Buddha believed in the Creator God

[Gjallarhorn]

Well. That certainly is the slumberless Shiva. It is not a God state. It is the slumberless one.

Buddhism is certainly not equal to materialism. Most materialists however think that they are awake.

I agree. Buddhism is not materialist, but Buddha is not a god, nor did he endorse a supreme being or creator deity. All things are mind-wrought.

 

[atanu]

I agree. Buddhism is not materialist, but Buddha is not a god, nor did he endorse a supreme being or creator deity. All things are mind-wrought.

I do not think that you comprehend "I am awake".
(I may be wrong however).

 

[Gjallarhorn]

I do not think that you comprehend "I am awake".

I am as certain as you are.

 

[atanu]

I am as certain as you are.

But I am more awake. :yes:

 

[Gjallarhorn]

But I am more awake. :yes:

A lucid dream is still a dream.

 

[atanu]

A lucid dream is still a dream.

Sure. But seeing the deep sleep and seeing a lucid dream are not same.

 

[atanu]

And when a Buddha preaches void to masses, that is a creator creating massses from void.

 

[xkatz]

I note from your comment you discount this link as one of its sources is muller , what then of the other sources cyted within this link ?????

I am not entirely discounting the link provided, I'm just very skeptical of the article since it's from a Muslim perspective and uses Muller's translations.

 

[Wannabe Yogi]

2) I noticed one of the sources cited is Muller (and his translations). I am very skeptical of him and his works as he was a romanticist with a lot of bias towards Indian culture.

Many Hindu's tend not to trust Mullars translations but It is not because he is pro-Hindu, his criticism is just the opposite.

 

[paarsurrey]

I am not entirely discounting the link provided, I'm just very skeptical of the article since it's from a Muslim perspective and uses Muller's translations.

Why you have a bias from the Muslim perspective?
If you have; you should not have a bias against reason.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Why you have a bias from the Muslim perspective?
If you have; you should not have a bias against reason.

Seeing as Buddha wasn't Muslim, having an Islamic bias when interpreting Buddhist teachings would be the same as having a Hindu bias when interpreting Muslim teachings, no?

 

[atanu]

Well, it is certainly not the Buddha:

"The asava by which I would go
to a god-state,
or become a heavenly musician in the sky,
or go to a yakkha-state & human-state:
Those have been destroyed by me,
ruined, their stems removed.
Like a blue lotus, rising up,
untouched by water,
untouched am I by the world,
and so, brahman,
I'm awake."

The word should be asva and not asava. asva means fast moving horse, which is an euphemism for the mind -- the creator. The Buddha has vanquished that creator by being fully awake as Himself and not in any other role.

First, hindus do believe that this can happen only by the grace of the deity.

Second, how He imparts the above teaching if He is not using the mind to create words?

 

[Gjallarhorn]

The word should be asva and not asava. asva means fast moving horse, which is an euphemism for the mind -- the creator. The Buddha has vanquished that creator by being fully awake as Himself and not in any other role. We hindus do believe that this can happen only by the grace of the deity.

But then how He says the above if He is not using the mind to create words?

Āsava is a Pali term (Sanskrit: Āśrava) that is used in Buddhist scripture, philosophy, and psychology. The glossary of the Companion Encyclopedia of Asian Philosophy defines āsava/āśrava as:

"inflow, influx, influence; mental bias or canker, cankers that keep one bound to the world of samsāra; used particularly in Jainism and Buddhism."

According to De Silva:

"The āsavas which are mentioned frequently are kāmāsava, bhavāsava, diṭṭhāsava and avijjāsava. Horner translates these as the cankers of sense-pleasure, becoming, false views and ignorance. The word canker suggests something that corrodes or corrupts slowly. These figurative meanings perhaps describe facets of the concept of āsava: kept long in storage, oozing out, taint, corroding, etc."

Apparently you are not talking of the same concept.

 

[atanu]

Apparently you are not talking of the same concept.

I may be wrong. But your citation said asava and not āsava.

Even then, assuming that the word āsrava is meant, IMO, my post remains correct, since āsrava is the action of the senses which impels the soul towards external objects.

So, Buddha killed the wandering of mind-senses and remained awake as Himself without appointing Himself in any other role.

 

[paarsurrey]

Seeing as Buddha wasn't Muslim, having an Islamic bias when interpreting Buddhist teachings would be the same as having a Hindu bias when interpreting Muslim teachings, no?

Quran is an open book, it is for everyone in the world. And Hindus and Buddhist are very much in this world. They can read, understand and interpret Quran, if they do it correctly from the text and the context of the Quran.

Quran says it has been made easy to understand. You may try it, if you may,so.

 

[paarsurrey]

Seeing as Buddha wasn't Muslim

Was Buddha a Buddhist? I don't think so.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Quran is an open book, it is for everyone in the world. And Hindus and Buddhist are very much in this world. They can read, understand and interpret Quran, if they do it correctly from the text and the context of the Quran.

Quran says it has been made easy to understand. You may try it, if you may,so.

...and that would be without bias, unlike interpreting Buddhist scriptures with the goal of claiming Buddha as a Muslim prophet in mind.

Was Buddha a Buddhist? I don't think so.

Certainly not, and neither was Jesus a Christian.

 

[paarsurrey]

unlike interpreting Buddhist scriptures with the goal of claiming Buddha as a Muslim prophet in mind.

"Muslim prophet" not in the sense you take it; but in the sense that we honour, respect and revere all truthful religious reformers of all lands; they remain theirs and as well as become ours.

They all become a part of our faith in terms of the first surah/chapter of Quran, that is considered summary of Quran; and of course Buddha is mentioned elsewhere in Quran under a title name specifically, you must be knowing, I think.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Gospel of Buddha

Buddha says:

"Starting from the simplest forms, the mind rises and falls according to deeds, but the aspirations of a Bodhisatta pursue the straight path of wisdom and righteousness, until they reach perfect enlightenment in the Buddha. Verse-3: Chapter 41-"The Goal"

Paarsurrey comments: I think here “In the Buddha” means in the All-Wise and the All-Light- the one true God, not Buddha himself, if I have correctly understood.

No Buddha meant himself as an avatar of Lord Vishnu. That's my belief. Its no different than believing Krishna to be transcendent.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Was Buddha a Buddhist? I don't think so.

Buddha was a Hindu. He was neither Buddhist or Muslim. Buddha praised Indra and Brahma in the Dhammapada