Why religion?

[Bear Wild]

Hmmm....interesting question. Welcome to RF BTW. (Beware of those offering food....it has no substance)

IMO, religion is the creation of man, which became necessary when he invented other gods who were more accommodating to his wants and desires.....and others who were persuaded to follow those gods also desired to worship them, so they created rituals and gatherings to reinforced their collective desire to worship, which I believe is innate in all humans. It’s just that “worship” can take many forms and even unbelievers can perform “devotion” to various things like....sport....entertainment figures....physical training....academic pursuits etc. in a fairly predictable way, so that even non-religious people can do things “religiously” by following the pattern that is so ingrained in human behavior.

When you step back and look at the big picture, humans behave the way they were designed.....it’s just that the original object of their devotion got morphed into a variety of other things.....all the creation of human imagination.

Can’t you see the “idols”.....the “scripture” and the “temples” where they gather? It’s all there....just sometimes called by another name.

First @Deeje you started to make some sense. OMG there must be more to this post. Even though I have learned respect for you I know you are not quite converted to the "truth" yet. So here I am reading the posty over and over again.

So what exactly do you mean "when he invented other gods". I know there is a trick to this one. Can you present it slightly more direct as to who is the "other gods" so I can be reassured about your position here.

Oh and thanks for all those lovely pictures of nature you post.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Is religion important?

It's only as important as we make it.

Why do people follow it?

Everyone needs a hobby.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I do not really believe in Religion, however do believe it is possible to have a relationship with the Christian God of the Bible, and the Lord Jesus Christ by belief and faith on His life, death, and resurrection.

(Some may disagree, and say that it is impossible, or an improbability) ~ You may choose to not believe.

Sounds like you believe in religion, but just want your religion to be seen as special.

 

[Deeje]

Useless? ;-) Haven't you ever been taken over by the beauty and majesty of a mountain when the morning sun's rays start illuminating portions of it? Or marvelled at the force of a tornado when it's destroying everything in it's path? Or the laughter of a content baby?

I think I understand now why you say that your definition of "devotion" might be a little different to other people's....

The dictionary definition is.....
"love, loyalty, or enthusiasm for a person or activity"....You can "love" looking at scenery or hearing a baby laugh, or you can marvel at the power of a storm....but I assume that you are speaking about something other than "devotion" in those descriptions. An object of devotion is usually something living.....something that can reciprocate....though you can be devoted to an activity like a sport, but there is usually a pay-off for you. (We are competitive by nature...some more than others. But "devotion" to those things in many cases is an ego thing....for the success, accolades and trophies etc.)

I could spell out the state but i won't as we are exploring together. Isn't one state that of quietness and another of wonder? And so on?

I don't think that I would call a "state of quietness" or "wonder", "devotion". It doesn't necessarily come under the banner of "devotion".....I think you are describing "admiration" or something inspiring "awe". "Devotion" to me is a whole other thing.

Why would devotion need an object when the nature/quality of it is simply the outpouring?

I don't think that is "devotion".....I believe it is more "admiration"...."respect and warm approval" for something.

 

[TSTS]

but there is usually a pay-off for you.

Yes. That’s exactly what a devotee (popular definition) is looking for when the offer their devotion to an ideological religion/god, or to a son/ friend/ messenger of god. They are seeking the safety and the comfort they think a father/ mother figure will provide. Their devotion is a means of escape from the sorrows of living and their everyday pain. Their devotion is usually for sale, seeking either a palliative or a candy.

I am saying that kind of devotion isn’t true devotion. I am saying, in the moments when the 'human' is AWAY devotion | Origin and meaning of devotion by Online Etymology Dictionary
from himself/herself and away from all self-centered activities whether sublime or mundane, in the quietness and the subsequent wonder of the unknowable -unnameable force/factor we may call “GOD” (if we wish)….in those moments there is an outpouring ( I have used this word earlier) of love towards the unseen and the unknowable, which to me is true devotion. This love will make such a devotee model his/her life in the best interests of the relationship. Naturally and without effort.

However, this unseen and unknowable “GOD” cannot be captured, bound, or enslaved by the devotee’s longings and desires. It’s not a god of ideas and definitions since it’s beyond the confinements of language. There won’t be any holy books or practice manual for this GOD.

 

[Deeje]

First @Deeje you started to make some sense. OMG there must be more to this post. Even though I have learned respect for you I know you are not quite converted to the "truth" yet. So here I am reading the posty over and over again.

I thought it was pretty straight forward actually.

So what exactly do you mean "when he invented other gods". I know there is a trick to this one.

Why is there a trick? Religion is the result of humans manufacturing "gods" for themselves.....ones that don't make demands, or make them feel bad about themselves, usually.....Spiritually minded people will often go "shopping" for a religion that suits their needs....especially if they feel let down by one of them.....or even many of them. Their "gods" are often a reflection of themselves. But even when people aren't spiritually minded, they will still find something to replace "religion" in their lives.....and they go through the motions of their "worship" in a fairly predictable way, as I mentioned. Can you not see this? You can if you step back and view things in a detached way.

Can you present it slightly more direct as to who is the "other gods" so I can be reassured about your position here.

A "god" can be anything you devote time and attention to on a regular basis.....people who are devoted to sports have their "idols" and so do those who "worship" celebrities. They will dress like them, speak like them and emulate them in many ways.
Some will devote much time and attention to physical training, body building and put in time and lots of sweat to achieve a certain level of physical fitness that feeds their self esteem. Your "god" can be yourself.
Food is another thing that people can devote themselves to.....unfortunately, the 'feel good foods' are usually those that lead to obesity.

Oh and thanks for all those lovely pictures of nature you post.

I cannot see those images without an intense need to thank their Creator.

Feast your eyes.....

If you attribute these amazing things to "Mother Nature" then I believe that you are worshipping the wrong parent.

 

[TSTS]

If you attribute these amazing things to "Mother Nature" then I believe that you are worshiping the wrong parent.

I usually never answer to indirect responses, but since you have used my words, i will touch on this a bit. Nature cannot be worshiped in the traditional sense, because nature doesn't have the stability and the safety of an idea or a concept of any GOD. Nature is changing and volatile. IF a person is truly capable of worshiping nature then they will have to be comfortable with a very obvious aspect of nature. That is be comfortable with change, creation, and destruction. Such a person will then not seek the safety and security of any religion, or any other kind of material shield from destruction, change, and demise. Such a person has no need for the crutches of safety and security. Just my 2 cents. Feel free to disregard it,

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Welcome to RF, a Real Friendly forum.

(As long as you avoid the “ID / Evolution” debates! Lol.)

I’m one of Jehovah’s Witnesses, btw.

 

[TSTS]

Welcome to RF, a Real Friendly forum.

(As long as you avoid the “ID / Evolution” debates! Lol.)

I’m one of Jehovah’s Witnesses, btw.

Hello and thanks for introducing yourself.

Debates don't interest me. Definitely not interested in conceptual debates.

 

[Marcion]

Is religion important? Why do people follow it?

No, religion is not important. But spiritual development is. If you don't develop spiritually you might as well be an animal or dead.
There is nothing wrong with religion or atheism, as long as you develop yourself spiritually (in the right direction).

 

[Marcion]

Not kundalini I believe that is tantric tradition. As far as i know Sufism do not practice tantric teaching

Finding the inner being is finding the connection with Allah

The kulakundalini does not discriminate between traditions. If the time has come for your individuality to merge with the Cosmic Mind it will rise towards the Seat of God. You may call it by a different name though according to your tradition. Tantra (like Yoga) is more like a science, it is not bound by any religion or other belief system.

 

[Spirit of Light]

The kulakundalini does not discriminate between traditions. If the time has come for your individuality to merge with the Cosmic Mind it will rise towards the Seat of God. You may call it by a different name though according to your tradition. Tantra (like Yoga) is more like a science, it is not bound by any religion or other belief system.

Yes this is true The energy that arise from within when we elevate on the spiritual "ladder" may be called different words according to where we live and what spiritual teaching we have taken to us.
It was my mistake to say no to the answer about kundalini based of my limited knowledge of kundalini seen from yoga and Tantra.

 

[RestlessSoul]

I cannot dance and don't do alcohol, and most definitely don't do gods.

Other than that... i just don't see me doing any kind of religious ritual.

This was never you then?

 

[Secret Chief]

My cat even thinks he is a god.

"thinks" ?

 

[Secret Chief]

Existence is more like a verb than a noun.

Neat.

 

[Secret Chief]

unverifiable personal claims are part of schizoid disorders, divorced from reality
-------
I was talking about observable reality of the human world in general.

In general? I have an unverifiable personal claim that the greatest piano sonatas are those of Alexander Scriabin. Based on this I'm wondering if I have a schizoid disorder?

 

[MatthewA]

Sounds like you believe in religion, but just want your religion to be seen as special.

There many be certain things done religiously - like read the bible every now and then, maybe pray every now and then,

Religion to me is seen as bondage, and to keep a person in place with no freedom to think for themselves, and the people in the religion that is being taught are stuck, unless they find the answer in Christ Jesus then they will be set free but not everyone desires Christ Jesus, not everyone cares about Christ Jesus, so it is okay if they make the choice to not ever learn about Yeshua which all are given the ability to learn about him just by reading the gospels.

I believe in Jesus Christ and having a relationship with God. (it's the only way to talk to the Christian God of the Bible through faith in Jesus Christ who lived, died, buried, and was risen again).

I do not believe in pointing fingers and telling people they are going to burn in hell if they do not believe what I am saying. (Some people do that religiously).

I also do believe in people having the freedom to choose anything other than Christ Jesus though my belief is that Christ Jesus it the truth, the way, and the life, even if people see no merit, and it just as silly untrue story. ~ However you believe will be up to you.

So yes guess I do believe in Religion ~ Just do not care for it.

 

[ChristineM]

This was never you then?

Close but no cigar

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

There many be certain things done religiously - like read the bible every now and then, maybe pray every now and then,

Religion to me is seen as bondage, and to keep a person in place with no freedom to think for themselves, and the people in the religion that is being taught are stuck, unless they find the answer in Christ Jesus then they will be set free but not everyone desires Christ Jesus, not everyone cares about Christ Jesus, so it is okay if they make the choice to not ever learn about Yeshua which all are given the ability to learn about him just by reading the gospels.

I believe in Jesus Christ and having a relationship with God. (it's the only way to talk to the Christian God of the Bible through faith in Jesus Christ who lived, died, buried, and was risen again).

I do not believe in pointing fingers and telling people they are going to burn in hell if they do not believe what I am saying. (Some people do that religiously).

I also do believe in people having the freedom to choose anything other than Christ Jesus though my belief is that Christ Jesus it the truth, the way, and the life, even if people see no merit, and it just as silly untrue story. ~ However you believe will be up to you.

So yes guess I do believe in Religion ~ Just do not care for it.

You aren't the first person I've heard peddle this distorted idea of what religion is.

A religion is a community of shared belief and practice, usually centered on a god or gods. By my understanding of what a religion is, you certainly belong to one.

I don't understand why you would want to distort what "religion" means, except that:

- I do recognize that it's a way to try to distance your religion from all the others and make it out to be special.

- I realize that you didn't come up with the idea, so I expect you're just repeating what you've heard from others.

 

[RestlessSoul]

You aren't the first person I've heard peddle this distorted idea of what religion is.

A religion is a community of shared belief and practice, usually centered on a god or gods. By my understanding of what a religion is, you certainly belong to one.

I don't understand why you would want to distort what "religion" means, except that:

- I do recognize that it's a way to try to distance your religion from all the others and make it out to be special.

- I realize that you didn't come up with the idea, so I expect you're just repeating what you've heard from others.

You aren’t the first person I’ve heard dictate to others what religion means to them .