Orthodox More Honest about Scripture?

[Revoltingest]

As opposed to a spiritual person who might have more of a loosey goosey interpretation?

Loosie goosie can be completely honest.

 

[idav]

The problem is, "Orthodox" simply means "right belief." And, in their own minds, everybody who holds a belief holds the "right" one. Otherwise, it wouldn't be a belief. (Of course, that should point to what it says about that believer's thoughts about everybody else's beliefs, if they're not quite like his own -- how could they be "right?")

Yes but also generally or traditionally accepted as true or right. Like in Catholicism they have Vatican and Vatican II with more progressive stances on theological issues. Conservatives within Catholicism would take more to the traditional values. For example it isn't that all Catholics believe babies end up in limbo or something if not baptized but some might hold that orthodox view. It's all different from religion to religion.
What happens to the babies who used to be in limbo?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Yes but also generally or traditionally accepted as true or right. Like in Catholicism they have Vatican and Vatican II with more progressive stances on theological issues. Conservatives within Catholicism would take more to the traditional values. For example it isn't that all Catholics believe babies end up in limbo or something if not baptized but some might hold that orthodox view. It's all different from religion to religion.
What happens to the babies who used to be in limbo?

Limbo was never an official doctrine of the Church.

 

[idav]

Limbo was never an official doctrine of the Church.

It's probably Augustines fault for that "traditionalism". He said babies get the mildest punishment.

 

[LuisDantas]

As opposed to a spiritual person who might have more of a loosey goosey interpretation?

Quite so. I have actually concluded that, to my personal satisfaction, a person should not be considered religious at all until and unless he or she has accepted the responsibility of writing his or her own scriptural texts and to decide when and how it applies and fails to.

The reverence towards scripture displayed by many Christians and Muslims is quite surprising to me.

 

[shunyadragon]

Loosie goosie can be completely honest.

With lots of 'blue smoke and mirrors,'

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Yes but also generally or traditionally accepted as true or right. Like in Catholicism they have Vatican and Vatican II with more progressive stances on theological issues. Conservatives within Catholicism would take more to the traditional values. For example it isn't that all Catholics believe babies end up in limbo or something if not baptized but some might hold that orthodox view. It's all different from religion to religion.
What happens to the babies who used to be in limbo?

So, if, as you say, "it's all different from religion to religion," then there cannot possibly be any such thing as "orthodoxy."

And therein lies much of the historical terror of religion -- that people have been burned alive for "heterodox" beliefs, when nobody can make a definitive case for which "doxology" is " "Orthos" (meaning "straight").

 

[idav]

So, if, as you say, "it's all different from religion to religion," then there cannot possibly be any such thing as "orthodoxy."

And therein lies much of the historical terror of religion -- that people have been burned alive for "heterodox" beliefs, when nobody can make a definitive case for which "doxology" is " "Orthos" (meaning "straight").

In scripture it's believe or it's hell, I mean let's be honest it does say that. If someone believes that it applies to babies are they being honest, or are they ignoring a contradictory belief that all children have a place in heaven? That's why it's different between a Protestant and Catholic, then the denomination tries to teach some sort of unbiblical age of accountability to solve the issue.
What Is the Age of Accountability and Why Does It Matter?

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

In scripture it's believe or it's hell, I mean let's be honest it does say that. If someone believes that it applies to babies are they being honest, or are they ignoring a contradictory belief that all children have a place in heaven? That's why it's different between a Protestant and Catholic, then the denomination tries to teach some sort of unbiblical age of accountability to solve the issue.
What Is the Age of Accountability and Why Does It Matter?

Yes, but if they are all Christians, what really basic things can Catholics or Protestants really disagree on, and still both make the claim to be "Christian" and possess "true belief" (which is what orthodox means)?

 

[idav]

Yes, but if they are all Christians, what really basic things can Catholics or Protestants really disagree on, and still both make the claim to be "Christian" and possess "true belief" (which is what orthodox means)?

John 3:16

 

[Shiranui117]

I thoight this was going to be about Orthodox Christians, not fundies.

I know right? I got excited about someone make a thread to talk about Orthodoxy, too. Now I'm just sad panda.

 

[idav]

I know right? I got excited about someone make a thread to talk about Orthodoxy, too. Now I'm just sad panda.

I'm tying my best to not let baby Jesus cry, what's the answer?

 

[Shiranui117]

I'm tying my best to not let baby Jesus cry, what's the answer?

Get Him some candy. Seriously His mom can never get any for Him, all she's got for Him are honey-roasted dates, and even those are only on special occasions due to the family finances. Or see if His diaper needs changed.

 

[Shiranui117]

Are orthodox religions more honest about what their scriptures say?

I was talking with an atheist friend one day and they said that Christian Fundamentalists are more honest about what thier scriptures are saying in particular, young earth creationists. I can appreciate the honesty as well, it is quite refreshing, even if I were opposed to some of the theology or morality that might come out of it.

Thoughts?

In case anyone needs a definition of orthodox.

1. (of a person or their views, especially religious or political ones, or other beliefs or practices) conforming to what is generally or traditionally accepted as right or true; established and approved:

I think everyone's honest about their interpretations of their Scriptures. The only real question IMHO is how much these interpretations line up with said Scriptures, and by that same token, how much cognitive dissonance they suffer.

 

[Tumah]

Orthodox Judaism?

Judaism is a little different than Christianity in this regard because we don't understand the Tanach directly, but through the lens of the Oral Torah. Whether an OJ will be a YEC will depend on how they understand certain Rabbinical texts rather than anything it says in Genesis.

 

[idav]

I think everyone's honest about their interpretations of their Scriptures. The only real question IMHO is how much these interpretations line up with said Scriptures, and by that same token, how much cognitive dissonance they suffer.

Maybe, I thought it was an attempt to line up text with a worldview.

 

[Augustus]

I was talking with an atheist friend one day and they said that Christian Fundamentalists are more honest about what thier scriptures are saying in particular, young earth creationists. I can appreciate the honesty as well, it is quite refreshing, even if I were opposed to some of the theology or morality that might come out of it.

Thoughts?

For me it is based on a misconception.

This assumes that the Scriptures were written to be interpreted literally in a contextless vacuum (which really only started to appear after the Reformation).

Given that those who compiled the Bible didn't care about the contradictions in many of the narratives, I very much doubt they were pure literalists.

Also given that early Christianity was a social practice with the message being spread orally by instruction and that Paul offers his own opinions throughout his Epistles, literalism doesn't seem to be the One True Christianity.

 

[Politesse]

I would say no. People who are most honest about their tradition's Scriptures are not afraid to acknowledge the flaws in those writings, while honoring the wisdom within and between those flaws. Such people are normally considered heterodox, in whatever generation they are found, and at odds with whatever "orthodoxy" happens to be in power during their time. Orthodoxies are ever built on the foundation of claimed infallibility.

If a parent says to you said "my child is the perfect human being, and I can admit no flaws in her; even the things her teachers and peers criticize her for are lies or misunderstandings, because my angel could never be wrong!" would you say they are being more honest than someone who sighs and says "Ah, I know her tantrums can be pretty crazy! But I love her all the same, you know."? This first parent is most certainly loyal, and honest perhaps about their feelings, but not very honest about their child, and their unrealistic expectations will harm both the child and themselves eventually.

Idealizing a book makes no more sense than idealizing a person, and though the temptation to both kinds of idealization is understandable when one is in the first throes of love, this kind of love is also blind and incapable of true honesty. A mature and honest love realizes that a thing does not need to be perfect to be good, even the most good. As was written, "Faithful are the wounds of a friend; profuse are the kisses of an enemy."

 

[Grandliseur]

Are orthodox religions more honest about what their scriptures say?

I was talking with an atheist friend one day and they said that Christian Fundamentalists are more honest about what thier scriptures are saying in particular, young earth creationists. I can appreciate the honesty as well, it is quite refreshing, even if I were opposed to some of the theology or morality that might come out of it.

Thoughts?

In case anyone needs a definition of orthodox.

1. (of a person or their views, especially religious or political ones, or other beliefs or practices) conforming to what is generally or traditionally accepted as right or true; established and approved:

I'm OEC. The YEC ignore the logic and direct statements that Genesis contains; they also ignore the fact that since we are today still in the 7th day of Genesis, this implies that Genesis chapter one day is at least about 7000 years long and perhaps even much longer.

The following link discusses the earth's age, and also the length of each Genesis chapter one day.
Link: Earth's age by the Bible

 

[idav]

I know right? I got excited about someone make a thread to talk about Orthodoxy, too. Now I'm just sad panda.

I bet you there are still young earthers in there, not that it would necessarily be a church doctrine, but I suppose traditionalism can extend beyond scripture into the realm of dogma of any particular religion.