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Trump's Second Impeachment: Adoption of the Rules

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic Bully ☿
Premium Member
I've never understood the leftish claims that Trump
& supporters are anti-Jew. His record is very pro-Israel,
eg, moving our embassy, anti-Iran & attacks.

Now, I know that some here will accuse me of defending
Donald. Reading comprehension being in short supply,
I'll clarify....
This is criticism, ie, I oppose both of his actions cited above.
This interesting article from the Times of Israel is from the beginning of Trump's term, when I made a whiney butt thread about his appointing Steve Bannon as one of his top advisors:
Stephen Bannon: 5 things Jews need to know
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
I've never understood the leftish claims that Trump
& supporters are anti-Jew. His record is very pro-Israel,
eg, moving our embassy, anti-Iran & attacks.
His supporters are also conservative Christian, and his behaviors are often anti-Christian.
The Neo-Nazi, Skinhead, Klansmen and such among his supporters are often anti-Semite.
And it could be argued that Trumps pro-Jew record is anti, as it satisfies a perspective that is Christian--which is often anti-Jew--and because this Evangelical crowd who supports stuff like that tend to see it as a means to a [what they believe] literal end. But regardless it wasn't done with Israel or Jews in mind, it was done to further Christianity with his Evangelical Christian voters in mind. Those sort of interferences and getting involved often hasn't went well. Especially for the inhabitants of Israel and Jerusalem (or that area in general).
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Well I can’t really speak to that, being an outsider. The only reason I can tell someone is a MAGA is their outfits are plastered with it. None of the lefty voices I watch have expressed any anti Jewish sentiment. But that’s just my limited experience with them.
It might just be the sites you are getting your information from. No one side has the corner on the market.

Generally speaking, Republicans are pro-Israel. (Not that there aren't Democrats that are pro-Israel)

"The controversy has split the Democratic party and clouded their agenda. The resolution does not mention Omar by name but appears targeted at her recent remarks and their fallout.

This the second time the House voted on a resolution denouncing hate speech following controversial comments by Omar that lawmakers said played into anti-Semitic tropes, although she was not named in either measure."

Minnesota Congresswoman Ignites Debate On Israel And Anti-Semitism

Ocasio-Cortez

Holocaust survivor says Ocasio-Cortez should be 'removed' from Congress for spreading 'anti-Semitism, hatred and stupidity'


Why Democrats embrace antisemitism and anti-Israel bias

Congressional Democrat Rashida Tlaib's Latest Anti-Semitic Remarks | National Review
 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
It might just be the sites you are getting your information from.

"The controversy has split the Democratic party and clouded their agenda. The resolution does not mention Omar by name but appears targeted at her recent remarks and their fallout.

This the second time the House voted on a resolution denouncing hate speech following controversial comments by Omar that lawmakers said played into anti-Semitic tropes, although she was not named in either measure."

Minnesota Congresswoman Ignites Debate On Israel And Anti-Semitism

Ocasio-Cortez

Holocaust survivor says Ocasio-Cortez should be 'removed' from Congress for spreading 'anti-Semitism, hatred and stupidity'


Why Democrats embrace antisemitism and anti-Israel bias

Congressional Democrat Rashida Tlaib's Latest Anti-Semitic Remarks | National Review
Sites? I’m talking livestreams on social media. Sites always have a bias, always. Especially I feel in America. For the real true facts, one should go straight to the horses mouth, so to speak. Cant get much more real than everyday people doing their thing. Trolls notwithstanding

But thank you for the sources
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
His supporters are also conservative Christian, and his behaviors are often anti-Christian.
The Neo-Nazi, Skinhead, Klansmen and such among his supporters are often anti-Semite.
And it could be argued that Trumps pro-Jew record is anti, as it satisfies a perspective that is Christian--which is often anti-Jew--and because this Evangelical crowd who supports stuff like that tend to see it as a means to a [what they believe] literal end. But regardless it wasn't done with Israel or Jews in mind, it was done to further Christianity with his Evangelical Christian voters in mind. Those sort of interferences and getting involved often hasn't went well. Especially for the inhabitants of Israel and Jerusalem (or that area in general).
I'm just going by the many MAGAs I know.
Other people will have their impressions.
But fundie Christians are indeed common among them.
I've oft held forth on that.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
Those things are often said. But I think people are
seeing a few things, & making them writ large with
justification. I know many MAGAs. By & large,
they hate Democrats & commies...not blacks & Jews.

I blame the media. Seems the White Supremacists have become spokesholes for the Republican party. If you watch the news, here's the Republican party storming the Whitehouse. Here's the Republican party attacking Blacks and Jews, etc...

See this enough, over and over on TV and folks start thinking, as Trump supporters this is who they ought to be.

If you want to turn the Republican party to turn back from this path, the news media needs to start showing Republicans in a better light so they can start adopting better role models. :D
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I blame the media. Seems the White Supremacists have become spokesholes for the Republican party. If you watch the news, here's the Republican party storming the Whitehouse. Here's the Republican party attacking Blacks and Jews, etc...

See this enough, over and over on TV and folks start thinking, as Trump supporters this is who they ought to be.

If you want to turn the Republican party to turn back from this path, the news media needs to start showing Republicans in a better light so they can start adopting better role models. :D
We don't ever see statistics about what percentage of Dems
& Pubs are white supremacists, black separatists, arsonists,
looters, Christian nationalists, socialists, & other evil misfits.
So I go by the great many people I meet & discuss issues
with....a warped perspective, I know. But I do get outside of
my liberal community, & spend some time in the backwoods.
I try to avoid letting the extreme elements in crowds color my
general view of groups.....with some success.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Sites? I’m talking livestreams on social media. Sites always have a bias, always. Especially I feel in America. For the real true facts, one should go straight to the horses mouth, so to speak. Cant get much more real than everyday people doing their thing. Trolls notwithstanding

But thank you for the sources

I guess... we could just close our eyes.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Or open them.
When we ignore the what some of the left have done, plaster over all the right what just a few have done, and ignore that the right is more pro-Israel and the left more pro-Palestinian... yes!, someone has to open their eyes.
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
When we ignore the what some of the left have done, plaster over all the right what just a few have done, and ignore that the right is more pro-Israel and the left more pro-Palestinian... yes!, someone has to open their eyes.

So what is better, to be pro Israel or pro Palestinian?
Or are their faults on both sides.?
 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
When we ignore the what some of the left have done, plaster over all the right what just a few have done, and ignore that the right is more pro-Israel and the left more pro-Palestinian... yes!, someone has to open their eyes.
What you guys call “left” is centre left in my country. What you guys call “right” would be seen as super duper conservative in my country.
I feel like I cut a lot of slack to the American right.
But I only can go by what I’ve encountered. On here it’s pretty tame. In the various wilds of the internet? Not so much.
One can only give a pass to not acknowledging “dogwhistles” and actual honest to God self confessed Neo Nazis among your ranks before you start to earn the whole “guilt by association” moniker.

Let me make it clear that this is just an anecdotal experience and outside of RF.

Once you get “Nazis” entering the fray, it’s hard to play the “but both sides” game. At least with me.
Not that you’re responsible for that. I’m just trying to clarify why I hold the position I do
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
So what is better, to be pro Israel or pro Palestinian?
Or are their faults on both sides.?
Another subject. Certainly there has been abuses by Israel but since the basic position of Hamas and Fatah is the elimination of the state of israel... I would be pro-Israel over pro-Palestinian EXCEPT when there are abuses by Israel.

The fact that Israel has conceded again and again to bring peace and there is never peace, actions speak louder than words.
 

tarasan

Well-Known Member
His supporters are also conservative Christian, and his behaviors are often anti-Christian.
The Neo-Nazi, Skinhead, Klansmen and such among his supporters are often anti-Semite.
And it could be argued that Trumps pro-Jew record is anti, as it satisfies a perspective that is Christian--which is often anti-Jew--and because this Evangelical crowd who supports stuff like that tend to see it as a means to a [what they believe] literal end. But regardless it wasn't done with Israel or Jews in mind, it was done to further Christianity with his Evangelical Christian voters in mind. Those sort of interferences and getting involved often hasn't went well. Especially for the inhabitants of Israel and Jerusalem (or that area in general).
Are evangelical Christians in America anti-Jewish? I would say being evangelical and anti-Jewish are mutually exclusive claims. Although it wouldn't be the first time people let their hate trump consistency. From my perspective as a Christian man myself from my own personal experience and having attended Bible college and gotten a degree in theology from what many would consider a evangelical school, I only ever heard a great deal of respect being pointed at the Jewish people. Could this be the case a small minority that yell the loudest? Kinda like the regressive left from the other side of the spectrum?
 
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