Why the world must support Macron

[Estro Felino]

I could not possibly vote for anyone who kisses rosaries, and hates LGBT+. Could you?

Ciao

- viole

Well..the thread topic is Macron and the secular State in France.

What did you mean exactly by this statement below?

I also heard he was one of those "poor" immigrants who landed in Lampedusa recently.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Cooky]

Then go back to the places which follows your Sharia thing. You will not be missed.

Ciao

- viole

But we were accepted in as migrants. Now we're part of you forever.

 

[viole]

Well..the thread topic is Macron and the secular State in France.

What did you mean exactly by this statement below?

What I meant is that I oppose to let everyone in. if I could decide, I would return all people to Libya and have the problem solved in one week.

So, the fact that Salvini agrees with me on this one, is not a sufficient condition for me to support a gay hating rosaries kissing bigot.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

What I meant is that I oppose to let everyone in. if I could decide, I would return all people to Libya and have the problem solved in one week.

So, the fact that Salvini agrees with me on this one, is not a sufficient condition for me to support a gay hating rosaries kissing bigot.

Ciao

- viole

I would kick them all out, too, unless they are true refugees whose lives would be endangered (LGBT people, non-Muslims, activists, etc.).

 

[Estro Felino]

What I meant is that I oppose to let everyone in. if I could decide, I would return all people to Libya and have the problem solved in one week.

So, the fact that Salvini agrees with me on this one, is not a sufficient condition for me to support a gay hating rosaries kissing bigot.

Ciao

- viole

I deeply respect that.
Thank you for your intellectual honesty.

 

[MNoBody]

And a Frenchmans freedoms of expression will not dedicated to by violence and terror in his own country

I agree with you, in spirit and in principle.... good luck to all involved, which includes everyone, by extension

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Speaking of Le Pen: French politicians thank Indians for showing solidarity with France in its fight against radical Islam

 

[firedragon]

Why the world must support Emmanuel Macron

Below video is 5 minutes and explains the importance that the world must support Macron. Also contains a short speech in which Macron explains what he plans and why. Religion has been quite prominent in the past centuries, but it seems to dig it's own grave now, and state and religion might get more and more separated in the future

03m10s = 40 second talk given by Macron (starting with 40 sec intro)
* You think the world should support Macron?
* Do the points given in this video make sense to you?
* Could this mean that religion slowly is going to disappear?
* If Religion goes to the background, might there be negative effects?
* Does what Macron wants go against Freedom of Religion?
* Does what Macron wants benefit the Freedom of people?
* Might France be the start of a world wide change?

The whole 05min video below:

Rookie. Very bad scholarship. Very poor understanding of religion.

 

[stvdv]

Rookie. Very bad scholarship. Very poor understanding of religion.

I agree to disagree on this. Macron put it simple and correct. Freedom to blaspheme is the Law in France; Muslims should accept, not complain.

 

[firedragon]

I agree to disagree on this. Macron put it simple and correct. Freedom to blaspheme is the Law in France; Muslims should accept, not complain.

This is a cut and paste from another post, which may not be absolutely relevant but may have some pointers to why your assessment is highly unscholarly and misinformed.

Its great that you read.

But as you probably would agree Sam's scholarship is absolutely poor on this matter. If you study sociology of religion you would see that based on a societies needs they communicate in the protocol of their religion whatever it is. The religion per say does not lead to violence, the people use religion as a protocol to be violent or peaceful depending on their sociological need.

Let me give you an example. There was a terrorist group called the LTTE and they were by far the most dangerous terrorist group in the world. They murdered 180,000 innocent people, invented the suicide jacket, assassinated the prime minister of India with a suicide bombing, almost invade Maldives, etc, etc.

How was this done? The leader and his family who ran this were Christian, adherents were Hindus and Christians, the ideology was Leninist. So Christianity was used, Hinduism was used as protocol for the cause. This is a well researched fact.

But Christianity cannot cause violence or peace. Not Hinduism either. It is the people, and in this case, religion becomes a protocol.

 

[stvdv]

This is a cut and paste from another post, which may not be absolutely relevant but may have some pointers to why your assessment is highly unscholarly and misinformed.

Its great that you read.

But as you probably would agree Sam's scholarship is absolutely poor on this matter. If you study sociology of religion you would see that based on a societies needs they communicate in the protocol of their religion whatever it is. The religion per say does not lead to violence, the people use religion as a protocol to be violent or peaceful depending on their sociological need.

Let me give you an example. There was a terrorist group called the LTTE and they were by far the most dangerous terrorist group in the world. They murdered 180,000 innocent people, invented the suicide jacket, assassinated the prime minister of India with a suicide bombing, almost invade Maldives, etc, etc.

How was this done? The leader and his family who ran this were Christian, adherents were Hindus and Christians, the ideology was Leninist. So Christianity was used, Hinduism was used as protocol for the cause. This is a well researched fact.

But Christianity cannot cause violence or peace. Not Hinduism either. It is the people, and in this case, religion becomes a protocol.

I understand what you try to clarify. The terrorists have nothing to do with Islam Teaching; they abuse and misuse the Teaching. Hence it seems unfair to punish all the Muslims in France by making such strict rules on Islam in France.

But it is not just the terrorists that worry me.

What worries me much more are Muslims like Erdogan and Imran Khan that made such stupid replies after what happened in France. Such replies of leaders of Muslim countries make Islam and Muslims lose all their dignity. And both did the same with the Dutch-nuke threat when Wilders planned a Muhammad cartoon contest. Macron on the other hand, with France being the real victim, acted as a grown up, unlike the 2 Muslim children (Erdogan and Imran Khan).

IF Erdogan and Imran Khan had replied like grown ups and had said something like "We understand the problem that France is facing and we support that they take strong steps to fight Muslim terrorists, although we would of course prefer that Muslims in France are not so much restricted" then I would have had respect. Then they would have shown compassion and empathy. But they showed only anger, while Macron showed compassion and empathy and understood the danger

These Muslims leaders are the bad apples here. And I fully support Macron in his decisions I heard him say in the video.

Note: I personally did write to Wilders to stop this Muhammad drawing contest, as I think it's not Dharmic to anger other people on purpose; I offered him even a better alternative. So your remark that my assessment is highly unscholarly and misinformed, is totally false. Much better and useful if you sent a letter to Erdogan and Imran Khan educating them on human values and common sense.

 

[stvdv]

your assessment is highly unscholarly and misinformed

I do hope that you can see that in all of this:
1) France is the victim of Muslim Terrorist attacks
2) Muslim leaders all over the world SHOULD apologize for what these Muslim terrorists did in name of Allah
3) Instead these leaders start whining and making more threats, that France makes strict rules on Islam in France (for God's sake)
4) Totally absurd that Erdogan and Imran Khan impose their desires on France; esp. given the circumstances; total lack of compassion and empathy

 

[firedragon]

I understand what you try to clarify. The terrorists have nothing to do with Islam Teaching; they abuse and misuse the Teaching. Hence it seems unfair to punish all the Muslims in France by making such strict rules on Islam in France.

But it is not just the terrorists that worry me.

What worries me much more are Muslims like Erdogan and Imran Khan that made such stupid replies after what happened in France. Such replies of leaders of Muslim countries make Islam and Muslims lose all their dignity. And both did the same with the Dutch-nuke threat when Wilders planned a Muhammad cartoon contest. Macron on the other hand, with France being the real victim, acted as a grown up, unlike the 2 Muslim children (Erdogan and Imran Khan).

IF Erdogan and Imran Khan had replied like grown ups and had said something like "We understand the problem that France is facing and we support that they take strong steps to fight Muslim terrorists, although we would of course prefer that Muslims in France are not so much restricted" then I would have had respect. Then they would have shown compassion and empathy. But they showed only anger, while Macron showed compassion and empathy and understood the danger

These Muslims leaders are the bad apples here. And I fully support Macron in his decisions I heard him say in the video.

Note: I personally did write to Wilders to stop this Muhammad drawing contest, as I think it's not Dharmic to anger other people on purpose; I offered him even a better alternative. So your remark that my assessment is highly unscholarly and misinformed, is totally false. Much better and useful if you sent a letter to Erdogan and Imran Khan educating them on human values and common sense.

How is that relevant to your post?

 

[stvdv]

How is that relevant to your post?

How is that not relevant to my post?

 

[firedragon]

I do hope that you can see that in all of this:
1) France is the victim of Muslim Terrorist attacks
2) Muslim leaders all over the world SHOULD apologize for what these Muslim terrorists did in name of Allah
3) Instead these leaders start whining and making more threats, that France makes strict rules on Islam in France (for God's sake)
4) Totally absurd that Erdogan and Imran Khan impose their desires on France; esp. given the circumstances; total lack of compassion and empathy

Mate. How do you know who is orchestrating these attacks? How do you know if its a coordinated "fund raiser" by a group lets say in "syria" or "even DAISH" because either one group is angry with France for bombing them and killing their kids because of a proven false accusation of biological weapon attacks or Daish doing this to create the same response by the French government in order to create a new enemy that some anti French regimes and groups will provide funding?

I am all for freedom of speech and blasphemy should be allowed, but I deny to accept that it is moral to do that. Also, your assessment video is absolutely unscholarly in saying that Macron could have sided with the Muslims and expanded his voter base but she is absolutely wrong because in politics it is a very well known strategy to alienate one group and win more favour from another. This campaign tactic works for anyone. So this is just propaganda that you have gulped down brother. No offence.

No Muslim leader has to go and apologise to this utter stupidity. Muslim leaders must directly condemn any attack on innocent people, that is perfect. But they dont have to apologise like child politicians. One has to make a much bigger situation analysis before making this kind of statement.

Macron, by doing this "Islam shaping" is feeling groups like Daish and alnusra. And this is a great opportunity to go and propagate sentiments like "look, France and the west are against Islamic lives. So give me money to kill them".

The rabbit hole runs deeper.

 

[stvdv]

Mate. How do you know who is orchestrating these attacks? How do you know if its a coordinated "fund raiser" by a group lets say in "syria" or "even DAISH" because either one group is angry with France for bombing them and killing their kids because of a proven false accusation of biological weapon attacks or Daish doing this to create the same response by the French government in order to create a new enemy that some anti French regimes and groups will provide funding?

I am all for freedom of speech and blasphemy should be allowed, but I deny to accept that it is moral to do that. Also, your assessment video is absolutely unscholarly in saying that Macron could have sided with the Muslims and expanded his voter base but she is absolutely wrong because in politics it is a very well known strategy to alienate one group and win more favour from another. This campaign tactic works for anyone. So this is just propaganda that you have gulped down brother. No offence.

No Muslim leader has to go and apologise to this utter stupidity. Muslim leaders must directly condemn any attack on innocent people, that is perfect. But they dont have to apologise like child politicians. One has to make a much bigger situation analysis before making this kind of statement.

Macron, by doing this "Islam shaping" is feeling groups like Daish and alnusra. And this is a great opportunity to go and propagate sentiments like "look, France and the west are against Islamic lives. So give me money to kill them".

The rabbit hole runs deeper.

I did read some conspiracy theories that CIA planned 9/11 attack (for obvious reasons) and I spoke to someone who was serving in the army in Iran, high rank, who told me that America funded Muslim terrorists. Weapons are sold etc. Using common sense, I would be surprised if there was not some or even much truth in it. Kali Yuga is known for lies and corruption; D.T is a good example.

So, in the bigger picture, with Karma and Dharma, I guess France gets what it created. And Holland created some negative Karma in previous centuries too, which we probably have to consume one day.

In Holland many mosques are funded by rich oil Sheikhs, who demand in return that Dutch Muslims use their extremist Koran versions (for free)

So, I am aware that all this goes on.

Still, France has the right to create their own Law, and Muslim leaders imposing Muslim Law on France is absurd. Of course they are free to try, but it looks foolish and hypocritical. Not that Western leaders are not hypocritical of course. Politics is sick in its core per definition.

 

[stvdv]

IMO:
Common sense is lacking in the Muslim world. Luckily this reporter has lots of common sense and is not shy of hiding it fortunately. These self righteous Muslims imposing their religion on France could learn a lot from her. Compassion nor empathy is found in these Muslim leaders. These Muslim leaders seem to encourage Muslim terrorism ignoring the killing while focusing on naughty children drawing Muhammad. They are unable to see the difference between reality and their fantasy. The moment you believe killing is okay when done in name of your God, because you believe your God gets upset when a picture is drawn of Him or His messenger Muhammad, you act crazy (without IMHO). And this can be easily proven; one need not be an Einstein for that.

Prioritizing seems the Muslim issue here. Killing over naughty children drawing a picture for God's sake.

I highlighted 3 parts of the 09:38 long video; Muslims seem blind to see the difference between fighting extremism and be Islamophobic (see 2)

1)Interesting 44sec (04:36-05:20): Muslim leaders exhibiting personal devotion as a show, criticize Macron; tells me enough about their sincerity
2)Interesting 42sec (06:48-07:30): Muslims not outraged about terrorist attacks, only about drawing Muhammad; these are all dangerous fanatics
3)Interesting 40sec (08:46-09:30): Social media is full of rubbish, where to draw the line; just Muhammad or all internet OUT?

The Full (9min38sec) video here:

@stvdvRF

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I clearly see a huge coercion going on nowadays with the virus

That's because it's a pandemic that is deadly. It's not like fighting an ill-defined concept of an enemy in foreign lands with no real plan or exit strategy and using the moment to strip us of significant rights.
Attempts to control a deadly and extremely contagious virus are just not comparable.

 

[Estro Felino]

I did read some conspiracy theories that CIA planned 9/11 attack (for obvious reasons) and I spoke to someone who was serving in the army in Iran, high rank, who told me that America funded Muslim terrorists. Weapons are sold etc. Using common sense, I would be surprised if there was not some or even much truth in it. Kali Yuga is known for lies and corruption; D.T is a good example.

So, in the bigger picture, with Karma and Dharma, I guess France gets what it created. And Holland created some negative Karma in previous centuries too, which we probably have to consume one day.

In Holland many mosques are funded by rich oil Sheikhs, who demand in return that Dutch Muslims use their extremist Koran versions (for free)

So, I am aware that all this goes on.

Still, France has the right to create their own Law, and Muslim leaders imposing Muslim Law on France is absurd. Of course they are free to try, but it looks foolish and hypocritical. Not that Western leaders are not hypocritical of course. Politics is sick in its core per definition.

I think we Europeans did make huge a mistake colonizing Africa and Asia in the previous centuries.
France shouldn't have imposed its own language to those populations.
Because now those populations feel entitled to dictate what France should or shouldn't do.

And btw...now we are the grandchildren of those who made those mistakes. I don't think we ought to pay for their mistakes.

 

[stvdv]

I think we Europeans did make huge a mistake colonizing Africa and Asia in the previous centuries.
France shouldn't have imposed its own language to those populations.
Because now those populations feel entitled to dictate what France should or shouldn't do.

Seeing these thing happening it seems that this Universe is quite fair anyway. No coincidences it looks like. The best we can do, is not make such mistakes again, otherwise we have to reap the consequences in a next life/century. This concept of reincarnation does make sense to me. At least with this I don't have to worry that things are not fair. And even injustice might be justice, when one can see the whole/bigger picture

And btw...now we are the grandchildren of those who made those mistakes. I don't think we ought to pay for their mistakes.

Unless it is our karma, then we have to pay for our mistakes. Probably a mystery we can't unravel.

The Indian explanation of Dharma (righteousness) makes sense. Dharma helps those that follow Dharma, and the opposite is also true. Masters in India are clear that we should not belittle the (non) Faith of others, otherwise you go against Dharma and as a consequence you create negative karma that will bite you in the back.

Maybe we should write Macron that he should not say stupid things like "we have the right to blaspheme". Of course he can blaspheme, but then he should not complain if France gets nuked one day, by someone who has had enough of this belittling act of Macron. I don't say nuking another country is good, I just say that if you hit someone in the face (or trample on their soul) then you should not complain if they hit you back.

Of course you can say "it's wrong to hit me", just don't complain

People abuse Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Religion. These Freedoms are nice, but not when they are abused.