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Crossbreed atheism with spirituality

atanu

Member
Premium Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?
 

Nimos

Well-Known Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?

Being an atheist my self, I don't really like the classification used or said in another way, I don't really like having to "tag" myself as being this and that. As I don't really care, Ill prefer people asking me, what I believe instead and then they can throw me in whatever group they think I fit. Because besides being an atheist and sharing that view, I might not share anything else with other atheists in regards to how I view life. But by wearing the label of "atheist", which obviously help quickly clarifying my position towards the existence of a God as we know it. I would agree, that aggressive atheism, is not really helping me out at least. As I don't share the view, that im in a much better position than one that does believe is, when it comes to answering life's important questions, and personally don't have that huge a problem with simply not knowing the answer to these things. Which I understand is what is meant or might be meant with the word spirituality in regards to atheist.

I don't think that atheist should attack others, because of their beliefs simply because they don't agree or understand them. But on the other side, any idea, religious or non religious, that can end up causing harm to others out of ignorance, ought to be proofed to such a degree that there is no doubt that it is beneficial or good for humans. If it can not, it should be fought in the sense that the result of the idea or the spreading of it, is punished as a crime.

To give two examples:
"Lets say that a religion teaches that each morning the parents should beat their child, so it remembers how good God is."
Unless they can without a doubt proof why such thing is beneficial or good for the child. The parents should be charged with child abuse. And those spreading and convincing people of doing it should be charged for encouraging child abuse.

"If some atheist "leader" encourage other atheist to go beat up religious people"
They should be equally charged as well.

I do think, if that is what is meant, that you will find atheists that due to not really knowing how to make sense of things, are simply riding the wave of "hate" or "ignorance" to destroy religions, is simply doing it, because they need to feel part of something as they can't really figure out, what else to do or believe. But for whatever reason they might have, religious views just can't be true. So having a common "enemy" is quite a strong and effective way to feel united with other people.

So simply because atheists might use a lot of the same arguments, doesn't mean that we have anything else in common.

Don't know if that even came close to answering your question :D
 
Last edited:

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?


Atheism : disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.

Nothing more, nothing less, anything else you attribute to is is nothing more than confirmation bias.

And this is not the first anti atheism thread you have started, i am beginning to wonder if there is a deeper underlying aggression toward atheists as a driving force.
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
Atheism : disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.

Nothing more, nothing less, anything else you attribute to is is nothing more than confirmation bias.

And this is not the first anti atheism thread you have started, i am beginning to wonder if there is a deeper underlying aggression toward atheists as a driving force.

What is anti atheist in this? Do you or do you not agree to the contents of a paper published in ‘Secularism & Non religion.Org ’ portal.

Have you perused the paper?
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
Being an atheist my self, I don't really like the classification used or said in another way, I don't really like having to "tag" myself as being this and that. As I don't really care, Ill prefer people asking me, what I believe instead and then they can throw me in whatever group they think I fit. Because besides being an atheist and sharing that view, I might not share anything else with other atheists in regards to how I view life. But by wearing the label of "atheist", which obviously help quickly clarifying my position towards the existence of a God as we know it. I would agree, that aggressive atheism, is not really helping me out at least. As I don't share the view, that im in a much better position than one that does believe is, when it comes to answering life's important questions, and personally don't have that huge a problem with simply not knowing the answer to these things. Which I understand is what is meant or might be meant with the word spirituality in regards to atheist.

I don't think that atheist should attack others, because of their beliefs simply because they don't agree or understand them. But on the other side, any idea, religious or non religious, that can end up causing harm to others out of ignorance, ought to be proofed to such a degree that there is no doubt that it is beneficial or good for humans. If it can not, it should be fought in the sense that the result of the idea or the spreading of it, is punished as a crime.

To give two examples:
"Lets say that a religion teaches that each morning the parents should beat their child, so it remembers how good God is."
Unless they can without a doubt proof why such thing is beneficial or good for the child. The parents should be charged with child abuse. And those spreading and convincing people of doing it should be charged for encouraging child abuse.

"If some atheist "leader" encourage other atheist to go beat up religious people"
They should be equally charged as well.

I do think, if that is what is meant, that you will find atheists that due to not really knowing how to make sense of things, are simply riding the wave of "hate" or "ignorance" to destroy religions, is simply doing it, because they need to feel part of something as they can't really figure out, what else to do or believe. But for whatever reason they might have, religious views just can't be true. So having a common "enemy" is quite a strong and effective way to feel united with other people.

So simply because atheists might use a lot of the same arguments, doesn't mean that we have anything else in common.

Don't know if that even came close to answering your question :D

Thank you for taking time to answer.:)

Actually, I asked whether one agrees to the conclusions in the linked paper. @Woberts was on point.
 

Nimos

Well-Known Member
Thank you for taking time to answer.:)

Actually, I asked whether one agrees to the conclusions in the linked paper. @Woberts was on point.

Are ok, I assume that this is the conclusion you are asking about then:

In conclusion, our comparison highlights the variety of configurations of atheism(s), and their accompanying phenomena, functions, and goals, which always depend on social situations and the individuals affecting it. It brings forth the need to emphasize that atheism and criticism of religion are two different things: not all atheists are critical towards religions, and also that atheists can view religion as having positive and useful aspects. Moreover, there has been a growing criticism among scholars of religion towards the unhelpful dichotomy between the ‘secular’ and the ‘religious’ and it is surprising to find that even some strands of atheism are interested in a blurring of these boundaries – although their final goals can be exactly opposite.

The “rise of the nones” demonstrates that a growing population of people is willing to fulfill their spiritual abilities and needs without traditional monotheistic religions (Taylor 2007) and there are multitudes of possibilities how that can be done. Here, the Soviet experience of “forced” atheism provides an interesting case study. For some reason (a language barrier?), comparative studies of Soviet atheism with contemporary Western atheism have been neglected, yet they can offer interesting insights and have “comparative and theoretical importance for studies of religion and modernity” (Luehrmann 2015: 12).


Without knowing all the ins and outs, I would say that I agree to what is concluded here :).
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
What is anti atheist in this? Do you or do you not agree to the contents of a paper published in ‘Secularism & Non religion.Org ’ portal.

Have you perused the paper?


You associated "aggressive" with atheism several times in the op.

As to the article, it is a view i dont agree with, nationslism is not stheism
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
Are ok, I assume that this is the conclusion you are asking about then:

In conclusion, our comparison highlights the variety of configurations of atheism(s), and their accompanying phenomena, functions, and goals, which always depend on social situations and the individuals affecting it. It brings forth the need to emphasize that atheism and criticism of religion are two different things: not all atheists are critical towards religions, and also that atheists can view religion as having positive and useful aspects. Moreover, there has been a growing criticism among scholars of religion towards the unhelpful dichotomy between the ‘secular’ and the ‘religious’ and it is surprising to find that even some strands of atheism are interested in a blurring of these boundaries – although their final goals can be exactly opposite.

The “rise of the nones” demonstrates that a growing population of people is willing to fulfill their spiritual abilities and needs without traditional monotheistic religions (Taylor 2007) and there are multitudes of possibilities how that can be done. Here, the Soviet experience of “forced” atheism provides an interesting case study. For some reason (a language barrier?), comparative studies of Soviet atheism with contemporary Western atheism have been neglected, yet they can offer interesting insights and have “comparative and theoretical importance for studies of religion and modernity” (Luehrmann 2015: 12).


Without knowing all the ins and outs, I would say that I agree to what is concluded here :).

Yes. Especially the first paragraph.
 

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Does any atheist agree?
I certainly agreed with this when I self-identified as an atheist. It is what led in no small part to me dropping the atheist designation, since "spirituality" was decried as "woo", mocked, deried, ridiculed, etc., equating all of it as magical casper the friendly ghost type beliefs. It showed me that it's claim to rationality, was not actually rational at all, but just another form of "I've got the real truth now", flip-side of the 'convert to the true religion' irrationality coin. One just needs to read The God Delusion, to confirm this. Trying to be accepted as a "spiritual atheist", was looked down on as still not being over religion yet, a half-awake atheist, or some other such self-delusion to justify it's irrational allergies to anything remotely religious.

I just saw this video a couple weeks ago, which I was saying back in the day is the only way atheism as an "ism" can rise above this "religiosity" in decrying spirituality. Atheism 2.0 is a good step forward, but I envision a 3.0, 4.0, and higher versions of it where the baby of spirituality is rescuded from the bathwater of mythic beliefs, and embraced as an important, and inescapable part of all human life experience, and get over it's 1.0 allergy to anything even remotely associated with religion, knee-jerking "we're not a belief", type responses. I find this video below to be a step in the right direction. Iconoclasm for the sake of saying how stupid the old guard was, is just another form of the same silliness.

I am not the only one from within atheism to recognize this.
 

ecco

Veteran Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?

I can not understand what you wrote.
I can not understand what the authors are trying to say in the Abstract.

Therefore, I cannot agree or disagree.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
It is in the paper.



What is ‘nationslism is not stheism’?


So we can assume the authors also suffer with confirmation bias.

It was an error, you will see them often. It should have read "nationslism is not atheism".
 

PureX

Veteran Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?
There is a new 'strain' of atheism that has turned the process of science into a revered totem of their philosophical materialism, and thereby ignore and denigrate any and all human endeavors of a conceptual, spiritual, or metaphysical nature as being delusional. And this is an attitude/position that is quite rightly perceived by others as being fundamentally inhuman.
 

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?

A lot depends on what you mean by the term 'spirituality'. For the vast majority of people, I think, it brings about some image of a supernatural. But it also relates to some common human issues of how to mark life events, find meaning in life, understand our place in society and in the universe, etc. While the supernatural aspects of spirituality tend not to be of interest to atheists, the latter, social and meaning-based aspects most certainly are.

So, most people want some form of ritual for major life events: marriages, deaths, births, etc. These rituals are generally helpful in understanding our place in society as well as sharing those life events with loved ones. This desire for societal ritual is also often shared by those who don't believe in a deity or, for that matter, any sort of supernatural. Yet these rituals are often designated as 'spiritual' since religion has often been the core institution dealing with these aspects of life.

Denying this desire for societal ritual and meaning will turn many people off of atheism.

On the other hand, the mental discipline of meditation and the consequent health benefits are another aspect of 'spirituality' that Sam Harris, for example promotes quite a bit. And, once again, there is nothing inherent in meditation that requires a belief in a supernatural. As a mental discipline that can promote various forms of health, it is a 'spiritual' path that can be quite meaningful and useful for those who are atheists.
 

Nimos

Well-Known Member
I certainly agreed with this when I self-identified as an atheist. It is what led in no small part to me dropping the atheist designation, since "spirituality" was decried as "woo", mocked, deried, ridiculed, etc., equating all of it as magical casper the friendly ghost type beliefs. It showed me that it's claim to rationality, was not actually rational at all, but just another form of "I've got the real truth now", flip-side of the 'convert to the true religion' irrationality coin. One just needs to read The God Delusion, to confirm this. Trying to be accepted as a "spiritual atheist", was looked down on as still not being over religion yet, a half-awake atheist, or some other such self-delusion to justify it's irrational allergies to anything remotely religious.

What you are describing here, I would agree is an issue when it comes to all these labels that are thrown around, like they're some sort of scout achievements, the more the better. :) But it does cause some issues when these tags are defined differently by people. So as you say if you believe anything which cant be explained by science, then you are not an "real" atheist. I personally think that is an incorrect way to use the word, because just because something is currently not explained. Let say some sort of spirits, if some were to believe in that, doesn't mean that it need to be a God or something divine of any sort. For some reason, things like that always need to be "greater" than us, it can't just be different or maybe an unexplained side of the universe or nature that we don't get yet. So why a God need to be involved is not really clear to me. Also I think its a bit arrogant way of looking at things, taking into account how young the human race is compared to the universe 14.7 billion year and the homo sapiens have existent approximately 200.000 years, as far as I know. And first in the last couple of 1000 years started to explore these things and already we know everything about everything. Lots of atheist can accept quantum physics, even though that is extremely difficult to get your head around, I think. But that doesn't need a God for them to believe that. Which is mostly because we now know that its correct. But that also took some time before it were really accepted.

Its fine to say that one don't believe in someone claiming that spirits exists due to lack of evidence for it, but that shouldn't be connected to atheism as I see it. But to common sense to not just accept it and skepticism towards everything for which we have no evidence to back it up with.
 

A Vestigial Mote

Well-Known Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?
To be honest, I truly believe that "spirituality" in all its forms leads a person to conceit. What I believe drives a person to seek matters of "spiritual" significance is the basic belief/desire/hope that their life means a great deal to some unseen force controlling their "destiny." That they have some higher purpose and just need to find the right "key" that opens the "lock" - and there's the end! "Enlightenment" or "self-realization" or some kind of power over their interactions with the world. They believe they are deserving of such.

While I believe the truth is that we're all just self-aware ships carrying trillions of individual life-forms. What we do and do not do is of no significance to anyone/anything but ourselves. And that is not a bad thing in the slightest. Anyone who thinks it is I would tend to label arrogant/conceited from the out-set.
 

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic Bully ☿
Premium Member
Authors suggest:

There is case that aggressive strand of atheism: in the Soviet case, Khrushchev-era atheist propaganda and in the contemporary Western case, the “New Atheism” had been/is a factor in giving rise to atheist spirituality.

There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life. Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Secularism and Nonreligion

Does any atheist agree?
Top down, authoritarian-based atheist religion is just as bad as top down, authoritarian based theistic religions, in that they tend to dumb-down individuals with dogma. The bottom-up, grassroots type, where individuals investigate for themselves and compare their findings is much more conducive to individual development, imo.

As for critiquing monotheistic religions: is there not a maxim to "test the spirits?" Why is critiquing seen as a bad thing? When atheists have to remind religious zealots that killing and terrorism is wrong, it's a pretty good sign that the spirit that inspired the killing and terrorism needs to be questioned, critiqued, and tested. (Of course, it goes both ways--if militant atheists went on a terrorism and/or killing spree, then their spirit would also need to be questioned, critiqued, and tested.) I would say that Thich Nhat Hanh got it right when he said (in Living Buddha, Living Christ) that the Holy Spirit does not overcome your mind--when you are full of mindfulness, you are also full of the holy spirit.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
There is recognition in some that opposition to something or even factors that are often associated with atheism (such as rationality, naturalism, science, criticism of religion) do not necessarily provide a deeper meaningfulness or purpose in life.

No, they do not, but that is not the value of reason. Knowing what is true by itself is of no immediate value. By itself, reason is empty of all things that make life worth living. The value of reason is in its application in helping us manage our feelings, emotions and deeper experiences. With nothing going on in consciousness except reasoning, life is as empty as some imagine it is for all atheists.

The mature, contemplative, self-actualized secular humanist has many more faculties and types of experiences at his disposal than just reason, including a faculty for experiencing a sense of mystery, awe, gratitude, and connectivity when contemplating reality, which are among the richest of experiences available to any human being. This is atheist spirituality. No gods involved.

The value of reason and a liberal education are to learn how to think critically, and to amass a useful data base of facts and values in order to navigate the world more effectively, and to have a greater experience living within one's head. By themselves, such ideas generate nothing worth living for.

For example, an understanding of what stars are, their distances, and their life cycles deeply enriches the experience of gazing up at the night sky. The following is an excerpt from an Internet video from an anonymous atheist that illustrates how reason and understanding can lead to an authentic spiritual experience in an atheist:

"When I looked at the galaxy that night, I knew the faintest twinkle of starlight was a real connection between my comprehending eye along a narrow beam of light to the surface of another sun. The photons my eyes detect (the light I see, the energy with which my nerves interact) came from that star. I thought I could never touch it, yet something from it crosses the void and touches me. I might never have known. My eyes saw only a tiny point of light, but my mind saw so much more.

"If God exists, God made this [photo of a galaxy]. Look at it. Face it. Accept it. Adjust to it, because this is ... how God works. God would probably want you to look at it. To learn about it. To try to understand it. But if you can’t look — if you won’t even try to understand — what does that say about your religion?"

[snip]

"To even partially comprehend the scale of a single galaxy is to almost disappear. And when you remember all the other galaxies, you shrink 100 billion times smaller still. But then you remember what you are. The same facts that made you feel so insignificant also tell you how you got here. It’s like you become more real, or maybe the universe becomes more real. You suddenly fit. You suddenly belong. You do not have to bow down. You do not have to look away. In such moments, all you have to do is remember to keep breathing."

[snip]

"The body of a newborn baby is as old as the cosmos. The form is new and unique, but the materials are 13.7 billion years old, processed by nuclear fusion in stars, fashioned by electromagnetism. Cold words for amazing processes. And that baby was you. Is you. You’re amazing. Not only alive, but with a mind ... When I compare what scientific knowledge has done for me and what religion tried to do to me, I sometimes literally shiver."

I assume that that kind of thing - atheistic spirituality - is foreign to most theists. It would be to the believers who depict atheists as empty, robotic reasoners.

We don't expect theists to understand or acknowledge these experiences. They tend to confuse spirituality with spirits like angels and gods, and then label unbelievers as empty vessels for not holding such beliefs.

I see it the other way around. I find nothing spiritual about choosing to believe in creatures not in evidence.

Instead, failing to produce a positive alternative for religion in combination with the aggressive rhetoric results in a bad reputation for atheism.

Atheism's bad reputation comes from theists demeaning atheists. As Christianity has receded in the West, so has the marginalization and demonization of atheists. In fact, with these changes, atheists have finally gotten a voice, and they are using it to contradict the theists, which is routinely called militant atheism. Remarkably, we're asked to respect the beliefs of people who do this, people who never offered any respect for atheists, the same people who once made it difficult or impossible for atheists to teach, coach, adopt, serve on jury, or hold elected office because of the derogation of atheists as immoral and unfit for such activities.

Any "aggressive rhetoric" from atheists in reaction to that is just. We are mostly honest, hard-working, productive members of society trying to live our lives decently and constructively, and to leave the world a little better place than we found it. If somebody wants to make us out to be mindless, empty, spiritually dead automatons, they're going to see a rebuttal like this one.

And we have a positive alternative to religion. Secular humanism, which celebrates mankind even as Christianity tells us that we are all sinners that need to be cured of that sickness so as not to be punished forever, a cure man is incapable of providing for himself. You don't find anything that dark in secular humanism. It will tell you that human beings are born with the potential to become peaceful, kind, loving, industrious, honest, and the like on their own if nurtured and educated under the proper circumstances..What religion offers a more upbeat worldview than that?

Isn't anything that substitutes for religion and generates equal or higher quality people living equally or more happy lives better than religion? Sure, it's great that people with needs that can only be met with religions have those needs met by it, but that is not an envious position to be in. Better to have those needs met without religion, just as it's great that eyeglasses are available for people that can't see well without them, but isn't it better to not need them in the first place - to have clear vision without help?

I certainly agreed with this when I self-identified as an atheist. It is what led in no small part to me dropping the atheist designation, since "spirituality" was decried as "woo", mocked, deried, ridiculed, etc., equating all of it as magical casper the friendly ghost type beliefs. It showed me that it's claim to rationality, was not actually rational at all, but just another form of "I've got the real truth now",

I am proud to be an atheist and secular humanist. I have no need to mock the religious for being religious.

As for having the truth, the sine qua non of a correct idea is the ability of that idea to predict outcomes so that desirable ones can be maximized and undesirable ones minimized. The best ideas of modernity come out of the Enlightenment and the eventual replacement of faith-based systems of thought like astrology, creationism, and the divine right of kings. These are all sterile or oppressive ideas that slowed the progress of mankind. These were replaced with the modern, liberal, secular democratic state with guaranteed rights and freedoms for all improving the lives of former serfs and subjects subject to the whim of an autocrat. And astronomy replaced astrology, another rich and useful set of ideas replacing a sterile, faith-based system of thought.

By that reckoning, we atheists do have the truth, or are much closer to it than the religious, whose ideas, like creationism, can't be used for anything.

Top down, authoritarian-based atheist religion is just as bad as top down, authoritarian based theistic religions,

There is no such thing as atheist religion. There are no hierarchies in atheism, so there is no top to go down from, and nobody to give or take orders. People like Dawkins and Harris have no more authority than the persuasive power of their words.
 
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