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Jesus: The Missing Years in the East

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by godnotgod, Oct 7, 2013.

  1. godnotgod

    godnotgod Thou art That

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    This is a spinoff from the thread: 'The Lost Years of Jesus', found here:

    http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/religious-debates/152801-lost-years-jesus.html

    The question of whether he (Jesus/Yeshu/Issa/Yuz Aussaf) may have spent time in the Middle and Far East during his 18 or so missing years, and whether he may have survived the Crucifixion and returned there to live out his days and to die there has not been addressed.

    Though there is no 'smoking gun' which clinches the question, the information pertaining to the notion of these travels far exceeds the paltry footnotes from the Christian sources themselves as to his whereabouts, and, taken as a whole, offer a far more compelling and, as far as I am concerned, convincing scenario. The very fact of missing accounts from the Christian world point to the simple idea of his not being present in the Near East at all. There are several aspects to this alternate story, some from Persia, others from India, Tibet, and Egypt. It is a large canvas, so I will leave it up to someone else to provide a starting point for our journey Eastward.
     
    #1 godnotgod, Oct 7, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2013
  2. YmirGF

    YmirGF Bodhisattva

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    Cool beans. Is there even the slightest shed of evidence that the Joyous Nazarene ever vacationed in the East? From reliable sources?
     
  3. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    Hello again!

    I'm glad that you are running this thread, mostly because I could not afford to buy that book...... it was just under £30 on ebay. So you can tell as much as you can here. I will be back this evening to read the posts.
     
  4. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    I came back, but there were no posts to read.
    Will anybody contribute towards Saint Issa?
     
  5. Kilgore Trout

    Kilgore Trout Misanthropic Humanist

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    Sounds like a narrative many people would find personally compelling.
     
  6. Shermana

    Shermana Heretic

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    Well we know there were some early Christian Missionaries in India and they may have started as a very Jewish-oriented sect until the arrival of the Orthodox missionaries later on, there's evidence of that at least. The fact that they were known as "Malankara Nazarenes", or earlier "Nazrani" implies that they had a connection with whatever "Nazarene" implied at the time, and I believe the context of "Nazarene" indicated a Jewish sect until many years later.

    But I don't understand why anyone would think Jesus went to India as opposed to China or Egypt or Outer Space on a magical spaceship during his "unknown" years. If anything I'd think he stayed entirely within the borders of Judea so he would obey all the festivals as the Law proscribed.
     
  7. godnotgod

    godnotgod Thou art That

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    Would you consider the statements of Buddhist monks to be 'reliable sources'?
     
  8. BSM1

    BSM1 Who's a good boy?

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    Not if it were just hear-say. Some scrap of concrete evidence would be welcomed.
     
  9. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    Hi Shermana.....
    I am really interested to learn more about the original Jewish Nazarenes and it would great if you would run a thread just on that name....... or if you know any good web sites that explain about them....?

    I underlined 'the borders of Judaea' because I thought he he would have lived and worked more in Galilee, with the occasional visit to the Temple? Would you say that Galileans were as 'regular' with their pilgrimages to the Temple as Judaean's?

    The synoptics read to me as if Yeshua was focused on Palestine as God's Kingdom, and the Laws were his God's laws as ordered through Moses. It seems as if Christian creeds reversed into some of them, later on.
     
  10. godnotgod

    godnotgod Thou art That

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    What the Buddhist monks at the Hemis monastery in the Himalayas say about a certain St. Issa is not second-hand. It comes from their own mouths.

    When I asked the question, I was inferring that their word carries more weight than the average Joe.

    Have you heard about the St. Issa scrolls?
     
  11. BSM1

    BSM1 Who's a good boy?

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    Though interesting and intriguing the scrolls have not been validated or substantiated. Even though I believe in the possibility of Yeshua in India (see my avatar of "Jesus Meditating Near Mt Kailish") another historically validated source would be helpful in separating myth from fact.
     
  12. gilligan8914

    gilligan8914 Member

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    There is as much evidence that Jesus visited the east as there is evidence of a historical Jesus at all. Why would someone believe in some words written on paper about Jesus but not believe in other words written on paper about Jesus? If you agree with whats written then you will believe it. If you do not agree with whats written then you won't believe it. Belief in unfactual or unprovable things are in the mind of the beholder.
     
  13. godnotgod

    godnotgod Thou art That

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    You imply 'validation and substantiation' via Western means, but are you considering the Eastern view? Firstly, from the Buddhist point of view, they are not seeing 'Jesus'; they are seeing St. Issa. There is no agenda to prove or disprove that St. Issa is God the Savior in the flesh, or that they had some exclusive relationship with Jesus that the West did not have. For them, Issa is a great friend and teacher. They refer to him as their 'beloved St. Issa'. So if Issa is only a great friend and spiritual teacher, why wouldn't anyone believe the Buddhist monks when they say that he was a visitor to their monastery for some years, and even returned there after being crucified? In fact, if the first part is true, it would make perfect sense that he would return there. That is totally believable. That he rose from the dead and ascended bodily into the sky is completely incredulous.

    We will get to the reasons why the scrolls have not been revealed to the world, and only to a handful of visitors in awhile.

    For readers unfamiliar with the St. Issa scrolls, you can take a look here:

    http://messenger2.cjcmp.org/issa.html
     
    #13 godnotgod, Oct 10, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
  14. godnotgod

    godnotgod Thou art That

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    Yes, especially when the ideological content of the St. Issa scrolls is pretty much the same as that of the Christian writings.
     
    #14 godnotgod, Oct 10, 2013
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
  15. outhouse

    outhouse Atheistically

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    Not true. :slap:

    We know Paul started writing early within decades and the gospels early as well, 35
    ish years after his death.

    issa scrolls are probably fiction according to a almost unanimous consensus for scholars. There is no comparison.

    The gospels were collections of oral and written sources compiled by a single author or group of authors.

    Not a Russian caught in a lie.
     
  16. angellous_evangellous

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    Jesus was actually the first slum-dog millionaire. That is, after Krishna, Mithras, Ra, and Horus.

    My personal favorite fairytale is India.
     
  17. nameless

    nameless The Creator

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    Any evidences for jesus existed?
     
  18. Shermana

    Shermana Heretic

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    OP, do you think Jesus returned every year to obey the yearly festivals or do you think Jesus wasn't fully compliant with Jewish law at the time?
     
  19. Shermana

    Shermana Heretic

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    Also, OP, have you actually read the whole Notovich's book to know what he says about the scrolls, and if they are even a "first hand account" or a narrative? Do you not see anything wrong with the fact that no one has seen the manuscripts or that this same group of monks never decided to contact anyone else throughout history? Do you not see something wrong with Notovtich admitting he fabricated the evidence? Nicolas Notovitch - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  20. Shermana

    Shermana Heretic

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    From the website:

    Obviously was? How about he was obviously influenced by Essene teachings instead? I don't see anything remotely Buddhist or Hindu in anything Jesus says in the Gospels, not even in the most Gnostic of the NT Apocrypha. I see plenty of possible Dead Sea Scroll similarities though.
     
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