DIR Forums Take Two

[Brent W]

After reading all the feedback we are going to go with the following and see how that works over the next few weeks:

• No one will be able to access any DIR without first selecting which DIRs they wish to be a part of.
• There will be no limit on how many you can join though they must be within reason.

You can now select which ones you can join via check boxes here: https://www.religiousforums.com/account/personal-details

Currently if you join a parent forum of one DIR you will have access to all subforums. This may or may not change in the future depending on further feedback.

It may take up to an hour for you to get access once you make your selections.

Please keep in mind this can and likely will evolve over time based on feedback or shortcomings we find. Please be patient with us and give us time to gauge how it is working.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask here.

 

[sun rise]

What? Paying attention to feedback? Changing a plan to something more workable? Horrors.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

What about DIR enforce (or is this working like the private forums?)? And what of someone who makes the claim they belong but have very shaky ground for this claim and hold numerous views that are contrary to what they claim? And will outsiders still be able to ask questions in the DIR?

 

[Sw. Vandana Jyothi]

After reading all the feedback we are going to go with the following and see how that works over the next few weeks:

• No one will be able to access any DIR without first selecting which DIRs they wish to be a part of.
• There will be no limit on how many you can join though they must be within reason.

You can now select which ones you can join via check boxes here: https://www.religiousforums.com/account/personal-details

Currently if you join a parent forum of one DIR you will have access to all subforums. This may or may not change in the future depending on further feedback.

It may take up to an hour for you to get access once you make your selections.

Please keep in mind this can and likely will evolve over time based on feedback or shortcomings we find. Please be patient with us and give us time to gauge how it is working.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask here.

Please, Brent, please. You were non-responsive in the closed thread re this and I ask the question again, as you have invited questions in this thread. Please explain the problem you are trying to solve??!

 

[Twilight Hue]

Some dirs aside from those obvious as being core religions are vauge like the seekers dir for instance that can be interpreted as multi faith, multi use, not to mention those who are interacting or partaking in several other religions. My question is the limitations as to how many dirs could be chosen by any one individual.

 

[Rival]

Please, Brent, please. You were non-responsive in the closed thread re this and I ask the question again, as you have invited questions in this thread. Please explain the problem you are trying to solve??!

Rule 10 violations.

 

[Brent W]

What about DIR enforce? Often people who don't identify post in them, and keep on posting and posting even after someone has pointed out it's a DIR, or someone makes the claim they belong but have very shaky ground for this claim and hold numerous views that are contrary to what they claim? And will outsiders still be able to ask questions in the DIR?

We can remove their ability to post within that DIR now. Also, they would have to actually choose that DIR from the list to be given access to it in the first please. Accidental posting within DIRs should not happen now.

Please, Brent, please. You were non-responsive in the closed thread re this and I ask the question again, as you have invited questions in this thread. Please explain the problem you are trying to solve??!

See above.

Some dirs aside from those obvious as being core religions are vauge like the seekers dir for instance that can be interpreted as multi faith, multi use, not to mention those who are interacting or partaking in several other religions. My question is the limitations as to how many dirs could be chosen by any one individual.

There is no hard limit right now or will there probably be. Its a use your best judgement at the moment right now. Like I said, this will evolve over time as we try to find the perfect balance.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

I dutifully read all 4 pages of the previous DIR selection announcement thread. As I read further in, I was saddened to see what appeared to be a deliberate attempt to stifle inter-faith communication (I'm new, so all of this is new to me). But I pushed forward, and some pointed out that the DIR sections were intended to be (more or less) a single "voice", a kind of "safe haven" free from detractors. Okay... I get that I think.

But quickly enough, several pointed out that you simply cannot pound people into a single box, unless they are willing to participate in the fitting.

One of the things I really love about humans: they are, more often than not, like chameleons. I think it's a function of both empathy and being social creatures, but what do I know? Ha!

The interim solution of permitting multiple DIR selection seems a workable one. Unfortunately? For some of us, that is still too limiting... but I see that without such self-limitations, participation is Right Out.

Oh well. If you found a Magical Solution that Pleased Everyone, within 5 minutes, some who were previously pleased would suddenly feel compelled to Change Their Mind. <eyeroll>

I must ponder this latest development, before committing. I have, as yet, not participated in supporting (but had planned to), I must now think about that as well.

I'm not a fan of restriction of communications between people of differing views.

How else are we ever going to learn, if we only play in an echo chamber?

 

[Rival]

How else are we ever going to learn, if we only play in an echo chamber?

The Interfaith forums.

 

[Brent W]

We are not restricting anything really. We have always had Rule 10 and we are now just trying to create an atmosphere where we don't have to issue those violations anymore.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

We can remove their ability to post within that DIR now. Also, they would have to actually choose that DIR from the list to be given access to it in the first please. Accidental posting within DIRs should not happen now.

Would there still be a way for outsiders to ask questions?

 

[Quintessence]

What about DIR enforce? Often people who don't identify post in them, and keep on posting and posting even after someone has pointed out it's a DIR, or someone makes the claim they belong but have very shaky ground for this claim and hold numerous views that are contrary to what they claim?

It seems to me this change doesn't impact how we would enforce Rule 10. We'd still assess Rule 10 violations as they are reported to us. Reports are really key - the staff team don't assess content until it gets reported to us. We sometimes initiate reports ourselves, but member reports are important especially for DIR areas where staff members don't have much reason to be reading them except for the DIRs they belong to.

Our policy about DIR membership has been to take members at their word with respect to DIR identification unless we are given sound reason to suspect otherwise. Then, we assess it on a case-by-case basis. Seems to me that system will still work just fine with the changes Brent has made to the DIR architecture. And it will hopefully spare us guesswork when members don't bother listing their religion and then start posting in DIRs.

 

[Quintessence]

Would there still be a way for outsiders to ask questions?

I'm just going to copy myself from the other thread... lol

I haven't read through the whole thread yet, but I wanted to respond to this bit here. When we were doing revisions to Rule 10, we had considered making DIRs exclusive areas where respectful questions would not be permitted. There wasn't enough staff input for that change at that time, so we rolled out a Rule 10 that allowed respectful questions as usual. At the same time, we created the "Religions Q&A" subforum under "Interfaith Discussion" that was intended to be the space for those respectful questions. So there is an architecture in place for this now, and it allows any knowledgable members to respond.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

The Interfaith forums.

Thanks for the info... as I previously stated, I'm new, and this is all new to me.

In truth, the top-down origination of the entire site, is quite confusing to me. And I come from a computing background-- (started with an original IBM pc in 1981.... DOS 1.0...).

But I didn't let that stop me, instead, I used other tools-- the right-hand side-bar list of "hot topics" with a brief summary of each, is what I typically turn too-- once opened, I do pay attention to it's parent heading, lest I accidentally stumble into an area where dissent is frowned upon (DIR, as I understand them).

So far, that has worked well enough for me.

I'm still kinda baffled about all the Hubbub, though.... (re: DIRs)

 

[Revoltingest]

We are not restricting anything really. We have always had Rule 10 and we are now just trying to create an atmosphere where we don't have to issue those violations anymore.

I like your choice of words....
"...have to issue violations..."
Denying choice in the matter...pish posh!

Please excuse my French.
I was overcome with emotion.

Will the other restricted forums given the same treatment?

 

[Quetzal]

Thanks @Brent W for the time put in!

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

After reading all the feedback we are going to go with the following and see how that works over the next few weeks:

• No one will be able to access any DIR without first selecting which DIRs they wish to be a part of.
• There will be no limit on how many you can join though they must be within reason.

You can now select which ones you can join via check boxes here: https://www.religiousforums.com/account/personal-details

Currently if you join a parent forum of one DIR you will have access to all subforums. ...

This suggests that there is no criteria to my participation in a DIR other than my desire to do so.

So a couple of questions:

• Having selected Abrahamic Religions DIR, do I have the same access to the Christianity DIR as a Christian member?
• Can a self-proclaimed atheist select both Non-Theistic/Non-Religious-Beliefs DIR and the Abrahamic Religions DIR and claim access rights to each?

 

[Revoltingest]

In truth, the top-down origination of the entire site, is quite confusing to me. And I come from a computing background-- (started with an original IBM pc in 1981.... DOS 1.0...).

Oooooo...advanced technology.
I started in 1969 with punched paper tape fed into a teletype machine.

 

[Sw. Vandana Jyothi]

We are not restricting anything really. We have always had Rule 10 and we are now just trying to create an atmosphere where we don't have to issue those violations anymore.

Thank you for clarifying the problem, Brent (I assume that's what your "like" of Rival's post indicates). I read the preamble to the Summary of RF rules and to me, the solution is glaring me in the face. It IS your prolonged leniency with posters which is the problem. Violations and points, scales of censure, increasing penalties? Why in the world would you give someone with such disregard for the rules of the forum so many, many chances to straighten out their act? A troll is a troll is a troll. Why let them pollute our spaces over and over again, cause unnecessary work for the mods, disrupt the peaceful exchange of ideas which happens here?

Please reconsider a different approach to the problem of Rule 10 violations. This is a forum for adults. If one or a bunch of kids won't play by the rules, bust 'em and invite them to go _______ (fill in the blank) somebody's else's playground.

 

[Revoltingest]

Thanks @Brent W for the time put in!

Sucking up to management, eh?
Expecting better treatment?

Hmmm.....
Thanx, Bret!
And nice doggie!