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Statues

Discussion in 'Political Debates' started by WalterTrull, Jul 6, 2020.

  1. WalterTrull

    WalterTrull Godfella

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    So... how far the pendulum? Whose statue is next? I mean: Frederick Douglass ???
     
  2. Koldo

    Koldo Incredible Member

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    I am opposed to vandalism in general, but as long as the proper avenue is taken I am fine with any and all statues being taken down. I really don't understand why people get upset over statues being taken down.
     
    #2 Koldo, Jul 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2020
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  3. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    THREAD MOVED TO POLITICAL DEBATES.
     
  4. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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  5. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    I guess you could call it the great statue War of 2020.
     
  6. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    Statue of Limitations o_O:oops::eek::confused::(
     
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  7. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

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    At this point I'd almost hate to see this monument to Robert E. Lee in Richmond removed. The community has transformed it into something far better than it ever was, originally.

    107636233_10157179286466643_2235846112684669332_o.jpg

    107038168_10157179286501643_1125272088698908092_o.jpg

    106735340_10157179286581643_467859538809064111_o.jpg
     
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  8. WalterTrull

    WalterTrull Godfella

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    Funny. I didn't think this was political. I guess it is. What a shame. I just thought of it sort of... well... mass hysteria.
     
  9. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

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    Those who want to keep the confederate statues on public/government property say it's about History, but when they go after anti slavery statues in retaliation, that tells you what it's really about.
     
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  10. Quintessence

    Quintessence Tale Weaver
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    Not an example of mass hysteria when it isn't a panic-driven response. It's a political action that reflects shifts in cultural norms and power struggles.
    Defacing and removing icons has been done worldwide and throughout history on a routine basis. In all cases, it's about a group exerting their power to erase things they don't agree with. This cultural erasure is used as a weapon to disempower and destroy so something new can take its place. It's very deliberate and intended to convey a message.
     
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  11. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    Both are historical. Im ok with slaves being memorialized as much as any historical figure out there. Personally I think it would be in the best interest for everybody if such things are restricted from government property in light on how people are behaving about things like this and kept on private lands respectively, such as historical and preservation societies.
     
  12. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    I'm reminded of the Berlin Wall decoration as it was torn down.
     
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  13. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Christine's Uncle Fergus
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    Generally, most people don't care about statues they don't care about.
    (Almost sounds like a truism, eh......but it's not.)
    NY's Cuomo liked them coming down....except for one of Columbus.
    Right now, they're pulling down statues of white guys. But what will
    happen when blacks & women offend someone, & get toppled?
    The pendulum might just swing back, eh.
     
  14. epronovost

    epronovost Well-Known Member

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    Well if those black men and women are genocidal tyrants and racist slavers than yes, their statues should be taken down. If Bill Cosby has a statue, maybe someone shouldd remove it, but even comparing Cosby to general Lee (the man not the car in the TV series) is unfair to Cosby. Serial rapist he might be, he wasn't a slaver nor the general commanding an army whose objective was to keep hundreds of thousands of people in bondage. Everybody is offensive to someone, not everybody is a slaver, a rapist, an assassin, a tyrant or a genocidal monster. Let's not make fallacious comparisons or balance fallacies.
     
    #14 epronovost, Jul 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2020
  15. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

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    A giant monument to failure being swallowed up in a sea of individual self-expression. All those humans trying to be heard in a culture ruled by greed and stupidity.
     
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  16. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Christine's Uncle Fergus
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    Historical figures have been criticized for other things,
    eg, Ben Franklin as a womanizer.
    And statues have been toppled for other reasons,
    eg, Columbus for discovering Ameristan.

    Human beings aren't perfect, eg, Martin Luther
    King's cheating on his wife.
    And some will vehemently disagree with people of the past,
    eg, some conservatives hating Margaret Sanger.

    If we're to allow mobs of BLM & liberal types to destroy
    statues they hate, should we allow conservative mobs too?
    Should anti-theists be allowed to wreck religious statues?
    And believers to destroy statues of heathens?
    You still propose no consistent standard....nor who gets to choose
    it or how. If slavers' statues must be destroyed then what of all
    those to G Washington & T Jefferson?

    And still there's the issue of why supposed liberals want to become
    the Taliban, ie, destroying historical statues? By this liberal rationale,
    the Taliban was justified because of strong feelings of hatred towards
    honorifics in other religions.
    Nah....keep the statues....add meaningful commentary to teach about
    the complete history, & our evolving views of it. That's useful.
     
    #16 Revoltingest, Jul 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2020
  17. Windwalker

    Windwalker Integralist
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    You need to educate yourself about this. There is a great deal of information out there about how these Confederate statues were being raised during the Jim Crow area in the South as a way to intimate and suppress the Black populations. They were raised in an effort by the Daughters of the Confederacy to promote the myth of the Lost Cause, that imagined Blacks were happy parts of the White families, and the war was not over slavery at all, which is a big lie of course.

    They need to come down because they are symbols of White Supremacy over Blacks. That's why.

    BTW, this is the nature of iconoclasm during revolts or major changes in society. Statues always get torn down in history whenever major shift like this occur.
     
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  18. Tambourine

    Tambourine Well-Known Member

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    That's beautiful.
     
  19. Wu Wei

    Wu Wei ursus senum severiorum and ex-Bisy Backson

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    I'm guessing Crazy Horse, I'm sure he ticked them off for something

    [​IMG]
     
  20. Eyes to See

    Eyes to See Member

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    This is not a political statement, as I don't take sides in politics. But this is a personal sentiment. I've never viewed statues as appropriate. I never could for the life of me understand why someone would want to have one erected in their honor, or in another person's honor. All honor and praise and glory go to Jehovah God.

    I don't celebrate my birthday. When once asked by the director at work why I turned down the opportunity for the workplace to put a big whoop-dee-doo together for my birthday I simply replied, I am not that important. I would rather people focus on praising God, and not focusing attention on me. I am not worthy, or important enough. I feel the same way about everyone else. No need to make statues to honor another sinful human like me.

    Now that they are there, it is dishonorable for vandals to be damaging them.

    That word vandal. It's actually a term that comes from the fierce Germanic tribes known as the Vandals that swept down into Rome during its decline and looted the city, vandalizing it over and over.
     
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