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Indonesian Muslims say Chinese culture is uncivilised

The Emperor of Mankind

Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic
Yes, you read that correctly. I laughed out loud when I read the report below. Muslims in Indonesia are so threatened by powerless idols that they've demanded a 100 foot tall statue of the Chinese folk hero/god Guan Yu be covered up or face destruction at the hands of a mob. This is just the latest incident in the Muslim-majority country. Several 'un-Islamic' statues have been vandalised and non-Muslim temples have been attacked with fire in the last few years.

The 'Religion of Peace' strikes again, demanding respect and deference it so often refuses to show to others.

This attack on Chinese culture could simply be the result of rising anti-Chinese sentiment as China flexes its muscles in the area. Or it could be Islam demanding submission from non-Muslims. I'm inclined to think it's a bit of both.

Link
 
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Wu Wei

ursus senum severiorum and ex-Bisy Backson
Guan Yu.....is not pleased

maxresdefault.jpg
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Yes, you read that correctly. I laughed out loud when I read the report below. Muslims in Indonesia are so threatened by powerless idols that they've demanded a 100 foot tall statue of the Chinese folk hero Guan Yu be covered up or face destruction at the hands of a mob. This is just the latest incident in the Muslim-majority country. Several 'un-Islamic' statues have been vandalised and non-Muslim temples have been attacked with fire in the last few years.

The 'Religion of Peace' strikes again, demanding respect and deference it so often refuses to show to others.

This attack on Chinese culture could simply be the result of rising anti-Chinese sentiment as China flexes its muscles in the area. Or it could be Islam demanding submission from non-Muslims. I'm inclined to think it's a bit of both.

Link

I don't see what the problem is with statues. If it's a matter of opposing Chinese hegemony in the region, then they may have a grievance, but there might be other ways of going about it.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
The more one feels his religious views threatened, the more rabidly he'll defended them. This is particularly the case when one's whole ego-identity is defined by said religion.

Those who feel they dwell in straw housed are the most aggressive in defending them.
 

Akivah

Well-Known Member
The 'Religion of Peace' strikes again, demanding respect and deference it so often refuses to show to others.

Link

It might be the Muslims have a different glossary than the rest of us. For instance, in the article
Didik Muadi, a Muslim who organized the protests against the statue, said Muslims would destroy the figure themselves if the government did not intervene. Actually, we can allow them to build the statue, just not as high as it was and it should be in the temple, not outside,” Mr. Didik told the news site Tempo “We are tolerant.”

Given that the article reports that Muslims have destroyed other statues deemed un-Islamic and have set several Chinese temples on fire, they must have a different definition of the word 'tolerant'.
 

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
It might be the Muslims have a different glossary than the rest of us. For instance, in the article

Given that the article reports that Muslims have destroyed other statues deemed un-Islamic and have set several Chinese temples on fire, they must have a different definition of the word 'tolerant'.
Well, in English:

Tole:

  1. (uncountable) A decorative metalware having a lacquered or enamelled surface that is painted or gilded
Rant:
  1. A wild, emotional, and sometimes incoherent articulation.

So, they are ranting against tole (metalware, statues, etc)
 
This attack on Chinese culture could simply be the result of rising anti-Chinese sentiment as China flexes its muscles in the area. Or it could be Islam demanding submission from non-Muslims. I'm inclined to think it's a bit of both.

Chinese in South East Asia are viewed in a way similar to the stereotype of Jews in Europe: rich, avaricious and part of some shadowy power network. This stereotype long predates current events, and this latent prejudice can easily be worked up.

Confucianism was only accepted as an official religion within the past couple of decades, and Chinese names and cultural symbols were also previously banned.

Discrimination against Chinese Indonesians - Wikipedia

In general, there have been more incidences of intolerance against minority religions in recent years though.
 

Epic Beard Man

Bearded Philosopher
Yes, you read that correctly. I laughed out loud when I read the report below. Muslims in Indonesia are so threatened by powerless idols that they've demanded a 100 foot tall statue of the Chinese folk hero/god Guan Yu be covered up or face destruction at the hands of a mob. This is just the latest incident in the Muslim-majority country. Several 'un-Islamic' statues have been vandalised and non-Muslim temples have been attacked with fire in the last few years.

The 'Religion of Peace' strikes again, demanding respect and deference it so often refuses to show to others.

This attack on Chinese culture could simply be the result of rising anti-Chinese sentiment as China flexes its muscles in the area. Or it could be Islam demanding submission from non-Muslims. I'm inclined to think it's a bit of both.

Link

These threads are the reasons why I stick up for Muslims and Islam cause you make a generalization of an entire religion based on the ignorance of a mob mentality. your religion is what? Pagan - Greek polytheism with hints of Daoist & Zoroastrian philosophies sounds like your beliefs are confused to me but hey, it wouldn't be cool to antagonize your confused beliefs right because they make sense to you. Besides I don't know you so why would I, in my right mind make pre-conceived notions of what you believe and why that would make sense to you? Point is we don't know the socio-political climate in that region, nor do we know the education level of the people that inhabit that region, because after all Indonesians in that region do not believe in secular education so you factor in religious fervor with a lack of worldly understanding and socio-political strife you have situations like this. Perhaps you may want to factor all that in instead of your own bigotry.
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
Secular humanism: a commitment to the value and worth of all humans, and a reliance on reason. For some reason, from that philosophy, we never find ourselves trying to destroy statues, art, works of music, scripture, other people ... or demanding that everybody do what we do. Where did we go so wrong, that we're so out of step with what is apparently "real humanity?" :confused:
 

The Emperor of Mankind

Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic
These threads are the reasons why I stick up for Muslims and Islam cause you make a generalization of an entire religion

:rolleyes:

The people threatening to destroy this statue are Muslims. Their motivations are anti-Chinese sentiment and Islamic iconoclasm (other statues and temples which are un-Islamic have been vandalised or even destroyed outright - this is the latest in a long line). It is not "a generalisation" to point out the guilty parties and the beliefs that are motivating them.


based on the ignorance of a mob mentality.

Ah yes, these people must be the 000000.1% of 1.5 billion Muslims who are willing to kill for the sake of their beliefs. Wait, they're not actually trying to kill people; that means they can't be called Islamic terrorists or extremists. But the only reasonable option left is... they're just regular Muslims. :confused:


your religion is what? Pagan - Greek polytheism with hints of Daoist & Zoroastrian philosophies sounds like your beliefs are confused to me but hey, it wouldn't be cool to antagonize your confused beliefs right because they make sense to you.

Go for it. I have thicker skin than people who cry 'Islamophobia' or 'bigotry' because I join the dots between an action and a belief that motivates that action.

So go for it; slander my beliefs all you want. That's not what I'm doing with Islam but if you want to feel self-righteous enough to see a connection where none exists, you go right ahead. We'll see who's laughing when the other Islamophiles on this forum finally become consistent in their standards and ride to my rescue decrying you for your Paganophobia. ;)


Besides I don't know you so why would I, in my right mind make pre-conceived notions of what you believe and why that would make sense to you?

Bad analogy because the only reliable source for what I believe is me. There are no reliable external sources for my beliefs. With Islam, though, that's a different story. We have the Quran, we have the Sunnah, we have the ahadith (when they actually are trustworthy, of course :rolleyes: ) and we have the speeches & actions of Muslims themselves (like in this particular case in Indonesia). Thanks to the Quran we know that Islam frowns on religious imagery; thanks to the actions of Muslims and interpretations of Islamic scripture, we know this disapproval has blossomed into full-blown iconoclasm. Thanks to the Quran we know that "'Indeed, they who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists will be in the fire of Hell, abiding eternally therein. Those are the worst of creatures." - Surah 98:6.


Point is we don't know the socio-political climate in that region,

From the link we know anti-Chinese sentiment is present in Indonesia; we know that Indonesia is the largest Muslim-majority nation in the world and we know that there's a rising sentiment among Indonesian Muslims to see Islamic law replace the (more) civilised secular laws that currently govern them.


nor do we know the education level of the people that inhabit that region, because after all Indonesians in that region do not believe in secular education so you factor in religious fervor with a lack of worldly understanding and socio-political strife you have situations like this.

So, in other words, Indonesians will prefer Islamic law if they're not well-educated.

Hey you said it, not me.


Perhaps you may want to factor all that in instead of your own bigotry.

:rolleyes:

Pointing out that Muslims are being intolerant of other religions is not bigotry. Pointing out that Islam's tendency to promote religious intolerance in its adherents is at least a partial factor is not bigotry. This is simply observing the situation on the ground.

But please continue defending Islam & Muslim behaviours like this from all forms of criticism.
 
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