What’s your main reason for being a theist or an atheist?

[Dawnofhope]

Absence of evidence for God, Soul, and promotion of unscientific views by religions.
Adrian, you cannot bash the atheists. (Moreover, you are a Mod)

I like atheists too much to bash. Besides I believe in non- violence

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Thanks for the thorough response. I like the personal perspective. Having no belief in God is as natural for you as it is for me to be a God believer. That is your experience in life. Unless you have some huge epiphany or personal experience with God, why change?

Throughout my first 20 years of life I fluctuated between Christianity and agnosticism. Like many teenagers I went through long periods where I didn’t think much about God at all. However I didn’t conclude there wasn’t a God.

It didn’t become important to definitively answer questions of a metaphysical nature until my 20s. That led to exploring other religions such as Hinduism, Buddhism and the Baha’i Faith as well as reconnecting with my Christian roots. I had a year where I consciously decided there probably was no God and lived life without prayer. Things didn’t go well but when I turned my attention to God again, life quickly improved. I returned to the Christian church. I also checked out the Buddhists and Baha’is. Eventually I decided to become a Baha’i.

We all have our journey in life and yours makes sense as to why your worldview doesn’t include God.

Thanks for sharing.

I was thinking it could be agnostic. I wasn't familiar with any of the terms until RF, to tell you honestly. Actually, a lot of things I didn't know about until I came on this site.

Sometimes I think what it would be like to believe in god. However, we're so Christianized that it would be hard to think of other ways of seeing god outside of the Abrahamic-mindset. It's so rich in some of our world cultures whether in a good way or bad that even if I were to believe, I wouldn't know where to start. Revelations would need to be specific. Very specific. Most I know or talked with who were atheist or agnostic and now Christian had already been Christian or muslim so have you. It's easy to l earn a language again even when you lost it. It just depends on who you speak to, where you live, and if you use the language again.

I know there are many of people who have big human revelations without attributing it to god. What is in life without god atheists are missing?

Christians would jump up and down (literally and not) to say jesus Christ. What would a Bahai say assuming he doesn't jump up and down?

 

[Dawnofhope]

Is it my imagination or are there a lot of atheists on RF?

 

[Phaedrus]

Is it my imagination or are there a lot of atheists on RF?

Maybe we should do a poll.

 

[ChristineM]

That's true, the most unproven.
God is sure a sneaky one isn't He, hiding out like this all these years.
It's kind of amazing He has any followers at all.

It is, if the guy is so reclusive he must use god magic to entice the gullible

 

[ChristineM]

I haven’t seen any pink unicorns either and don’t expect to soon. In that sense the analogy is a useful one. However most people don’t believe in unicorns whereas most people believe in God or gods. Why do you think that is?

Can i really answer that on RF or would you settle for indoctrination, peer pressure and gullibility.

There is certainly a vast body of literature that examines Theistic beliefs within philosophy. If it was so clear, why are so many philosophers theists?

Philosophical thought? I am mire one for evidence rather than "wouldn't it be nice if"

The problem of a world with suffering and evil is central to Theism vs atheism debates.

Yes, in my view those who argue the side of theism dont seem to have much understanding of the words creator, omniscient and omnipotent.

Ah yes, the God of Abraham whom I worship and adore

It works for you.

I certainly have a different narrative.

Thanks for the post. It’s great to hear all the reasons God can’t and doesn’t exist. It’s exactly what I was hoping for when I started this thread.

Cheers

 

[Mock Turtle]

Is it my imagination or are there a lot of atheists on RF?

Possibly, as mentioned perhaps do a poll, but also they might be more inclined to voice their opinion.

 

[Marcion]

I'm a panentheist. Panentheism goes beyond theism or atheism (two sides of the same coin).

 

[stvdv]

which cannot be verified outside of the individual mind for the concept remains purely that, for the existence of any deity created by the process of fallible man's imagination.

I could call it Atheist's lack of perception

 

[Phaedrus]

I could call it Atheist's lack of perception

Perception would fall under the empirical evidence category.
The fact is, however, that no one has seen god, yet we can all agree on sight what a tree is.

 

[stvdv]

Perception would fall under the empirical evidence category.
The fact is, however, that no one has seen god, yet we can all agree on sight what a tree is.

A person living/seeing 3 dimensions is unable to see the fourth dimension. That is a fact.

Makes no sense to compare "seeing a tree" with "seeing using your third eye"

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

So your evidence is the perception of how the opposing points of view don’t appear convincing?

Not quite.

I do think that theism is unreasonable, especially in the context of religion.

However, I was trying to explore the problems with the idea that I saw you expressing: that there's no evidence - or at least no clear evidence - either way on the issue of God.

This position implies that if God exists, God's existence has no effects on the world that would be irreconcilable with the belief that God doesn't exist at all.

This has major implications for what sort of God we're talking about, but I notice that theists seem to never engage with this issue.

For instance, if you had good support for the claim that some religious scripture was really from God, then that scripture itself would be evidence that God exists. OTOH, if that scripture doesn't work as evidence for God, then this has wider implications for the reliability or provenance of that scripture.

Short version: I just can't fathom why someone who can't say "the atheists are mistaken about God and here's why" would devote themselves to a theistic religion.

 

[crossfire]

I'm a transtheist because I don't find the conceptual dichotomy of theism/atheism as being very useful.

 

[Pudding]

We all believe what we do for some reason. I’m a theist and believe in the God of Abraham. That God I believe is concerned for humanity and for each one of us. Out of His love for us all He’s guided us through His Great Educators such as Christ, Muhammad, the Buddha and Krishna to name a few. What I believe makes perfect sense to me but I can see merit in arguments that would reject such a view. I believe in God because:
1/ It seems rational
2/ It resonates with my experience in life
3/ It works practically.

An atheist could use exactly the same argument of course. I tried atheism for about a year but it was the worst year of my life. Some atheists would probably say the same about their experiences of theism. So I can see how atheism makes sense. It just doesn’t work for me.

Why do you believe what you do? We’re in the religious debates section so feel free to debate. I might too...who knows!? I don’t really like atheist verses theist debates. This could be s first. Let’s see how we go.

I'm an atheist because i haven't been convince to believe at least one deity exists as real being.

Lists of deities - Wikipedia

 

[Vinayaka]

That's close to my own thoughts. My experiences have caused me to accept that there is something beyond the logical mind that people use the word "God" for.

As to theism vs atheism, I don't really care. If I care about anything is what someone does with his or her belief. To me, an atheist who tries to live a life of truth, justice and compassion is closer to the mark than a believer who does not try to put the beliefs into practice.

I don't care about that debate specifically either other than as a psychological study on how folks become hard-wired and narrow minded. Other non-religious topics have the same effect. "I'm right and you're wrong," is still bewildering to me, regardless of the context.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I accept there are difficulties and controversies in defining atheism reflecting in part a spectrum or range of beliefs. It seems best at the outset that each atheist or theist define their beliefs.

It seems simple enough to me. How many gods (as the person understands the term "god") does a person accept as existing in reality?

- if 0, the person is an atheist
- if 1, the person is a monotheist
- if 2 or more, the person is some sort of polytheist

Deism can also have a range of beliefs.

Deism (belief in a non-interventionist creator-god) is just a subset of theism (god belief in general)... though this tends not to sit well with some theists I've encountered.

 

[osgart]

God is a term that represents an ideal life form. I see nothing ideal about how animals exist and have to survive. I do not see any careful planning in how nature is set up. Watching David Attenborough's Planet Earth nature shows, one can see what an impoverished existence this is.

On the flip side i can see that there is a self sustaining intelligence in nature. A lot of the proofs for god's existence prove to me that some kind of eternal intelligence exists. But that natural intelligence has no ideal existence and is impoverished also.

The moral argument is also interesting because virtues and the greatest possible good is conceivable, and worthy in its pursuit.

God falls way short of being God is my final summation.

Pale blue dot is the earth in an incomprehensible vast void we call the universe. Why would God create such an insignificant tree of life that lives in savage senseless conditions? I have yet to hear a reasonable answer for that.

The only thing not savage about nature is what many humans have done and continue to do with technology. They have given us a pretty little world where none existed. And if people dont maintain and improve it then we all fall back into the wild.

Where's God man?

 

[stvdv]

Why do you believe what you do? We’re in the religious debates section so feel free to debate. I might too...who knows!? I don’t really like atheist verses theist debates. This could be s first. Let’s see how we go.

Atheism for me is about what I can experience through my outer senses
Theism is what I can experience through my inner senses.

So, Atheism is true for the experiences in the material world
So, Theism is true for the experiences in the spiritual world

I am experiencing both, so I call myself Theist (deals with both the material world and the spiritual world)

 

[ratiocinator]

Belief in God makes perfect sense to me as all evidence confirms.

What evidence?

But it’s not just a head thing but of the heart.

I don't get that. If we are talking about whether to accept a claim of objective truth, then objective evidence and/or reasoning are needed.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

An atheist could use exactly the same argument of course. I tried atheism for about a year but it was the worst year of my life. Some atheists would probably say the same about their experiences of theism. So I can see how atheism makes sense. It just doesn’t work for me.

I had what sounds like a similar experience from the other side.

I grew up non-religious. In my early teens, I was genuinely surprised when I started enountering people who were genuinely devout believers in God. Until then, I thought it was obvious that the idea wasn't meant to be taken seriously.

In my mid-20s, I got married. My (now ex-) wife had been raised Catholic. As our marriage went on, the fact that I was unbaptized became more and more of an issue for her. It got to the point where she would burst into tears at the thought of me going to Hell.

I started going to church with her to console her. I decided to see if I could find a way to get baptized, which for me meant seeing whether I could accept that God existed, Jesus was genuine, and all the other main teachings of the Church.

I tried for a long time; it never took. In fact, that was my original reason for coming here: I was running into obstacle after obstacle in the way of me accepting what she wanted me to believe, but she either couldn't or wouldn't engage with the issues I was struggling with... including accepting the mere existence of a god. That was actually how I ended up at RF: I was looking for somewhere to discuss these obstacles with a hope that I could overcome them.

And I was miserable that entire time. I felt dishonest. In church, it felt to me like the whole experience was dead... if that makes sense. When I realized that going to church was pushing me farther and farther away from accepting the Catholic faith or even just theism, I stopped going. I recognized that this meant that I would probably never accept it.

As a quasi-compromise, I started exploring other religious traditions, but the only ones I found that I didn't see as ridiculous - probably because neither insisted on belief in a god - were an unprogrammed Quaker congregation and the UUs. The Quakers didn't sit well with my wife and the UUs struck me as benign but kinda pointless, so I didn't continue with either of them.

Overall, my process of exploring religion kinda shattered any assumptions I might have once had about it being well-founded or concerned with truth. These days, the main reason I stay on RF - besides the appeal of bickering over politics - is to try to salvage some sort of respect for religious belief and theism.