Heaven and Hell Are Parties?

[Mindmaster]

What do you mean, "Christians stole" something in the OT to begin. Read Daniel 12.

The "hell" is something they borrowed from the Greeks, and changed to fit their political agenda of enslaving the masses. Very little of Abrahamic religion is original - stolen God, Messiah, and any number of other concepts from other religions. If anything it's just one great repack of the religions before them.

 

[shunyadragon]

I need more explanation as to why people should prefer enjoying eternity with God and not with Hitler and Stalin?!

Describing or citing extremes does not remotely represent the choices and journey of humans in many diverse cultures and religions. The concepts of Heaven and Hell are based on ancient mythology, which Biblically considered them actual physical places in the cosmos.

Virtually all people regardless of claiming to making the best choices regardless of whether they are undescribably evil, or apparently saintly and pure. I believe Biblically no one should make the arrogant claim to being 'saved?' nor judging others who may repent up to the moment of death,

 

[Agent]

Dante in the first circle of hell was met by Voltaire. He met many more inhabitants in hell.
Dante encounters the poets Homer, Horace, Ovid, and Lucan, who include him in their number and make him "sixth in that high company".[26] They reach the base of a great Castle – the dwelling place of the wisest men of antiquity – surrounded by seven gates, and a flowing brook. After passing through the seven gates, the group comes to an exquisite green meadow and Dante encounters the inhabitants of the Citadel. These include figures associated with the Trojans and their descendants (the Romans): Electra (mother of Troy's founder Dardanus), Hector, Aeneas, Julius Caesar in his role as Roman general ("in his armor, falcon-eyed"),[27] Camilla, Penthesilea (Queen of the Amazons), King Latinus and his daughter, Lavinia, Lucius Junius Brutus (who overthrew Tarquin to found the Roman Republic), Lucretia, Julia, Marcia, and Cornelia Africana. Dante also views Saladin, a Muslim military leader known for his struggle against the Crusaders as well as his generous, chivalrous, and merciful conduct.

Dante next encounters a group of philosophers, including Aristotle with Socrates and Plato at his side, as well as Democritus, "Diogenes" (either Diogenes the Cynic or Diogenes of Apollonia), Anaxagoras, Thales, Empedocles, Heraclitus, and "Zeno" (either Zeno of Elea or Zeno of Citium). He sees the scientist Dioscorides; the mythical Greek poets Orpheus and Linus; and Roman statesmen Marcus Tullius Cicero and Seneca. Dante sees the Alexandrian geometer Euclid and Ptolemy, the Alexandrian astronomer and geographer, as well as the physicians Hippocrates and Galen. He also encounters Avicenna, a Persian polymath, and Averroes, a medieval Andalusian polymath known for his commentaries on Aristotle's works. Dante and Virgil depart from the four other poets and continue their journey.

Although Dante implies that all virtuous non-Christians find themselves here, he later encounters two (Cato of Utica and Statius) in Purgatory and two (Trajan and Ripheus) in Heaven. In Purg. XXII, Virgil names several additional inhabitants of Limbo who were not mentioned in the Inferno.[28]

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I led someone to Christ yesterday afternoon, a very nice fellow who trusted Jesus for salvation, and it got me thinking. When people say, "I want to party in Hell with my friends!" do they realize they are saying they have friends like:

• Hitler
• Pol Pot
• Mao Tse Tung
• Stalin

and do people realize the most important thing at a party? It's not the food, entertainment, decorations, venue or time. It's the people.

Heaven is a party where the mix of people contains only those who won't muss a utopia by never sinning/hurting others/causing others pain--the transformed.

Is hell only for those who do grave crimes and those of us without criminal records go to heaven? Is heaven and hell based on our actions (stalin comes to mind) rather than our belief?

Wouldnt it make more sense that Stalin go to heaven when he becomes a believer because his actions don't dictate his destination rather than having a nonbeliever go to heaven because he never not engaged in capitol crimes but only had faith instead?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Although if both Heaven and Hell are parties, then I would assume that Hell is the one with stale beer and STD's.

Nah. That's in Heaven to keep you pure.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I believe you're a bit mixed up if you feel that the God who loves you enough to have died for you is WORSE THAN HITLER.

Is this the result of atheism or drug abuse or ... ?

Nope it was the result of the Old Testament.

 

[Jainarayan]

What in your religious faith and training educated you to make a joke of what other religious people believe?

Because I used to belong to that. I came to realize it doesn’t make sense for me. Not in the way Heaven and Hell are used as baseball bats to the head.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Hitler was Catholic, he had religion, but his actions were antichrist. I have watched several in depth documentaries about the life of Hitler and his life did not display faith in the God of the Bible or trust in Jesus Christ as his Savior. If he believed in any other god besides himself, it was the god of this world, the devil.

This is a pretty bold statement; according to Christianity orthodoxy believers are saved by grace alone. How do you know he did not trust in Christ's redemption? It looks as though you're attempting to disavow Hitler's self-confessed Christianity. To be fair I cannot blame you in the slightest for this.

 

[BilliardsBall]

The "hell" is something they borrowed from the Greeks, and changed to fit their political agenda of enslaving the masses. Very little of Abrahamic religion is original - stolen God, Messiah, and any number of other concepts from other religions. If anything it's just one great repack of the religions before them.

An accusation which is suggested by some scholars without actual evidence. The Hebrew Bible is highly detailed, sophisticated, and the dates tend to flex on these things.

Occam's says, however, the near-universality of certain myths indicates shared religious beliefs from people who knew God. Are you open or closed here?

 

[BilliardsBall]

Describing or citing extremes does not remotely represent the choices and journey of humans in many diverse cultures and religions. The concepts of Heaven and Hell are based on ancient mythology, which Biblically considered them actual physical places in the cosmos.

Virtually all people regardless of claiming to making the best choices regardless of whether they are undescribably evil, or apparently saintly and pure. I believe Biblically no one should make the arrogant claim to being 'saved?' nor judging others who may repent up to the moment of death,

Claiming truth is not arrogant if one actually has truth. Jesus claimed truth and the right to judge--yes, someone can repent on their deathbed. It is reasonable to assume, however, that Hitler and Stalin did no such thing. More important, biblically speaking there are "good people" in Hell because no one is getting into Heaven without moral PERFECTION.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Is hell only for those who do grave crimes and those of us without criminal records go to heaven? Is heaven and hell based on our actions (stalin comes to mind) rather than our belief?

Wouldnt it make more sense that Stalin go to heaven when he becomes a believer because his actions don't dictate his destination rather than having a nonbeliever go to heaven because he never not engaged in capitol crimes but only had faith instead?

BOTH are based on actions. Hell is for sinners, Heaven for the sinless. Simple.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Nope it was the result of the Old Testament.

In BOTH testaments, God is a harsh judge and a loving parent. Work it out!

 

[BilliardsBall]

Because I used to belong to that. I came to realize it doesn’t make sense for me. Not in the way Heaven and Hell are used as baseball bats to the head.

Jesus dying on a cross while forgiving those who crucified Him, and telling people about Heaven and Hell, then letting them have complete free will, is a "baseball bat to the head"?

Like I said, something awkward and religious befell you that wasn't real Christianity.

 

[Twilight Hue]

In BOTH testaments, God is a harsh judge and a loving parent. Work it out!

I did work it out. God is a mythological character in a compilation of books that people happen to think is true .

Anyways after reading the Bible it's rather mystifying as to how people can can even come up with a system of morality and justice with a dieity like that , much less a loving and harsh parent.

If you ask me the entire premise of Christianity not to mention Abrahamic religion overall is that of submission and subservience.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Occam's says, however, the near-universality of certain myths indicates shared religious beliefs from people who knew God. Are you open or closed here?

Hindus, Jews, and Sioux clearly did not have "near universailty" in their myths. And those were vastly different from what the Greeks believed.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

BOTH are based on actions. Hell is for sinners, Heaven for the sinless. Simple.

Those are not my questions. They an honest question not sarcastic.

If Stalin goes to hell for his actions, wouldn't it also make equal sense of he did good actions (no crimes) that would let him go to heaven?

In other words, why would Stalin go to hell in your other comment when his actions don't dictate his destination only if he had belief or faith in Christ?

While on the other hand, if a person doesn't have faith but he did good actions opposite Stalin, would he go to heaven or...?

It can't be just one way. Its both. No need to yell.

I'm trying to make sense of your other post by asking clarification. Clarification is essential in a discussion for it to be productive. Your comment above doesn't do that.

 

[InChrist]

This is a pretty bold statement; according to Christianity orthodoxy believers are saved by grace alone. How do you know he did not trust in Christ's redemption? It looks as though you're attempting to disavow Hitler's self-confessed Christianity. To be fair I cannot blame you in the slightest for this.

A very obvious reason that Hitler could not have been an authentic Christian is because he was determined to destroy the Jewish people. He hated the Jews, therefore he hated God. Jesus was a Jew, the first Christians were all Jews, and the nation of Israel was and is beloved by God. Hitler, whatever his self-proclaimed religious claims were, demonstrated by his actions that he was antichrist and against the God of of the Bible, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the God of Israel.

 

[BilliardsBall]

I did work it out. God is a mythological character in a compilation of books that people happen to think is true .

Anyways after reading the Bible it's rather mystifying as to how people can can even come up with a system of morality and justice with a dieity like that , much less a loving and harsh parent.

If you ask me the entire premise of Christianity not to mention Abrahamic religion overall is that of submission and subservience.

Interesting. So if a powerful God exists and judges, submission and subservience is a bad idea?

 

[BilliardsBall]

Hindus, Jews, and Sioux clearly did not have "near universailty" in their myths. And those were vastly different from what the Greeks believed.

Huh? All four of the groups you cited look at works, believe in works coming back on the individual, believe in one chief deity who created all, believe in end times judgment...

 

[BilliardsBall]

Those are not my questions. They an honest question not sarcastic.

If Stalin goes to hell for his actions, wouldn't it also make equal sense of he did good actions (no crimes) that would let him go to heaven?

In other words, why would Stalin go to hell in your other comment when his actions don't dictate his destination only if he had belief or faith in Christ?

While on the other hand, if a person doesn't have faith but he did good actions opposite Stalin, would he go to heaven or...?

It can't be just one way. Its both. No need to yell.

I'm trying to make sense of your other post by asking clarification. Clarification is essential in a discussion for it to be productive. Your comment above doesn't do that.

Sorry for putting both in all caps. Not yelling inside, I just don't always feel like using italics. CAPS is faster for me.

Stalin isn't in Hell for his actions or in Heaven for his actions. Rather, the Bible puts it this way:

1) Utopias need perfect citizens

2) People today aren't ready to live in utopia - they act against conscience and hurt themselves and others

3) Jesus wants everyone in Heaven, everyone who trusts Him for salvation receives of His divine power in the end to be enabled to live in a utopia--I will never again hurt someone and will never again go against conscience

4) All those who are not transformed are quarantined from the morally perfect - the entire known universe will be purged and remade, the imperfect will be barred and separated

Heaven and Hell aren't rewards and punishments for behavior, they are separating the clean from the unclean for future, not present actions.