Why am I still a bigot?

[The Kilted Heathen]

"a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (such as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance" (Dictionary Online)

Ironically, this is the behavior and M.O. of many on the "Far Left," especially in reaction and opposition to ideologies and opinions that they deem to be worthy of public ire and scorn. Like "racist", "sexist", and "-phobic" before it, "bigot" is quickly becoming just another buzz-word for instant social shame.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

You are not a bigot. It's just that homosexuality is the current issue and no matter what you say, if you disagree with left liberals on their views you are always going to be branded a bigot. Just let it slide.

Hmmm...
Seems that if you get to call them 'sinners' and their opinion on that is never going to change your mind, it's a little rich to suggest people calling anti-homosexuals 'bigots' are merely left liberals spouting about a current issue. Is assigning labels okay or not?

For me, it's far, far simpler than all that, anyway. Just treat people as people.

 

[Katzpur]

When did homosexuality become a behavior?

It isn't, and I thought about that as I posted. When the OP said, "Events are another matter," I interpreted it to mean, "Homosexual events (i.e. sexual intimacy between to people of the same sex) are sinful." My religion teaches that homosexuality itself is not a sin, but acting on the feelings is. Myself, I'm kind of undecided as to where I draw the line. If I were an LDS lesbian, I would probably commit to living a celibate life, but who knows to what extent I'd be successful in my goal. As for other people, I make no judgment. What people do in the privacy of their own homes is none of my business, and condemning them is not my right. To me, "sinning" is "willfully disobeying what one believes God's commandments to be" (if said person believes in God) or "willfully going against what one's own conscience tells him" (if said person does not believe in God). I believe it is only right for us to make determinations regarding our own behavior. The right to make determinations regarding anybody else's behavior is ours only if someone else is being hurt, which is certainly not the case where consensual sex is concerned. And to reiterate, just in case I haven't made my position clear, homosexuality is NOT a behavior. I apologize if my original statement was hurtful to anyone.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

"a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (such as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance" (Dictionary Online)

Ironically, this is the behavior and M.O. of many on the "Far Left," especially in reaction and opposition to ideologies and opinions that they deem to be worthy of public ire and scorn. Like "racist", "sexist", and "-phobic" before it, "bigot" is quickly becoming just another buzz-word for instant social shame.

I find some of the behaviour of the left appalling. But I've also seen increasing attempts by the right...or whatever...to silence criticism by dismissing it as 'fake news' or by positioning it as political correctness gone mad, or whatever.

It's possible to hold a position without being merely a mouthpiece of the 'hysterical' left. I'm at least partially an outsider, but the use of social shaming to silence dissention does not appear unique to either 'side' of the political fence, yet too often people appear blind to their own side's shortcomings in this area.

 

[StarryNightshade]

Gay aspiring Jew here. You don't sound like a bigot. You think it's a sin, but you don't think gays should be discriminated against in housing or jobs? Then guess what? That's perfectly fine.

Frankly, what others personally think of me really is of no importance. As long as the collective "you" don't try to make being gay illegal again or take away legal protections, then I don't care what people believe about my sexuality.

Let me live my life with no interruptions. You should also be given the same.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

Quite true, Lewis, I just find that I have to point out the hypocrisy more so to Leftists because they seem more under the delusion that their way is right, and thus any means and tactics are necessary. But bigotry is still bigotry, and however much one might disagree with a view point (personally I find the OP et al's view on homosexuality to be ridiculous), the fact is that they've got reasons to back up their opinions. They have answers when probed, even if it ends with "god says."

Meanwhile actual bigots have arguments that fall apart when pushed even slightly. Take for instance white supremacist groups like the AFA. Their arguments often reach up to the divine level, yet this even falls apart because our gods have many tribes that inter-married, which flies in the face of their purported supremacy. So they're just racist bigots, tried and true. But someone who, for instance, doesn't like a certain ethnicity - yet doesn't stereotype or discriminate them - because of consistent and lengthy bad experiences with them--not so much a bigot or really a racist. I know that's a different situation than homosexuality, but it was just the first example that sprang to mind.

 

[Rival]

Hmmm...
Seems that if you get to call them 'sinners' and their opinion on that is never going to change your mind, it's a little rich to suggest people calling anti-homosexuals 'bigots' are merely left liberals spouting about a current issue. Is assigning labels okay or not?

For me, it's far, far simpler than all that, anyway. Just treat people as people.

Never thought of it like that. We believe they are sinners, they believe we are bigots. Okay, that's cool.

 

[The magical volleyball]

I am a bisexual hebephile, but I'm not trying to push the idea that it's normal.

I hope you are getting professional help with this, to give into hebephilia would not only be immoral but also illegal.

 

[Rival]

I hope you are getting professional help with this, to give into hebephilia would not only be immoral but also illegal.

No, I'm not. Also I have views on it that I'm not allowed to share here.

 

[roger1440]

By events I mean weddings or other groupings that they may find objectionable. However, I believe anyone (religious, atheist, gay, straight) should be allowed to opt out of events they don't agree with

How is acknowledging sin make them less than human? If anything it's a confirmation that they are human

I believe it's a sin because it doesn't Gods plan. For every man there is a woman. More than that woman was a gift to man, because God loved Adam that much. Like wise Adam was a gift to Eve because He loved her that much. Participating in gay acts is like asking for the receipt.

If I refused to hire someone because of their anti-homosexual views would that be ok?

 

[sun rise]

Quite true, Lewis, I just find that I have to point out the hypocrisy more so to Leftists because they seem more under the delusion that their way is right, and thus any means and tactics are necessary. But bigotry is still bigotry, and however much one might disagree with a view point (personally I find the OP et al's view on homosexuality to be ridiculous), the fact is that they've got reasons to back up their opinions. They have answers when probed, even if it ends with "god says."

Meanwhile actual bigots have arguments that fall apart when pushed even slightly. Take for instance white supremacist groups like the AFA. Their arguments often reach up to the divine level, yet this even falls apart because our gods have many tribes that inter-married, which flies in the face of their purported supremacy. So they're just racist bigots, tried and true. But someone who, for instance, doesn't like a certain ethnicity - yet doesn't stereotype or discriminate them - because of consistent and lengthy bad experiences with them--not so much a bigot or really a racist. I know that's a different situation than homosexuality, but it was just the first example that sprang to mind.

There are to be sure true believers in any position of the political spectrum, it's the way the ego works. But to me the right is way more hypocritical and sure that they are correct.

 

[PureX]

"a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (such as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance" (Dictionary Online)

Ironically, this is the behavior and M.O. of many on the "Far Left," especially in reaction and opposition to ideologies and opinions that they deem to be worthy of public ire and scorn. Like "racist", "sexist", and "-phobic" before it, "bigot" is quickly becoming just another buzz-word for instant social shame.

Or so every bigot will happily assert, and happily believe, regardless of it's credibility.

I have no doubt that there are liberal bigots just as there are conservative bigots, religious bigots, racial bigots, sexual bigots, economic bigots, and every other kind of bigot imaginable. And that every one of them will immediately and happily point to the bigotry of others to avoid having to face the possibility of it within themselves.

 

[Fool]

I think homosexuality is a sin. Nothing will change that. You may say Paul was just saying lustful gays are sinning, but it can also mean it's the same as lust.

However, I don't think it's a reason to discriminate. On an individual basis like housing, jobs, and services. Events are a different matter.

I simply don't hate and call for cooperation. Why am I still a bigot? Are you just trying to feel superior?

the bible in general considers sex a sin.

"'When a man has an emission of semen, he must bathe his whole body with water, and he will be unclean till evening.

unclean = impure = abomination


Proverbs 10:12
Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins.

1 Peter 4:8
And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for love(charity) shall cover the multitude of sins.

 

[Rival]

"'When a man has an emission of semen, he must bathe his whole body with water, and he will be unclean till evening.

This doesn't mean it's a sin. The first mitzvah given to Adam and Eve was to reproduce.

 

[Erebus]

Something I've been mulling over after reading and posting in this thread is whether or not there's a difference between saying, "You have a bigoted perspective" and "You are a bigot."

Take the OP for example (I hope you don't mind). Those views on homosexuality are, in my opinion, bigoted. However, if they're not coupled with action, i.e. attempting to make life more difficult for homosexuals, then it's about as harmless as these things get. To say to the OP, "You are a bigot" seems akin to saying that bigotry is a major component of their personality, something I'm really in no position to judge.

Compare that to former klansman, Tom Metzger. I have no such reservations about saying Tom Metzger is a bigot. He's devoted much of his life to enacting and preaching his bigotry.

I'm more or less just thinking aloud here. "Bigot" to me has more extreme connotations than "bigoted." I don't know if I'm alone in that or not.

 

[fantome profane]

I believe my God has asked us not to use tobacco, alcoholic beverages and tea or coffee, and that if I do so, I am sinning. If I were to tell you that I don't hate (or even slightly dislike) everyone in the world who uses tobacco, alcoholic beverages and tea or coffee, would you tend not to believe me? I certainly hope not!

Yes, but if you get between me an my cup of coffee there is going to be trouble.

I have to say that I am not sure if I understand the OP well enough to say if this the situation between you and coffee is really analogous to his attitude toward people who are homosexual. Is he really describing a position of non-interference? I am not sure.

 

[Deidre]

There are many 'sins' though that the Bible discusses at great length, many of them sexual, and many of them are not exclusive to homosexuals. Why doesn't the religious hetereosexual community get equally upset when adultery is happening, or when heterosexuals are ''fornicating'' outside of marriage? Those seem to be issues that are hushed up, and the main issue for many Christians becomes that of homosexuality.

I tend to view someone as a religious bigot if they feel that their sins are somehow ''not as offensive'' to God, as say ...homosexuality. If one wishes to preach from the Bible, then preach the whole of it, don't avoid those parts that make you uncomfortable in your own ''sin.'' (and not just talking sexually...how about gluttony, lust in one's heart just by looking lustfully at another woman, etc. etc.) I don't see any stories about Christian bakers in the US turning down adulterers who want cakes baked for their weddings, when the two affair partners are getting married. I don't see Christian bakery owners refusing to bake a cake for someone who has a porn addiction. I could go on, but you get my point?

Why are so many Christian obsessed with homosexuality, to the point where they feel that that's the end all be all 'sin' that God hates? ''Take the plank out of your own eye...before taking it out of your brother's eye.'' If one is unwilling to admit that he/she has planks in their eye, that could mean he/she is a bigot.

 

[Rival]

There are many 'sins' though that the Bible discusses at great length, many of them sexual, and many of them are not exclusive to homosexuals. Why doesn't the religious hetereosexual community get equally upset when adultery is happening, or when heterosexuals are ''fornicating'' outside of marriage? Those seem to be issues that are hushed up, and the main issue for many Christians becomes that of homosexuality.

I tend to view someone as a religious bigot if they feel that their sins are somehow ''not as offensive'' to God, as say ...homosexuality. If one wishes to preach from the Bible, then preach the whole of it, don't avoid those parts that make you uncomfortable in your own ''sin.'' (and not just talking sexually...how about gluttony, lust in one's heart just by looking lustfully at another woman, etc. etc.) I don't see any stories about Christian bakers in the US turning down adulterers who want cakes baked for their weddings, when the two affair partners are getting married. I don't see Christian bakery owners refusing to bake a cake for someone who has a porn addiction. I could go on, but you get my point?

Why are so many Christian obsessed with homosexuality, to the point where they feel that that's the end all be all 'sin' that God hates? ''Take the plank out of your own eye...before taking it out of your brother's eye.'' If one is unwilling to admit that he/she has planks in their eye, that could mean he/she is a bigot.

This is just my view:

I am just as devoutly against adultery (fornication is not a sin for Noahides and neither really, afaik, for Jews). Homosexuality is an issue because the LGBT community made it an issue on purpose to change society's views. There is no such thing as the Adultery and Fornication Community marching for the right to cheat. Secondly, a lot of people still hold the view that adultery is morally wrong, religious or not.

Definitely I have sinned, do sin and will sin in future. The point is not never to sin, but to build character and to be on a journey with G-d. Even the most righteous men sinned. We make our teshuva (repentance) in secret, because sin is between the sinner and G-d.

Well simple, most people aren't having adulterous weddings lol. Since bigamy is a crime, the baker would probably be forced to tell the authorities in such an instance. Most people keep their porn viewing habits to themselves and certainly I wouldn't tell the local bakery about my porn habits.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Everyone's a bigot in some way for looking down on this or that person for whatever, so who cares.

 

[Fool]

This doesn't mean it's a sin. The first mitzvah given to Adam and Eve was to reproduce.

having a bowel movement or night emission would make a person unclean

true everything was edible to adam and eve too. then moses changed that too. being creative isn't necessarily sexual

30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.