Indonesian Muslims say Chinese culture is uncivilised

[Revoltingest]

These threads are the reasons why I stick up for Muslims and Islam cause you make a generalization of an entire religion based on the ignorance of a mob mentality. your religion is what? Pagan - Greek polytheism with hints of Daoist & Zoroastrian philosophies sounds like your beliefs are confused to me but hey, it wouldn't be cool to antagonize your confused beliefs right because they make sense to you. Besides I don't know you so why would I, in my right mind make pre-conceived notions of what you believe and why that would make sense to you? Point is we don't know the socio-political climate in that region, nor do we know the education level of the people that inhabit that region, because after all Indonesians in that region do not believe in secular education so you factor in religious fervor with a lack of worldly understanding and socio-political strife you have situations like this. Perhaps you may want to factor all that in instead of your own bigotry.

I sympathize with sticking up for the underdog.
But sometimes the underdog needs its nose whacked with a rolled up newspaper.
And yes, these malefactors do not represent the whole.

I do much to preserve & interpret history (technological), so I'm particularly irked when zealots
destroy historical artifacts. We lose this window into the thinking of our predecessors.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

The people threatening to destroy this statue are Muslims. Their motivations are anti-Chinese sentiment and Islamic iconoclasm (other statues and temples which are un-Islamic have been vandalised or even destroyed outright - this is the latest in a long line). It is not "a generalisation" to point out the guilty parties and the beliefs that are motivating them.




Ah yes, these people must be the 000000.1% of 1.5 billion Muslims who are willing to kill for the sake of their beliefs. Wait, they're not actually trying to kill people; that means they can't be called Islamic terrorists or extremists. But the only reasonable option left is... they're just regular Muslims.




Go for it. I have thicker skin than people who cry 'Islamophobia' or 'bigotry' because I join the dots between an action and a belief that motivates that action.

So go for it; slander my beliefs all you want. That's not what I'm doing with Islam but if you want to feel self-righteous enough to see a connection where none exists, you go right ahead. We'll see who's laughing when the other Islamophiles on this forum finally become consistent in their standards and ride to my rescue decrying you for your Paganophobia.




Bad analogy because the only reliable source for what I believe is me. There are no reliable external sources for my beliefs. With Islam, though, that's a different story. We have the Quran, we have the Sunnah, we have the ahadith (when they actually are trustworthy, of course ) and we have the speeches & actions of Muslims themselves (like in this particular case in Indonesia). Thanks to the Quran we know that Islam frowns on religious imagery; thanks to the actions of Muslims and interpretations of Islamic scripture, we know this disapproval has blossomed into full-blown iconoclasm. Thanks to the Quran we know that "'Indeed, they who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists will be in the fire of Hell, abiding eternally therein. Those are the worst of creatures." - Surah 98:6.




From the link we know anti-Chinese sentiment is present in Indonesia; we know that Indonesia is the largest Muslim-majority nation in the world and we know that there's a rising sentiment among Indonesian Muslims to see Islamic law replace the (more) civilised secular laws that currently govern them.




So, in other words, Indonesians will prefer Islamic law if they're not well-educated.

Hey you said it, not me.






Pointing out that Muslims are being intolerant of other religions is not bigotry. Pointing out that Islam's tendency to promote religious intolerance in its adherence is at least partial factor is not bigotry. This is simply observing the situation on the ground.

But please continue defending Islam & Muslim behaviours like this from all forms of criticism.

The actions of a few is not the sum of an entire faith. Again, the attitudes of those people could be from a tense socio-political climate....This is not to excuse their actions, but anyone that commits acts in a mob mentality are doing it on the basis of ignorance not an correct approach of Islam. The corrective action regarding idols especially in Islam has more to do with people imn Islam as opposed to those outside the faith. For instance Muslims are not allowed to have divine pictures of prophets or of God. Anyone outside that is fair game and are allowed but that is rule is only for Muslims. So the status situation could be the result of some sentiments going on in that region, and perhaps the Muslims there (or some) are using their faith to justify their anger.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I sympathize with sticking up for the underdog.
But sometimes the underdog needs its nose whacked with a rolled up newspaper.
And yes, these malefactors do not represent the whole.

I do much to preserve & interpret history (technological), so I'm particularly irked when zealots
destroy historical artifacts. We lose this window into the thinking of our predecessors.

Zealots of anything (including food) are the residual examples of a lack of reasoning. It just appears to me that these types of threads and the dialogues that ensenue are more about criticizing than intellectual critique. Of course I have my issues with Islam, which is why I'm not Muslim however I can discern the fanatical from the rational. My encounters with Muslims have been mostly positive and the ones that weren't were the result of "cultural muslims." I think what people fail to realize even the ones involved in the OP's topic, is that there are a lot of cultural Muslims-Muslims who incorporate a lot of their ethnic heritage with their religion. So a lot of times negative ethnic sentiments between peoples that occur on a socio-political scale, tend to be justified by religion.

 

[Revoltingest]

Zealots of anything (including food) are the residual examples of a lack of reasoning. It just appears to me that these types of threads and the dialogues that ensenue are more about criticizing than intellectual critique. Of course I have my issues with Islam, which is why I'm not Muslim however I can discern the fanatical from the rational. My encounters with Muslims have been mostly positive and the ones that weren't were the result of "cultural muslims." I think what people fail to realize even the ones involved in the OP's topic, is that there are a lot of cultural Muslims-Muslims who incorporate a lot of their ethnic heritage with their religion. So a lot of times negative ethnic sentiments between peoples that occur on a socio-political scale, tend to be justified by religion.

Islam is exceptional in its correlation with destruction of the history of other cultures & religions.
I'd say it stems from its obsession with being the only true religion, & scripture which can be
viewed as finding alternative views evil, & worthy of severe punishment.

Islam is not a single thing, having many variations. And they all stem from the Koran, & some
from hadiths. Some flavors are indeed terrible.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Islam is exceptional in its correlation with destruction of the history of other cultures & religions.
I'd say it stems from its obsession with being the only true religion, & scripture which can be
viewed as finding alternative views evil, & worthy of severe punishment.

Islam is not a single thing, having many variations. And they all stem from the Koran, & some
from hadiths. Some flavors are indeed terrible.

I would disagree in Islam's exceptionalism to the destruction of other cultures, unless you are a scholar on Islamic history I'd like to know what I missed in my studies in college!

 

[Revoltingest]

I would disagree in Islam's exceptionalism to the destruction of other cultures, unless you are a scholar on Islamic history I'd like to know what I missed in my studies in college!

Perhaps universities don't address destruction of monuments, eh.
Destruction of cultural heritage by ISIL - Wikipedia
One needn't be a scholar of any type to read the news, & see
that Islam inspires such violent censorship of the past.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Islam is exceptional in its correlation with destruction of the history of other cultures & religions.
I'd say it stems from its obsession with being the only true religion, & scripture which can be
viewed as finding alternative views evil, & worthy of severe punishment.

I'm inclined to disagree with this assessment. Christianity has damaged or destroyed outright other cultures before; the Pagan cultures of the Roman Empire, the numerous indigenous cultures around the globe - First Nations, African cultures, Polynesian cultures etc.

Islam isn't unique in this regard. I think what matters is that we should be able to say Islam does this too. For some reason a lot of people who defend Islam by saying 'but other religions do it too' aren't interested when we give Islam the same treatment & scrutiny those other religions receive.

The actions of a few is not the sum of an entire faith.

I don't believe I've said anything to the contrary. Islam is not a religion purely of violence just as it is not a religion purely of peace. Saying one is just as disingenuous as saying the other. The reason I tend to focus more on the violent aspects than the peaceful aspects on this forum is because we in the West are not allowed to point out that Islam even has flaws any more without being accused of bigotry, Islamophobia, cultural imperialism and so on. There are those of us who have legitimate concerns about features of Islam and (as you have done) these concerns are labelled 'irrational' and swept aside with no rational examination.

Again, the attitudes of those people could be from a tense socio-political climate....

It's not an either/or. It's not a case of attitudes rising either from a tense socio-political climate or Islamic bigotry. This intolerance on the part of Muslims can be (and I think it is) informed by both.

This is not to excuse their actions, but anyone that commits acts in a mob mentality are doing it on the basis of ignorance not an correct approach of Islam.

He said, immediately following up with an excuse. Further, as a non-Muslim, what gives you the right to decide whether or not a Muslim is approaching their faith 'correctly' or not? You've said in the past you're not as knowledgeable about Islam as a practising Muslim so your opinion on what constitutes 'true Islam' or does not holds no weight.

The corrective action regarding idols especially in Islam has more to do with people imn Islam as opposed to those outside the faith. For instance Muslims are not allowed to have divine pictures of prophets or of God. Anyone outside that is fair game and are allowed but that is rule is only for Muslims.

This is precisely my point. This is a rule for Muslims. The thing is you need to remind the Muslims threatening to smash the Guan Yu statue of this because they seem to be under the impression their religion's rules should also apply to non-Muslims. It's the same empty-headed, entitled exceptionalism we saw when Muslims started protesting against or killing people who drew Muhammad. Seriously, this can't be said enough: Muslims can't draw Muhammad. The diktats of Islam only apply to Muslims. So please start telling the ones with trouble understanding this issue that instead of condemning me for pointing out something we agree on.

So the status situation could be the result of some sentiments going on in that region, and perhaps the Muslims there (or some) are using their faith to justify their anger.

There's no 'perhaps' about this; a key element of the demands involved are because the statue is un-Islamic. The reason they want it covered up is because it's not on the Confucian temple's property (how can it be? It's ****ing massive!). Since it's on public property, they think they have the right to apply their religious law to it.

 

[Revoltingest]

I'm inclined to disagree with this assessment. Christianity has damaged or destroyed outright other cultures before; the Pagan cultures of the Roman Empire, the numerous indigenous cultures around the globe - First Nations, African cultures, Polynesian cultures etc.

Islam isn't unique in this regard. I think what matters is that we should be able to say Islam does this too. For some reason a lot of people who defend Islam by saying 'but other religions do it too' aren't interested when we give Islam the same treatment & scrutiny those other religions receive.




I don't believe I've said anything to the contrary. Islam is not a religion purely of violence just as it is not a religion purely of peace. Saying one is just as disingenuous as saying the other. The reason I tend to focus more on the violent aspects than the peaceful aspects on this forum is because we in the West are not allowed to point out that Islam even has flaws any more without being accused of bigotry, Islamophobia, cultural imperialism and so on. There are those of us who have legitimate concerns about features of Islam and (as you have done) these concerns are labelled 'irrational' and swept aside with no rational examination.




It's not an either/or. It's not a case of attitudes rising either from a tense socio-political climate or Islamic bigotry. This intolerance on the part of Muslims can be (and I think it is) informed by both.




He said, immediately following up with an excuse. Further, as a non-Muslim, what gives you the right to decide whether or not a Muslim is approaching their faith 'correctly' or not? You've said in the past you're not as knowledgeable about Islam as a practising Muslim so your opinion on what constitutes 'true Islam' or does not holds no weight.




This is precisely my point. This is a rule for Muslims. The thing is you need to remind the Muslims threatening to smash the Guan Yu statue of this because they seem to be under the impression their religion's rules should also apply to non-Muslims. It's the same empty-headed, entitled exceptionalism we saw when Muslims started protesting against or killing people who drew Muhammad. Seriously, this can't be said enough: Muslims can't draw Muhammad. The diktats of Islam only apply to Muslims. So please start telling the ones with trouble understanding this issue that instead of condemning me for pointing out something we agree on.




There's no 'perhaps' about this; a key element of the demands involved are because the statue is un-Islamic. The reason they want it covered up is because it's not on the Confucian temple's property (how can it be? It's ****ing massive!). Since it's on public property, they think they have the right to apply their religious law to it.

I don't disagree that Xianity has also been involved in cultural destruction.
But there are differences.....
- Xianity was less concerned with destroying artifacts.
- Xianity has generally softened relative to Islam.

 

[Notanumber]

From what I have seen, Islam relies on mob mentality and it doesn’t take much to drive them mental.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Perhaps universities don't address destruction of monuments, eh.
Destruction of cultural heritage by ISIL - Wikipedia
One needn't be a scholar of any type to read the news, & see
that Islam inspires such violent censorship of the past.

Well one needs to be knowledgeable to know that a lot of the Muslim world does not support Daesh (ISIL, ISIS) citing a terrorist group like them is the reason why the world needs more education when it comes to Islam. I was on Facebook today (CBS to be exact) and saw the alt-right protest the removal of General Lee statue. A big scuffle broke out then later someone used a vehicle to plow through counter-protestors--mostly a multi-racial group of BLM. One is confirmed dead. I saw some of the comments mostly coming from Caucasians regarding the incident...Many deflected targeting BLM blocking most of the street although pedestrians many tend to indirectly justify the incident in which one died. So in seeing well over a 1000 posts some of which supported White Nationalism, including the alt-right, should I therefore conclude a great large portion of Caucasians that think and act like the people on Facebook as well as these alt-right members?

My point in drawing this model is that we need to isolate destructive groups regardless of racial and/or religious affiliation.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I'm inclined to disagree with this assessment. Christianity has damaged or destroyed outright other cultures before; the Pagan cultures of the Roman Empire, the numerous indigenous cultures around the globe - First Nations, African cultures, Polynesian cultures etc.

Islam isn't unique in this regard. I think what matters is that we should be able to say Islam does this too. For some reason a lot of people who defend Islam by saying 'but other religions do it too' aren't interested when we give Islam the same treatment & scrutiny those other religions receive.




I don't believe I've said anything to the contrary. Islam is not a religion purely of violence just as it is not a religion purely of peace. Saying one is just as disingenuous as saying the other. The reason I tend to focus more on the violent aspects than the peaceful aspects on this forum is because we in the West are not allowed to point out that Islam even has flaws any more without being accused of bigotry, Islamophobia, cultural imperialism and so on. There are those of us who have legitimate concerns about features of Islam and (as you have done) these concerns are labelled 'irrational' and swept aside with no rational examination.




It's not an either/or. It's not a case of attitudes rising either from a tense socio-political climate or Islamic bigotry. This intolerance on the part of Muslims can be (and I think it is) informed by both.




He said, immediately following up with an excuse. Further, as a non-Muslim, what gives you the right to decide whether or not a Muslim is approaching their faith 'correctly' or not? You've said in the past you're not as knowledgeable about Islam as a practising Muslim so your opinion on what constitutes 'true Islam' or does not holds no weight.




This is precisely my point. This is a rule for Muslims. The thing is you need to remind the Muslims threatening to smash the Guan Yu statue of this because they seem to be under the impression their religion's rules should also apply to non-Muslims. It's the same empty-headed, entitled exceptionalism we saw when Muslims started protesting against or killing people who drew Muhammad. Seriously, this can't be said enough: Muslims can't draw Muhammad. The diktats of Islam only apply to Muslims. So please start telling the ones with trouble understanding this issue that instead of condemning me for pointing out something we agree on.




There's no 'perhaps' about this; a key element of the demands involved are because the statue is un-Islamic. The reason they want it covered up is because it's not on the Confucian temple's property (how can it be? It's ****ing massive!). Since it's on public property, they think they have the right to apply their religious law to it.

The part where you're telling me to "remind Muslims (regarding idols). Why do I have to? People on these boards do more complaining about Islam instead of having an intellectual dialogue with them. when I first came back on these boards my one critique of Islamic theology had to do with Islam, pre-determinism, and freewill. A couple Muslims engaged me and we had a great discussion and although I disagreed in part on the freewill aspect I did more studying on my own on how their position came to be. The problem I've seen here is when Muslims do respond in opposition to the idiotic actions of their brethren this is not good enough for people. A Muslim who has studied Arabic and the Qur'an and is knowledgeable of their faith and could give you and others a litany of examples and could explain why the actions of terrorist groups are not a part of Islam and you guys would still not be satisfied. I understand why not too many Muslims are not commenting on these subjects. I feel far too many of these types of threads just draws people who have a disdain for Islam and it just becomes a pat on the back discussion.

 

[FearGod]

These threads are the reasons why I stick up for Muslims and Islam cause you make a generalization of an entire religion based on the ignorance of a mob mentality. your religion is what? Pagan - Greek polytheism with hints of Daoist & Zoroastrian philosophies sounds like your beliefs are confused to me but hey, it wouldn't be cool to antagonize your confused beliefs right because they make sense to you. Besides I don't know you so why would I, in my right mind make pre-conceived notions of what you believe and why that would make sense to you? Point is we don't know the socio-political climate in that region, nor do we know the education level of the people that inhabit that region, because after all Indonesians in that region do not believe in secular education so you factor in religious fervor with a lack of worldly understanding and socio-political strife you have situations like this. Perhaps you may want to factor all that in instead of your own bigotry.

I really wonder how these guys think, the Statues were there for hundreds of years and
Islam was there for hundreds of years, but if a mob decides today that the statues should
be destroys then it's because of Islam.

I don't know if it's kind of stupid thinking or just an excuse to attack Islam as a religion.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I really wonder how these guys think, the Statues were there for hundreds of years and
Islam was there for hundreds of years, but if a mob decides today that the statues should
be destroys then it's because of Islam.

I don't know if it's kind of stupid thinking or just an excuse to attack Islam as a religion.

I don't know. I'm trying to give them middle ground approach to consider there plethora of reasons why this happen and not single out religion or religious beliefs.

 

[FearGod]

I don't know. I'm trying to give them middle ground approach to consider there plethora of reasons why this happen and not single out religion or religious beliefs.

I wish if they could have a healthful discussion than just attacking Islam due to some bad deeds
done by some Muslims.

Not a religion of peace, here's one terrorist in the video is crying, I wonder if Muslims cry too
similar to other humans.

Here's one other video showing how awful Muslims were during their victory

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I wish if they could have a healthful discussion than just attacking Islam due to some bad deeds
done by some Muslims.

Not a religion of peace, here's one terrorist in the video is crying, I wonder if Muslims cry too
similar to other humans.

Here's one other video showing how awful Muslims were during their victory

The videos are inspiring!

 

[Revoltingest]

Well one needs to be knowledgeable to know that a lot of the Muslim world does not support Daesh (ISIL, ISIS) citing a terrorist group like them is the reason why the world needs more education when it comes to Islam. I was on Facebook today (CBS to be exact) and saw the alt-right protest the removal of General Lee statue. A big scuffle broke out then later someone used a vehicle to plow through counter-protestors--mostly a multi-racial group of BLM. One is confirmed dead. I saw some of the comments mostly coming from Caucasians regarding the incident...Many deflected targeting BLM blocking most of the street although pedestrians many tend to indirectly justify the incident in which one died. So in seeing well over a 1000 posts some of which supported White Nationalism, including the alt-right, should I therefore conclude a great large portion of Caucasians that think and act like the people on Facebook as well as these alt-right members?

My point in drawing this model is that we need to isolate destructive groups regardless of racial and/or religious affiliation.

This doesn't defeat my claim that some Muslim areas around the world are destroying history.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Well one needs to be knowledgeable to know that a lot of the Muslim world does not support Daesh (ISIL, ISIS) citing a terrorist group like them is the reason why the world needs more education when it comes to Islam.

The link I put in the OP isn't referencing terrorists though; it's talking about regular 'mainstream' Muslims. I'm starting to get the impression that you'll do all kinds of mental gymnastics to avoid admitting it's Muslims who are doing this and that their Islamic beliefs motivate them at least in part.

Do you consider Ahmadis to be Muslims?

The part where you're telling me to "remind Muslims (regarding idols). Why do I have to?

You don't have to. But you should consider the fact that you're dictating a description of Muslims that the Muslims in the report themselves are not honouring. Since I am aware of the notion that the rules of Islam shouldn't apply to non-Muslims (and we agree on this), you'd make a better use of your time telling the people who need to know this (i.e. the Muslims threatening to smash the Guan Yu statue). It makes less sense to tell me, a non-Muslim, that Islamic iconoclasm doesn't give Muslims the right to smash the images of other peoples' gods. It would make far more sense to tell a Muslim this.

People on these boards do more complaining about Islam instead of having an intellectual dialogue with them. when I first came back on these boards my one critique of Islamic theology had to do with Islam, pre-determinism, and freewill. A couple Muslims engaged me and we had a great discussion and although I disagreed in part on the freewill aspect I did more studying on my own on how their position came to be. The problem I've seen here is when Muslims do respond in opposition to the idiotic actions of their brethren this is not good enough for people.

It's actually quite difficult to have an intellectual dialogue with people who don't want to admit or even consider there might be a problem with Islam to begin with. See Feargod's post which I'll quote below as an example of this overarching attitude that takes in non-Muslims as well as Muslims. Islam is a perfect religion, apparently. And saying anything to the contrary is intolerant or in Fear's unique way with words: "it's kind of stupid thinking".

A Muslim who has studied Arabic and the Qur'an and is knowledgeable of their faith and could give you and others a litany of examples and could explain why the actions of terrorist groups are not a part of Islam and you guys would still not be satisfied.

Okay, so what about Muslims who have grown up speaking Arabic, know the Quran and are knowledgable about their faiths who actually agree with terrorist groups or, at the very least, hold sympathetic or similar views (i.e. apostates must die) but aren't willing to act on those beliefs? Because you're at the very least implying these people don't understand their own faith because to admit otherwise would undermine your own pre-conceived notions.

I understand why not too many Muslims are not commenting on these subjects. I feel far too many of these types of threads just draws people who have a disdain for Islam and it just becomes a pat on the back discussion.

I can think of a number of reasons for this as well... and no; 'Muslims are stupid' is not one of them.

I really wonder how these guys think, the Statues were there for hundreds of years and
Islam was there for hundreds of years, but if a mob decides today that the statues should
be destroys then it's because of Islam.

I don't know if it's kind of stupid thinking or just an excuse to attack Islam as a religion.

The above is definitely a kind of stupid thinking. This is like saying if a man and a woman live together for 25 years and one day out of the blue the woman kills the man, the woman can't have done it because she lived with the man for so long without any incident. Posts like this are why I feel it's pretty much impossible to have an intellectual discussion with Muslim users on this forum about the problems of Islam - you won't even admit there are any.

Even by your usual standards these mental gymnastics are incredible - self-identified Muslims are saying their aim is to have the statue either covered up or removed and the charity Human Rights Watch has observed the growing, creeping influence of less tolerant kinds of Islam. The fact that they're identifying themselves as Muslims indicates that their is a religious nature to their objections. And let's also bear in mind that this is not an isolated incident. Iconoclasm is becoming more and more mainstream in Indonesian Islam. Back in June an Islamist group got a statue on the outskirts of Jakarta taken down because they feared a campaign of Christianisation (cue the deafening roars of 'racism' and 'Christianophobia').

The fact that the ringleader Didik Muadi has to go out of his way to say "We are tolerant" clearly shows they're not actually that tolerant. Why would they counter said 'tolerance' by going around threatening works of art they deem un-Islamic with destruction?

Here's one other video showing how awful Muslims were during their victory

The fact you have to point to how Muslims acted over a thousand years ago as opposed to anything more recently shows how desperate your argument is. Also, this is Muslims acting in relation to other monotheists - still nothing there to reassure polytheists like myself that our perceptions of Islam are misguided.

 

[Sha'irullah]

Islam is a very insecure religion and this has always bugged me. It claims absolute truth yet the Muslim populous always flexes its muscles when it is convenient to do so, or should I say when they feel safe in the 99.99% number majority.

 

[Sakeenah]

These threads are the reasons why I stick up for Muslims and Islam cause you make a generalization of an entire religion based on the ignorance of a mob mentality. your religion is what? Pagan - Greek polytheism with hints of Daoist & Zoroastrian philosophies sounds like your beliefs are confused to me but hey, it wouldn't be cool to antagonize your confused beliefs right because they make sense to you. Besides I don't know you so why would I, in my right mind make pre-conceived notions of what you believe and why that would make sense to you? Point is we don't know the socio-political climate in that region, nor do we know the education level of the people that inhabit that region, because after all Indonesians in that region do not believe in secular education so you factor in religious fervor with a lack of worldly understanding and socio-political strife you have situations like this. Perhaps you may want to factor all that in instead of your own bigotry.

^ This
@A Greased Scotsman you are making a generalization of indonesian muslims and Islam based on the actions of an extremist minority.

A recent global study by the Pew Foundation found that 79 percent of Indonesians condemn the actions of ISIS and only four percent support it.
Majority of Indonesian Muslims are very tolerant towards other cultures. The incidents you mentioned are intolerant, but it says nothing about muslims and Islam in general. It just shows that yes there are extremists.

If we look at Europe and America we can see that hate crimes towards Muslims and minorities have increased. Mosques have been
vandalised, Muslims have been attacked. Does that mean that all Europeans and Americans are intolerant of other cultures and want Muslims to submit? I don't think that we should generalize or use double standards.

Conclusion..majority of Muslims and non Muslims are peaceful and tolerant. Islam doesn't promote intolerance, but extremists do.

 

[Sha'irullah]

Conclusion..majority of Muslims and non Muslims are peaceful and tolerant. Islam doesn't promote intolerance, but extremists do.

Oh I can say the exact the opposite on those words.

Islam is not by any means tolerable to any other religion. Al-Baqara lays down the tolerance of the religion before it hits the 3rd surah so why bother making this argument?

Do you as a Muslim not enjoy when people like me wish to erect giant statues of other gods? I have never met a Muslim who would even tolerate this in another person's own home unless they were heavily secularized.