King Edward VI of England Fatal Challenge of the Universal Roman Catholic Church

[metis]

The Roman Catholic Church was the State Church of Rome.

Not until the 4th century.

Supported by the Emperor in all its territories. All churches and leader's that did not submit to its rule and dogma were destroyed or banished as heretics.

"Heretics" existed and were condemned by the Church long before the 4th century, especially because they used different book/letters and taught some different theologies. Google some of them and you'll see what I mean.

As I mentioned earlier, a number of prominent earlier churches survive to this day.
The Roman Catholic Church is only preeminent in its own mind.

They are a byproduct of "apostolic succession" because they can trace their ancestry back to Apostles, which is why the Catholic Church does recognize them as such. They split from the Catholic Church and not the other way around, and there are many "Anglican Catholics" today.

There are numerous other Episcopal churches, that are also universal.

See above.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Not until the 4th century.

"Heretics" existed and were condemned by the Church long before the 4th century, especially because they used different book/letters and taught some different theologies. Google some of them and you'll see what I mean.

They are a byproduct of "apostolic succession" because they can trace their ancestry back to Apostles, which is why the Catholic Church does recognize them as such. They split from the Catholic Church and not the other way around, and there are many "Anglican Catholics" today.

See above.

I do not need Google to tell me that other churches predate the Roman one , the letters of Paul tell me that, as does their survival to the present day.

Heretics are defined from one sides point of view, or the others. There is no absolute.
I consider my self a heretical Anglican.

The Orthodox consider the Roman church to he heretical or at least heterodox because it changed the. "unchangeable" Nicene creed by adding the Filioque. Which fundamentally changes the concept of the Trinity.

The Roman Marian theology is also considered heretical by many.

Even the Anglican church has agreed that the Orthodox are correct and are in the process of removing it and reverting to the original form of the creed.

As to the selection of the books in the Bible, this varies by Church, and has never been fully standardised. But neither has it been considered a problem.

 

[Elihoenai]

So are you saying the RCC is sanctioned by God, if so, then the Chruch is greater than the hierarchy
and the sins of the sons and daughters.

Everything that Happens is Sanctioned and Ordained by Elohim/God.

The members of the Roman Catholic Church are not subject to the Law of Elohim/God because it's not Possible for the Carnal Mind to keep the Law. For example, the Carnal Mind can never be Truly Faithful in a Marriage or cease from Idolatry.

The Universal Roman Catholic Church consists of three groups:

1) The Few Elect Cross Practitioners holding Private Theology.

2) The Few Elect Inverted Cross Practitioners holding Private Theology.

3) The 2.2 Billon Laity Practitioners holding Public Theology.

 

[Elihoenai]

Why do you think the Pope who excommunicated Henry VIII died choking on his own phlegm? Do you agree that it is because he challenged the Supreme Authority of Henry VIII as the head of the Church of England?

James 1:8

8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.


Deuteronomy 28:28-29

28 The Lord shall smite thee with madness, and blindness, and astonishment of heart:

29 And thou shalt grope at noonday, as the blind gropeth in darkness, and thou shalt not prosper in thy ways: and thou shalt be only oppressed and spoiled evermore, and no man shall save thee.



Much appreciate brining this history to our attention.

I'm looking into the History of Pope Clement VII and it appears that Elohim/God Smote him because of his Double Mindedness. The Double Minded don't have Clear Vision.



Pope Clement VII

"Pope Clement VII (Latin: Clemens VII; Italian: Clemente VII; born Giulio de' Medici; 26 May 1478 – 25 September 1534) was head of the Catholic Church and ruler of the Papal States from 19 November 1523 to his death on 25 September 1534. Deemed "the most unfortunate of the popes", Clement VII's reign was marked by a rapid succession of political, military, and religious struggles—many long in the making—which had far-reaching consequences for Christianity and world politics...."


"...Death

Clement returned to Rome on 10 December 1533 with a fever and complaining of stomach problems. He had been ill for months and "was aging rapidly."[39] Strathern writes, "his liver was failing and his skin turned yellow; he also lost the sight of one eye and became partially blind in the other...."

Pope Clement VII - Wikipedia



Clement VII

"...Caught Between Two Monarchs

During his reign as pontiff, Clement switched allegiance between King Francis I of France and Emperor Charles V, several times. Duffy wrote that to a point, his indecisiveness was understandable. Even though Charles was a more devout Catholic than Francis, he was also a bigger threat...."

Clement VII


Other members on these forums might have different perspectives.

 

[pearl]

The Universal Roman Catholic Church consists of three groups:

1) The Few Elect Cross Practitioners holding Private Theology.

2) The Few Elect Inverted Cross Practitioners holding Private Theology.

3) The 2.2 Billon Laity Practitioners holding Public Theology.

Interested in your source for the above.
Back to the original statement on idolatry;
There is a big difference between veneration and worship. Israel discovered this difference when it experienced defeat at the hands of the Philistines (you remember the story in 1 Samuel 4). Thirty thousand men died believing that the Ark guaranteed their success. It didn’t. The Ark is a great symbol of YHVH’s devotion to Israel, but it isn’t YHVH. It requires veneration, not worship.

 

[metis]

I do not need Google to tell me that other churches predate the Roman one , the letters of Paul tell me that, as does their survival to the present day.

Heretics are defined from one sides point of view, or the others. There is no absolute.
I consider my self a heretical Anglican.

The Orthodox consider the Roman church to he heretical or at least heterodox because it changed the. "unchangeable" Nicene creed by adding the Filioque. Which fundamentally changes the concept of the Trinity.

The Roman Marian theology is also considered heretical by many.

Even the Anglican church has agreed that the Orthodox are correct and are in the process of removing it and reverting to the original form of the creed.

As to the selection of the books in the Bible, this varies by Church, and has never been fully standardised. But neither has it been considered a problem.

Well, it's been implied by some that I am a "heretical Catholic" by some, so I guess we have something in common.

Take care.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

James 1:8

8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.


Deuteronomy 28:28-29

28 The Lord shall smite thee with madness, and blindness, and astonishment of heart:

29 And thou shalt grope at noonday, as the blind gropeth in darkness, and thou shalt not prosper in thy ways: and thou shalt be only oppressed and spoiled evermore, and no man shall save thee.



Much appreciate brining this history to our attention.

I'm looking into the History of Pope Clement VII and it appears that Elohim/God Smote him because of his Double Mindedness. The Double Minded don't have Clear Vision.



Pope Clement VII

"Pope Clement VII (Latin: Clemens VII; Italian: Clemente VII; born Giulio de' Medici; 26 May 1478 – 25 September 1534) was head of the Catholic Church and ruler of the Papal States from 19 November 1523 to his death on 25 September 1534. Deemed "the most unfortunate of the popes", Clement VII's reign was marked by a rapid succession of political, military, and religious struggles—many long in the making—which had far-reaching consequences for Christianity and world politics...."


"...Death

Clement returned to Rome on 10 December 1533 with a fever and complaining of stomach problems. He had been ill for months and "was aging rapidly."[39] Strathern writes, "his liver was failing and his skin turned yellow; he also lost the sight of one eye and became partially blind in the other...."

Pope Clement VII - Wikipedia



Clement VII

"...Caught Between Two Monarchs

During his reign as pontiff, Clement switched allegiance between King Francis I of France and Emperor Charles V, several times. Duffy wrote that to a point, his indecisiveness was understandable. Even though Charles was a more devout Catholic than Francis, he was also a bigger threat...."

Clement VII


Other members on these forums might have different perspectives.

FYI: my question was rhetorical.

 

[Elihoenai]

Interested in your source for the above.
Back to the original statement on idolatry;
There is a big difference between veneration and worship. Israel discovered this difference when it experienced defeat at the hands of the Philistines (you remember the story in 1 Samuel 4). Thirty thousand men died believing that the Ark guaranteed their success. It didn’t. The Ark is a great symbol of YHVH’s devotion to Israel, but it isn’t YHVH. It requires veneration, not worship.

2 Thessalonians 2:9-12

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


You won't find the source anywhere because it came out of Religious Experience and Knowledge.

In the same way as described in 1 Samuel 4 the 2.2 Billon Laity Practitioners are Utterly Destroyed by their Enemies from a Spiritual Perspective. The 2.2 Billion Laity are content with the Sacraments of Baptism and Communion and Confession to a Priest and believe God is among them for doing so. In this Way they get to Keep the Carnal Nature. The Carnal Mind and Nature Worship False God Idols as a continual Devoted Practice. The Mass Laity are in a Double Minded Halfway House. The Laity are not and have never been Saved!

 

[Elihoenai]

FYI: my question was rhetorical.

As I told Atheist @ChristineM, this thread is for People of Faith that are Serious Religious Practitioners. The Holy Scriptures/Bible Speaking in History is a Faith Matter.

 

[ChristineM]

FYI: my question was rhetorical.

As I told Atheist @ChristineM, this thread is for People of Faith that are Serious Religious Practitioners. The Holy Scriptures/Bible Speaking in History is a Faith Matter.

Seens he is unable to answer searching questions so pretends he can pick and choose who has access to a public thread.

 

[pearl]

You won't find the source anywhere because it came out of Religious Experience and Knowledge.

Based on what or who, or from your own interpretation Scripture or religion?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

As I told Atheist @ChristineM, this thread is for People of Faith that are Serious Religious Practitioners. The Holy Scriptures/Bible Speaking in History is a Faith Matter.

You consider yourself a "Serious Religious Practitioner" (with capital letters, no less)? Interesting.

There's the Same Faith Debates forum for conversations between members of only one category of believer. Out here in the general forums, holding a mirror up to the pareidolia you gave us in the OP is fair game.

 

[YoursTrue]

Proverbs 8:13

13 The fear of the Lord is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.


Thankfully the True Worshippers of Elohim/God are Bigots against those that Hate and Disobey Elohim/God. We must Hate every Evil and False Way, otherwise, the True Worshippers of Elohim/God would become Extinct.

And by the way stating the Truth is not Bigotry.

You have stated that it is Forbidden for Roman Catholics to make and Idol and/or to Worship any object. Please can you explain to the readers what is going on in the following video an image:


Pope Francis kisses the Cross during the Celebration of the Passion

Baby Jesus

@metis It appears embarrassing that you can assert that it is Forbidden for Roman Catholics to make and Worship an Idol when Billions of people can see the Total Contrary. Is that an Image of Jesus on the Cross being Worshipped? Is that an Image of Baby Jesus being Worshipped?

It seems that as long as the pope permits bowing down or kissing idols (statues) then it's ok for Catholics to do it. I guess. And they don't call it idolatry.

 

[YoursTrue]

Yet you do not allow the Church to determine/define its own statements.

It's odd, isn't it, that not all will agree with the RCC's interpretations, isn't it? Not all religions, especially, that is. And it was considered quite the crime centuries ago, and even not so long ago, to differ from the Catholic church, wasn't it. One of the big ones could be the Inquisition.

 

[Elihoenai]

Seens he is unable to answer searching questions so pretends he can pick and choose who has access to a public thread.

I answered the questions posed by Atheist @9-10ths_Penguin with a Faith Response: King Edward VI of England Fatal Challenge of the Universal Roman Catholic Church

Elohim/God did not Smite Pope Clement VII because he excommunicated King Henry VIII. Pope Clement VII is in the Right to excommunicate Henry VIII. This King married 6 Wives having two murdered to satisfy his Huge Carnal Appetites. He is Protesting/Protestant Against God being Earthly Universal Roman Catholic Church Laity.

 

[Elihoenai]

Based on what or who, or from your own interpretation Scripture or religion?

The Private Theology of the Original Christian Doctrine contained in the Holy Scriptures/Bible.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I answered the questions posed by Atheist @9-10ths_Penguin with a Faith Response: King Edward VI of England Fatal Challenge of the Universal Roman Catholic Church

Elohim/God did not Smite Pope Clement VII because he excommunicated King Henry VIII. Pope Clement VII is in the Right to excommunicate Henry VIII. This King married 6 Wives having two murdered to satisfy his Huge Carnal Appetites. He is Protesting/Protestant Against God being Earthly Universal Roman Catholic Church Laity.

You're pulling this stuff out of your butt. Here's how it works:

- when something bad happens to someone you don't like, you decide that this is God "smiting" them.

- when something bad happens to someone you do like, you ignore it or attribute it to some other cause.

That's all that's happening here. You just look into the Bible to find out-of-context verses that are vague enough for you to fill in missing details with your personal pareidolia, and then declare them to be about whatever you want them to be about.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The Private Theology of the Original Christian Doctrine contained in the Holy Scriptures/Bible.

How would someone other than you differentiate "The Private Theology of the Original Christian Doctrine contained in the Holy Scriptures/Bible" from "nonsense that @Elihoenai imagined into the text"?

 

[Elihoenai]

You consider yourself a "Serious Religious Practitioner" (with capital letters, no less)? Interesting.

There's the Same Faith Debates forum for conversations between members of only one category of believer. Out here in the general forums, holding a mirror up to the pareidolia you gave us in the OP is fair game.

Matthew 7:13-14

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.


No, I have not yet attained Serious Religious Practitioner. I'm currently among the Laity Transitioning to the Few Elect.

The OP is Faith Content. Atheist are free to contribute, although you must bear in mind that Faith is different from Science.

 

[ChristineM]

I answered the questions posed by Atheist @9-10ths_Penguin with a Faith Response: King Edward VI of England Fatal Challenge of the Universal Roman Catholic Church

Elohim/God did not Smite Pope Clement VII because he excommunicated King Henry VIII. Pope Clement VII is in the Right to excommunicate Henry VIII. This King married 6 Wives having two murdered to satisfy his Huge Carnal Appetites. He is Protesting/Protestant Against God being Earthly Universal Roman Catholic Church Laity.

When you realise that a debate thread is for debate and not just for agreeing with your made up stories then you will have learned something