Senator Rand Paul Sues Obama Administration

[Alceste]

Does Rand share the same anti-gay, anti-women, and anti-science stance that most of his fellow republicans hold? Those are deal breakers for me.

He believes women should not have the right to decide whether to become parents and when (opposes abortion even in cases of rape and incest). That's a deal breaker for single young women - the specific demographic most responsible for handing Obama the last election on a platter.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Dr. Paul is much more Libertarian than Republican. He does not vote lockstep with Republicans and thinks for himself.

No candidate is going to think exactly the way we would like, but if he was President, it would not be business as usual military complex theology of the past.

I'm not so sure anyone could say that about Hillary.

I would consider it if he doesn't adopt the same "I have a phone and a pen" ideology when it comes to women's reproductive rights, minority rights, and queer rights.

It would be business as usual when it comes to misogynistic and homophobic theologies of the past. And so my vote would not go to him. It may not affect straight white men, but a Rand presidency would definitely affect me.

 

[Revoltingest]

I would consider it if he doesn't adopt the same "I have a phone and a pen" ideology when it comes to women's reproductive rights, minority rights, and queer rights.

It would be business as usual when it comes to misogynistic and homophobic theologies of the past. And so my vote would not go to him. It may not affect straight white men, but a Rand presidency would definitely affect me.

Picking on straight guys & white guys again, eh?

 

[Father Heathen]

It may not affect straight white men,

In a roundabout way it does, because If one right/freedom is jeopardized, any other right/freedom could easily be next on the chopping block as well. It is in self interest and mutual benefit to defend each other's freedoms, even if particular ones don't necessarily effect us directly.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Picking on straight guys & white guys again, eh?

It's how I roll. Anyone who says that a woman should not ever have an abortion even in cases of incest, rape, and in some cases of a woman's life in danger, I view with a healthy level of mistrust if they have the power to enforce such a law that reflects it.

He also doesn't support the Civil Rights Act from 1964.

No thanks. I'm looking elsewhere.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

In a roundabout way it does, because If one right/freedom is jeopardized, any other right/freedom could easily be next on the chopping block as well. It is in self interest and mutual benefit to defend each other's freedoms, even if particular ones don't necessarily effect us directly.

That's a good point, FH. I was being rather tongue-in-cheek.

 

[LuisDantas]

It is not about Obama or Hillary being saviors.

It is about nothing better being offered by the GOP, nor the Tea Party.

I would love to be convinced otherwise, but Rand Paul is not going to cut it, apparently.

 

[Reverend Rick]

I would love to be convinced otherwise, but Rand Paul is not going to cut it, apparently.

If you mean he is not going to cut it with Liberals and left leaning moderates, I agree. He is a Republican after all.

For some reason I don't believe women and gays have anything to fear from Paul. He has to feed some red meat to the party and all, but as President I think his agenda is more focused on fixing the economy and balancing the budget than taking anyone's rights away.

Hillary on the other hand is going to attempt to take as many guns away from us as humanly possible. I know that makes you happy Luis, but there will be a backlash just like last time.

If she is sucessful, you can bet it will set back Democrats going to Washington for a decade or more just like last time there was Clinton gun laws the GWB repealed.

After that CCW in this country went off the charts.

 

[LuisDantas]

If you mean he is not going to cut it with Liberals and left leaning moderates, I agree. He is a Republican after all.

You make it sound like some sort of prejudice. I hope I am mistaken.

For better or worse, Republicans have fairly consistent positions from what I can tell. It just turns out that I don't think a lot of them are very defensable.

That, I feel, tells a lot more about the Party than it tells about me. I suppose you might disagree, and so things stand then.

For some reason I don't believe women and gays have anything to fear from Paul. He has to feed some red meat to the party and all, but as President I think his agenda is more focused on fixing the economy and balancing the budget than taking anyone's rights away.

That may well be. I certainly hope so.

I still think he is making way too big a concession, for all the wrong reasons. It would be wrong of me to support what I perceive as being a grave mistake.

Hillary on the other hand is going to attempt to take as many guns away from us as humanly possible. I know that makes you happy Luis, but there will be a backlash just like last time.

I take it that you perceive this as a bad thing?

For better or worse, the backlash does not strike me as a reason not to do it. Maybe I am simply unaware of how grave it was.

I would expect it to involve several people being killed or maimed before I began to consider it as a reason against gun control, though.

If she is sucessful, you can bet it will set back Democrats going to Washington for a decade or more just like last time there was Clinton gun laws the GWB repealed.

You mean, there would be no Democrat POTUS for a while?

That is a mean thing to say of the American voters, IMO.

After that CCW in this country went off the charts.

I believe that to be true, but I try not to mind it too much.

 

[Reverend Rick]

You make it sound like some sort of prejudice. I hope I am mistaken.

Luis, I respect your opinions not because I agree with them but because I respect your right to hold them.

One thing has always confused me however, I really don't worry much about how other countries are run as long as they are not mistreated.

I would never want to change the laws they decided to live by.

Why do you take United States politics so personal? This is no dig, it is an honest curiosity.

 

[LuisDantas]

Luis, I respect your opinions not because I agree with them but because I respect your right to hold them.

One thing has always confused me however, I really don't worry much about how other countries are run as long as they are not mistreated.

I would never want to change the laws they decided to live by.

Why do you take United States politics so personal? This is no dig, it is an honest curiosity.

No one will ever understand me as long as they assume that I lend a lot of weight to the notion of country. Or to that of law, for that matter. I judge communities for what opinions they hold. All communities, all the time. That is just who I am. I am firmly convinced that birth circunstances are an accident and no one should be discriminated for those circunstances. Ergo, all of humanity is fair game for my analysis.

I just happen to notice that the USA are influential and to deserve my attention.

Edited to add: Also, I am not one to give my respect lightly. I question, I try, I challenge. Those that I respect have usually been given reason to wonder if it worth the trouble, be them people or countries. If you ask me, it is a coin toss.

You may not believe it, but I had (and possibly still have) something of a reputation for being a stern defender of the USA's reputation here in Brazil. I used to be far more enthusiastic about it before 2002 or so, though.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Does Rand share the same anti-gay, anti-women, and anti-science stance that most of his fellow republicans hold? Those are deal breakers for me.

He shares some but not all...

[youtube]0AvjC6DaBdk[/youtube]
Rand Paul On The Issues: Marriage - YouTube


Rand Paul Mocks Drowning Polar Bears, Rising Sea Levels And White House 'Extremists'

Paul, who was arguing for a resolution that would bar the Environmental Protection Agency from enforcing court-ordered clean air rules, argued EPA was going too far in protecting health.


"To have clean air and jobs, we must have balance," Paul argued

Rand Paul refuses to say how old the earth is: "I think Im just gonna have to pass on that one" | ThinkProgress

QUESTION: Was there a point in life where you became a Christian [...] and also, how old is the world?

PAUL: I forgot to say I was only taking easy questions (crowd laughs)…. I’m gonna have to pass on the age of the earth. I think I’m just gonna have to pass on that one.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

If you mean he is not going to cut it with Liberals and left leaning moderates, I agree. He is a Republican after all.

If his Libertarian streak starts to shine through he won't cut it with Republicans or tea party folks either.

For some reason I don't believe women and gays have anything to fear from Paul.

If he's elected and you have the House and the Senate majority then Republicans will use him as a puppet for their agenda. And as you say (he is a Republican after all) so he'll sign their crazy bills.

Hillary on the other hand is going to attempt to take as many guns away from us as humanly possible.

Evidence...?

If she is sucessful, you can bet it will set back Democrats going to Washington for a decade or more just like last time there was Clinton gun laws the GWB repealed.

After that CCW in this country went off the charts.

Nothing substantial is going to happen with guns. You'll be able to continue to grab as many as you can....

 

[Monk Of Reason]

My money is on his being sincere, since the move is very consistent with a long
held political philosophy.
Will it help him politically? Does he thinks so? I don't know.

But this raises a complementary issue....do those ostensible civil libertarians
who don't sue Obama over the surveillance have disingenuous political motives?
Do they remain inactive because they don't want to rock the party's boat.

Time for a Kurt Vonnegut quote (partial).
(Mother Night is a great book...wickedly funny & tragic.)
“We are what we pretend to be.....”

For the most part all politician actions are politically motivated rather than sincere. Why did he not sue them before the election year started? The timing also makes me feel as though this is a political move.

 

[Reverend Rick]

For the most part all politician actions are politically motivated rather than sincere. Why did he not sue them before the election year started? The timing also makes me feel as though this is a political move.

Nah, his lawsuit comes from the heart. Now his comments about the Clinton's returning to the White House and Bill being a sexual predator was a political move.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Nah, his lawsuit comes from the heart. Now his comments about the Clinton's returning to the White House and Bill being a sexual predator was a political move.

Nah, it's ALL political. He's trying to stay aboard that tea party express. It's about the base and getting that vote.... I just hope his argument in court is going to be original and ("from the heart") and not plagiarized from wikipedia.....:sad:

 

[Reverend Rick]

Nah, it's ALL political. He's trying to stay aboard that tea party express. It's about the base and getting that vote.... I just hope his argument in court is going to be original and ("from the heart") and not plagiarized from wikipedia.....:sad:

That is funny right there. Speaking of plagiarized speeches, Obama took something right out of a GWB speech.

 

[Revoltingest]

Nah, it's ALL political. He's trying to stay aboard that tea party express. It's about the base and getting that vote.... I just hope his argument in court is going to be original and ("from the heart") and not plagiarized from wikipedia.....:sad:

Given a choice in the upcoming election between a guy (Paul) who fights domestic spying for purely political
reasons, & a candidate (Hillary) who acquiesces to domestic spying for sincere reasons, I'll support the former.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Thats a bitter pill to swallow Rev. Progressives are going to back someone who has more in common with the Republican party than Paul.

Why can't they find someone who would represent their ideals better?

 

[Dirty Penguin]

That is funny right there. Speaking of plagiarized speeches, Obama took something right out of a GWB speech.

I think there's a difference of borrowing a line or two..a phrase here or there and another to completely ripp-off whole sections from wikipedia and put it in your speech. But please don't think I'm being partisan as some around here like to claim...because I believe it may have been Joe Biden that was guilty of the same thing (Washingtonpost.com Special Report: Clinton Accused)..... :sad: