firedragon
Veteran Member
One cannot go to the Father without the Son.
But I thought you could, because the trinity is your concept. So according to the trinity, you can obviously go to God directly.
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One cannot go to the Father without the Son.
May I ask why you say the trinity is my concept? Please allow me to say I do not believe that God is a trinity.But I thought you could, because the trinity is your concept. So according to the trinity, you can obviously go to God directly.
May I ask why you say the trinity is my concept? Please allow me to say I do not believe that God is a trinity.
Apparently trinitarians believe that. Thank you for that.Oh, sorry I said your concept.
Yet, according to the Trinitarian concept, you could go to God without going through the son.
Also, please let me add what Jesus said. He said, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." John 14:6.Oh, sorry I said your concept.
Yet, according to the Trinitarian concept, you could go to God without going through the son.
So, let me get this straight: Jesus isn't divine, which means he is human. Those are the choices -- Jesus is either human or divine. There are no other options. Given that you think Jesus is human, please tell me what theological tenet says that human beings can be gatekeepers for God?Also, please let me add what Jesus said. He said, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." John 14:6.
Also, please let me add what Jesus said. He said, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." John 14:6.
So far, that's how I see it. I do not see the trinity teaching complying with any verses in the Bible.In that case, the trinity is not complying with the Bible verse you quoted.
I'll discuss this point now. Jesus knew who he was. He came from heaven.So, let me get this straight: Jesus isn't divine, which means he is human. Those are the choices -- Jesus is either human or divine. There are no other options. Given that you think Jesus is human, please tell me what theological tenet says that human beings can be gatekeepers for God?
So far, that's how I see it. I do not see the trinity teaching complying with any verses in the Bible.
Oh, ok. I think I understand what you are saying. Hopefully we'll learn more about the other's viewpoint as time goes by. I am still learning.Right. So I am not talking about the Bible. I am talking from the Trinity point of view, you can go to God without going through the sun.
IMO, he is of the "essence" of God.There is only one God; therefore Jesus is God.
Yes, and please keep in mind that the words God, god or gods, extends beyond the almighty who has no equal, and it is depending on sense or use of word. Jesus was born to Mary and before he was killed and resurrected, was not God on earth in human form, but reflected the personality of his heavenly father.Right. So I am not talking about the Bible. I am talking from the Trinity point of view, you can go to God without going through the sun.
ICO (In Christ's Opinion) he was the son of God. Jn 3:18IMO, he is of the "essence" of God.
[Essence: "the basic, real, and invariable nature of a thing or its significant individual feature or features" -- Definition of essence | Dictionary.com ]
Yes, and please keep in mind that the words God, god or gods, extends beyond the almighty who has no equal, and it is depending on sense or use of word. Jesus was born to Mary and before he was killed and resurrected, was not God on earth in human form, but reflected the personality of his heavenly father.
Jews in general consider themselves to be "Sons of God", but what is a messianic reference is "Son of Man".ICO (In Christ's Opinion) he was the son of God. Jn 3:18
To be pedantic, Jn 3:18 says "God's one and only Son." The inference is that the other "sons of God" were adopted, but Jesus was "begotten," which is by direct descent. Jesus was begotten at conception. He (the Word) came down from heaven, from the very throne of God, being subject to a "kenosis" (Phil 2:7).Jews in general consider themselves to be "Sons of God", but what is a messianic reference is "Son of Man".
I am my father's son, but he and I are not exactly one and the same, and the same is true in regards to Jesus and God. But it is believed by many that Jesus is of the "essence" of God, which is what the Trinitarian concept basically says-- sorta.
And personally, I really don't get into this except for just discussion's sake.Anyway the point is this: none of this had got anything to do with what Christ taught about himself, or about what the apostles taught about Christ, which is that he was a "man" who died and was resurrected to the right hand of God on God's throne, thence receiving from God "everything that belonged to the Father.