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Ultimate truth

dybmh

dybmh

דניאל יוסף בן מאיר הירש
The Reverend Bob said:
Dukkha. And it isn't life is dukkha, existence is dukkha
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Here is the wikipedia on definition of Dukkha:

Dukkha (/ˈduːkə/; Pāli; Sanskrit: duḥkha) is an important Buddhist concept, commonly translated as "suffering", "pain", "unsatisfactoriness" or "stress". It refers to the fundamental unsatisfactoriness and painfulness of mundane life.

hyperlink >>> wikipedia - Dukkha

Emphasis on "Mundane Life".

If there is a distinction made for mundane life then Buddhism discriminates between what is meaningful and what is not. Buddhism is not nihilism.
 
The Reverend Bob

The Reverend Bob

Fart Machine and Beastmaster
dybmh said:
Is dukkha meaningless?

I propose that in Buddhism dukkha is meaningful. And because of that Buddhism is not nihilism.

There are other examples that support this proposition.
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Then if dukkha is meaning so too are desire and ignorance for they are the roots of dukkha. The five clinging aggregates are now meaningful if dukkha is meaningful.
 
usfan

usfan

Well-Known Member
The objective reality is that only one of these can be true. They are a dichotomy.. the truth of one negates the possibility of the other.

There either IS.. an objective, specific Reality, or all is relative, dream, and fantasy.

What would you give, to 'know' The Truth?' What would it matter, to live a life of total ease, comfort, affluence, loving children, adoring spouse, devoted friends, worldly acclaim, yet discover at the end you were dead wrong about God and the universe?

Maybe this is all a cosmic joke.. nothing is real.. we don't exist, our souls are a delusion, God is a fantasy. ..but maybe, there is a God in Heaven who has expectations from His creation? Would knowing this be possible? Why? How?
 
Valjean

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
dybmh said:
Respectful question:

Are there limits, in your opinion, to the ultimate truth described by Quantum mechanics?
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Of course, quantum mechanics isn't the Theory of Everything, it doesn't even completely complement Relativity.
 
The Reverend Bob

The Reverend Bob

Fart Machine and Beastmaster
dybmh said:
Here is the wikipedia on definition of Dukkha:

Dukkha (/ˈduːkə/; Pāli; Sanskrit: duḥkha) is an important Buddhist concept, commonly translated as "suffering", "pain", "unsatisfactoriness" or "stress". It refers to the fundamental unsatisfactoriness and painfulness of mundane life.

hyperlink >>> wikipedia - Dukkha

Emphasis on "Mundane Life".

If there is a distinction made for mundane life then Buddhism discriminates between what is meaningful and what is not. Buddhism is not nihilism.
Click to expand...
You are wrong! Read this page. All forms of existence are within a state of dukkha because all are in samsara

Screenshot 2019-07-06 at 4.07.48 PM.png
 
osgart

osgart

Nothing my eye, Something for sure
If life, then trustworthiness, and deserve. If oblivion is the ultimate truth then life is fleeting, and to live a quality life requires trustworthiness and earning the deserve.

Who is perfect? Who sees clearly? Who deserves? And Who decides?

A pure heart, who can find it? Are we even fit to judge ourselves?

All one can do is their absolute best.

10 minutes or 80 years to live, what is the best way to live? Trustworthiness and deserve.

For love, or pleasure! Honor or by necessity alone. What satisfies the heart and brings it to its peace? And to live in that peace doing all that you can do despite the circumstances.

Are we to love life or oblivion? Life the ultimate and righteous giver and taker. Oblivion cares not, and knows not life.

Love is like food, everybody needs it. The alternative to love is oblivion, not a good choice. We live and die for love, or we live and die for no good thing. That to me is the ultimate truth.
 
Evangelicalhumanist

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
Vinayaka said:
An extension from another thread.
As per your faith, describe what you and/or your faith considers to be the ultimate truth?
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My tagline should tell you everything you need to know about my thoughts on this matter. It reads, "Truth isn't a thing."

Truth is a relationship...a relationship between what is and what is perceived or thought to be. Thus, because there is an infinite number of "what is," and (so far as I can tell) an even larger number of what is perceived or thought, then there are an infinite number of truths and a larger infinite number of non-truths.

Having said all of that, I really think that what you are asking, and many people seem to be asking, is something along the line of "what is the ultimate answer to the nature of what is." And since that question is going to remain permanently unanswerable by any of us who are part of "what is," it's not a question that makes any real sense.
 
Windwalker

Windwalker

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Aupmanyav said:
Ultimate truth is non-duality. Since there is no other, the ultimate truth has no duality to embrace.
"Eko sad, dwiteeyo nasti; nasti, nasti, na nasti kincana." (What exist is one, there is no second. No, no, no, not in the least.)
It all started with a bundle of energy as big as a football.
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This is common distinction that gets made later on in history with Nagarjuna pointing out that to say "there is only one and not two", is itself a subtle form of duality. It itself is saying "This, and NOT that". That's duality. What he points out, and as others since have pointed out in the later nondual schools is that what that is is "Not-duality", not "nonduality.

The unfortunate thing is the term nonduality seems to be so associated with monism, that we probably need a better term. It's one that embraces paradox. In "not-duality", it gets rid of paradox, saying "This and not that". That's not sufficient. It needs to embrace everything, monism and duality. and there should be a better word for that. Less confusion. So "Ultimate Reality", cannot exclude duality. It is both, One and Many, as well as neither.
 
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Firemorphic

Firemorphic

Activist Membrane
Windwalker said:
The unfortunate thing is the term nonduality seems to be so associated with monism, that we probably need a better term. It's one that embraces paradox. In "not-duality", it gets rid of paradox, saying "This and not that". That's not sufficient. It needs to embrace everything, monism and duality. and there should be a better word for that. Less confusion. So "Ultimate Reality", cannot exclude duality. It is both, One and Many, as well as neither.
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Yep, correct.
 
Aupmanyav

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
The Reverend Bob said:
What the difference between nihilism and those claiming "ultimate truth"?
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This is the ultimate mystery. What is the ultimate source of universe? It is no God because then one has to explain where God came from. So, the creation of universe is obviously out of 'absolute nothing' - Ex-nihilo, Zero-energy universe, multiverse. This means there is no difference between existence and non-existence. These are just phases. Seems that Buddha was correct.

Love your screenshot. Just curious, what all apps you have on your browser? Perhaps I can add one or two to mine.
 
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The Reverend Bob

The Reverend Bob

Fart Machine and Beastmaster
Aupmanyav said:
This is the ultimate mystery. What is the ultimate source of universe? It is no God because then one has to explain where God came from. So, the creation of universe is obviously out of 'absolute nothing' - Ex-nihilo, Zero-energy universe, multiverse. This means there is no difference between existence and non-existence. These are just phases. Seems that Buddha was correct.

Love your screenshot. Just curious, what all apps you have on your browser? Perhaps I can add one or two to mine.
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Oh I have the imgur community extension, metamask for crypto-currency and other nefarious things involved in the decentralised web, video downloader because...nefarious purposes, duckduckgo privacy essentials...again for nefarious purposes, kami pdf and stuff like that.
 
crossfire

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic ☿
Premium Member
The Reverend Bob said:
How does it differ from let us say "Buddhism" since it is all about the obliteration of the reputed meaningful aspects of life?
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Things that are to be desired also have a shelf life, as they are impermanent. This simple fact causes much dukkha.
crossfire said:
Impermanence and death. (Buddhism)
I can't say that any of my other religions have what one might call an ultimate truth, except perhaps the Taoist "Change is the only constant."
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Impermanence also applies to dukkha (see the Third Noble Truth.)
 
crossfire

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic ☿
Premium Member
The Reverend Bob said:
Doesn't impermanence apply to everything?
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All phenomenal existance...dhammas

dhamma [Skt. dharma]:
(1) Event; a phenomenon in and of itself; (2) mental quality; (3) doctrine, teaching; (4)nibbāna. Also, principles of behavior that human beings ought to follow so as to fit in with the right natural order of things; qualities of mind they should develop so as to realize the inherent quality of the mind in and of itself. By extension, "Dhamma" (usu. capitalized) is used also to denote any doctrine that teaches such things. Thus the Dhamma of the Buddha denotes both his teachings and the direct experience of nibbāna, the quality at which those teachings are aimed.
 
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