Christians who oppose homosexuality

[Petriebird]

Because you have angry eyes.

lol

ARRGGGGHHHHHH

how ya like them apples?

 

[Petriebird]

I have 3 children. The oldest is 22 and an honor student at Pomona College. She wants to work in the non-profit sector reducing poverty and helping development in the third world. The youngest was neglected by her irresponsible heterosexual parents, and the county asked us to care for her as we would provide a more stable and caring home. Do you really want to call me a bad parent? Do you know any gay or lesbian parents personally? Didn't anyone ever tell you that it's wrong to spread lies and prejudice about other groups of people?

I have been a responsible parent for 22 years. All the gay and lesbian parents I know are responsible, caring, and doing a heckuva job. I know a wonderful gay man, a hospice chaplain, who has provided a caring home for two boys neglected and abused by their irresponsible heterosexual parents. He deserves a medal, and your personal thanks for helping society deal with this heterosexual problem.

Heterosexuals are the problem; homosexuals are part of the solution. Are you? And no, it's not funny.

I'm not attacking you, I think your a good person. Your missing my attitude here.... I'm saying that the people that I have known are irresponsible...... I'm sorry if my wording isn't getting this through..... I'm trying to say that based on my experiences.... homosexuals are worldly and irresponsible and wouldn't make the greatest of parents. What I probably should have added in was that I don't view this as being all homosexuals. I don't view that it is the best situation however you yourself are living proof that it is possible.

I'm sorry if I have offended you, you are apparently a good parent and homosexual.

I'm just trying to express why I feel the way I do.... why I have such a struggle with the morality of homosexuality....... I'm just stating my experiences.

The first church I ever went to was one that accepted homosexuals.... I have left that church but mostly due to other reasons...... but part of me deep inside felt uneasy with it and i'm trying to understand why I have a problem with homosexuality.

 

[Petriebird]

Wait--you call us dysfunctional, and that's fine, but when he calls you dysfunctional, you want to know why he's so angry? Oh, I don't know, maybe it's because of your double-standard? Here's something every Christian should learn:

"Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them."

everyone is dysfunctional not just homosexuals

 

[Wannabe Yogi]

I don't see physical love as poison.... I'm sorry if it sounded like I made that point.

The bible even says that it is not wrong for a married man and a woman to be involved with one another sexualy.... however the bible does state that it is due to the weakness of their flesh. And when I read that I see weakness.... not an out to do what I want.

Trust me.... it's not easy for me to try and uphold this belief..... it's very hard and i'm working on it

Many folks in the past have given up their personal life for a higher calling. This is a high wonderful goal. The problem arises when they point and judge others. Pride and bigotry taints all who engage in it. No matter their values. ( this is a general comment not aimed at you)

 

[Autodidact]

I'm not attacking you, I think your a good person. Your missing my attitude here.... I'm saying that the people that I have known are irresponsible...... I'm sorry if my wording isn't getting this through..... I'm trying to say that based on my experiences.... homosexuals are worldly and irresponsible and wouldn't make the greatest of parents. What I probably should have added in was that I don't view this as being all homosexuals. I don't view that it is the best situation however you yourself are living proof that it is possible.

I'm sorry if I have offended you, you are apparently a good parent and homosexual.

I'm just trying to express why I feel the way I do.... why I have such a struggle with the morality of homosexuality....... I'm just stating my experiences.

The first church I ever went to was one that accepted homosexuals.... I have left that church but mostly due to other reasons...... but part of me deep inside felt uneasy with it and i'm trying to understand why I have a problem with homosexuality.

Good, it's always good to be open to learning. My guess is that you are a young male, and the gay people you have met are also young men at a certain stage of their lives.

What makes gay people, on average, better parents than straight people is that we don't have children by accident. It's not that gay people are better than straight people, it's that, due to Biology, all of our children are wanted and planned for. That is a good thing.

I'm also guessing that the young men you know are not parents, which is a good thing. If they were heterosexual, they might well be, which would be a bad thing.

I advise you to meet some gay parents before you make any more allegations about us being bad parents. At a minimum. You also might want to review the research in this area. If you like, I will start a thread.

You can imagine that if I stated that Christians were bad parents, you might object. Again, always good to remember that golden rule before posting.

 

[Autodidact]

everyone is dysfunctional not just homosexuals

In that case it's a meaningless, useless term we can discard from discussion.

 

[Mr Cheese]

The bible says that god is opposed to it

some would dispute this

also Jesus himself actually never mentions it

 

[Mr Cheese]

Not in the least. You just do not like to hear anything said against homosexuality. That unfortunately is your problem. Time you grew up and started to be honest with yourself. Maybe then your sexual immaturity would then have a chance of redemption. That also go for heterosexuals who have preoccupations with sex...

considerign your marital problems which you have discussed here before
do you not think that you may have a very biased and perhaps warped view of sex, sexuality and any topic related to this in general?

 

[Petriebird]

Good, it's always good to be open to learning. My guess is that you are a young male, and the gay people you have met are also young men at a certain stage of their lives.

What makes gay people, on average, better parents than straight people is that we don't have children by accident. It's not that gay people are better than straight people, it's that, due to Biology, all of our children are wanted and planned for. That is a good thing.

I'm also guessing that the young men you know are not parents, which is a good thing. If they were heterosexual, they might well be, which would be a bad thing.

I advise you to meet some gay parents before you make any more allegations about us being bad parents. At a minimum. You also might want to review the research in this area. If you like, I will start a thread.

You can imagine that if I stated that Christians were bad parents, you might object. Again, always good to remember that golden rule before posting.

My meaning was that the homosexuals I've known would make bad parents and the one person I've known that was raised by homosexual parents wasn't that great of a person..... but then again niether were a few of the other co-workers I was with so that doesn't state much.

The few encounters I've had with homosexuals were not positive..... thats all I was trying to convey

And yes my friend is not a parent and it's a good thing he isn't

many heterosexual men that end up with a kid on accident are no better then the exact same homosexual men..... I just haven't met many homosexuals.

 

[Petriebird]

considerign your marital problems which you have discussed here before
do you not think that you may have a very biased and perhaps warped view of sex, sexuality and any topic related to this in general?

That sounds like a personal attack to me

everyone has problems in their life, we're all doing the best we can, stating problems that have been confided in you is a lack of faith in your fellow human being.

A friend is being someone you can confide your problems in and still find love with them

This person has confided in you publicly and you are not being a friend

a friend would show concern for personal problems not attack them

 

[Storm]

Why are you so angry?

Gee, maybe it's all the bigotry directed at him? You think?

 

[Petriebird]

Many folks in the past have given up their personal life for a higher calling. This is a high wonderful goal. The problem arises when they point and judge others. Pride and bigotry taints all who engage in it. No matter their values. ( this is a general comment not aimed at you)

Thank you for the thoughts, I should take that into consideration. Without acknowledging that I'm trying to live up to your words.

I am trying to live to a higher calling without judging those who aren't, but i'm not perfect and am probably judging others

 

[Petriebird]

Gee, maybe it's all the bigotry directed at him? You think?

he was angry before I started posting so i'm not aware of what happened before I started posting, all I see is anger

 

[Mr Cheese]

Who created Satan?

Christians...


"It was Christianity which first painted the devil on the world's wall; It was Christianity which first brought sin into the world. Belief in the cure which it offered has now been shaken to it's deepest roots; but belief in the sickness which it taught and propogated continues to exist." – Friedrich Nietzsche

 

[Autodidact]

My meaning was that the homosexuals I've known would make bad parents and the one person I've known that was raised by homosexual parents wasn't that great of a person..... but then again niether were a few of the other co-workers I was with so that doesn't state much.

The few encounters I've had with homosexuals were not positive..... thats all I was trying to convey

And yes my friend is not a parent and it's a good thing he isn't

many heterosexual men that end up with a kid on accident are no better then the exact same homosexual men..... I just haven't met many homosexuals.

That's a shame. Or maybe you have and you don't know it? Here are some homosexuals you may have heard of:

Greg Louganis
Leonard Bernstein
Barbara Jordan
Benjamin Britten
Martina Navritolova
Arthur C. Clarke
Ellen DeGeneres
Aaron Copeland
Noel Coward
George Cukor
Dusty Springfield
...
and so on.

 

[Autodidact]

he was angry before I started posting so i'm not aware of what happened before I started posting, all I see is anger

Read the thread. Who called whom dysfunctional first?

 

[Mr Cheese]

That sounds like a personal attack to me

everyone has problems in their life, we're all doing the best we can, stating problems that have been confided in you is a lack of faith in your fellow human being.

A friend is being someone you can confide your problems in and still find love with them

This person has confided in you publicly and you are not being a friend

a friend would show concern for personal problems not attack them

Petrie, it was not an attack, and it was not a reply to you

Petrie, Little nipper has discussed his marriage

how he is unable to have children
as such then with his own philosophy, if he actually has sex he is commiting a sin
as such then, I simply asked politely, given the fact that such a situation exists in his own life.... did he not think it is a bit problematic to be discussing other people's sex lives, sexuality etc.

I propose it is a bit like a person traumatised by a fall...trying to climb a ladder. I have personal experience of this as I fell over 50ft down a cliff as a child.

I understand Little Nipper's stance, I trul;y think his religious views and the fact he has marital problems fully color his posts; as such I was simply trying to reason and address this situation. Arguably I was attempting to show understanding and compassion...

...........

“The divine manifestation is governed by a certain rhythm, which is present even in the minutest atom. This state of being knows no antitheses, it casts no shadows, and always brings forth itself. Good is not set against evil, nor beauty against ugliness, nor love against hatred, nor reality against delusion. The Gnosis does not have love; it does not radiate love; it IS love.”

- Jan van Rijckenborgh

 

[Mr Cheese]

I mean really, a marriage based entirely around sex and making babies, that is the dysfunction.

its also archaic...

and effectively reduces women to cattle

and men to walking penises...which of course some may argue is a good thing

 

[tarasan]

its also archaic...

and effectively reduces women to cattle

and men to walking penises...which of course some may argue is a good thing

agreed mate if you read the say song of songs you realise that there is definately room for love and intimacy in a realationship.

 

[Wannabe Yogi]

I'm sorry if I have offended you, you are apparently a good parent and homosexual.

You must remember that their are many people that are very poor parents. Straight or Gay it matters not. You also should know that two people who live a "Gay life style" must jump through some hoops to have kids. It is not an hapless choice or just a matter of forgetting to use birth control.
I have known only a few Gay parents in my life. They were much better then average. This is just my personal opinion. I know of no data on this subject.[/QUOTE]

I'm just trying to express why I feel the way I do.... why I have such a struggle with the morality of homosexuality....... I'm just stating my experiences.

The first church I ever went to was one that accepted homosexuals.... I have left that church but mostly due to other reasons...... but part of me deep inside felt uneasy with it and i'm trying to understand why I have a problem with homosexuality.

When I was a Baptist Minister I also felt very confected on the subject of Homosexuality. I lived in the SF bay area so I knew some "Gays". They were nice people and I hated the idea that they were going to Hell just like all the non-Christians.

Your way out as a Christian is that you don't need to judge others. You only need to find your own path. If a celibate life for you is right. Then just live it. (A celibate life style is only ok if you are not driven to have sex. The problems in the catholic church are proof enough of what happens when you are celibate on the outside and your driven on the inside to have sex. This can not be forced. It will come out one way or an other.)

Remember what christ said about the sheep.

I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.- John 10:16

Christ has more sheep then are in your sheep pen. Who are we to judge who are his sheep and who are not.