without evolution an ultimate explanation of this intelligent existence is needed..!
We see that the child evolve in the womb of his mother in 9 months...But who created him/her?!!

Why presume it's a "who", as opposed to a "what process"?