Oh really? I could have sworn thats what the words said
Anyway, I am not american, biden is just a 10 second slot on a news program to me
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John Macarthur opens church
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Oh really? I could have sworn thats what the words said
Anyway, I am not american, biden is just a 10 second slot on a news program to me
I will repeat. Masks are NOT, repeat NOT to prevent the wearer catching covid, they are worn so an infected wearer does not infect so many other people.
exchemist
Veteran Member
Don't be absurd. 220,000 people in the USA are now dead of this disease and it is getting worse as we go into winter. It could be your turn next, especially if you are old and/or fat. (I expect you are both.
)There are plenty of cases of idiot pastors who opened their churches, refusing precautions, and who are now either dead themselves, or members of whose congregations have died. And that is without taking into account the degradation of other health treatments caused by the pressure of this disease on the health system.
If churches want to open, they need to do so after implementing and adhering to approved health precautions against the spread of this virus. Anything short of that is selfish, inconsiderate, pig-headedness.
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Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Its life no doubt. A lot of people cannot accept it yet like they do for vehicle deaths , the flu, heart disease...
The list goes on.
Covid is just another aspect of that and its high time to put all hysteria to an end by accepting the realities of life and living and accept that we are mortal beings who are not in control of nature.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Most will survive. Instead of people using accumulated figures for nothing else but the sheer shock value of it, why not once for a change use per capita figures to show its true lethality, which makes Covid only a moderately lethal virus at best.Don't be absurd. 220,000 people in the USA are now dead of this disease and it is getting worse as we go into winter. It could be your turn next, especially if you are old and/or fat. (I expect you are both.
There are plenty of cases of idiot pastors who opened their churches, refusing precautions, and who are now either dead themselves, or members of whose congregations have died. And that is without taking into account the degradation of other health treatments caused by the pressure of this disease on the health system.
If churches want to open, they need to do so after implementing and adhering to approved health precautions against the spread of this virus. Anything short of that is selfish, inconsiderate, pig-headedness.
We ought to take precautions but not to the extent where we destroy our own society and ability to survive.
If it's that severe, then pay for people to go on vacation including meals and lodging as well as pay the bills and debts and deliver take out.
Social distancing is the biggest aspect for not getting it yourself. Wearing a mask help to prevent you from giving it to others unknowingly. Some masks do have protective effects on the one wearing the mask, but the primary protection is the other way.
exchemist
Veteran Member
Nobody is talking about any such thing, of course.
But whatever the fatality rate, 220,000 have died before their time as a result of this virus and another 100,000 more - at least - will do so in the next 6 months if measures are not taken to stop that. A compassionate society would not just shrug its shoulders at that and call it nature. Civilised countries have a health system that is supposed to do better than just nature.
You know this for a fact? I recall something about not passing on misinformation. There’s been a lot of that in this thread with the predictions being made. If someone wants to cite trends, trends are guesses not predictions. Things can change. This certainty of what’s going to happen is getting out of hand with the potential to frighten people who are frightened to begin with.
Yet, 80% of White Evangelicals (a revealing statistical fact, not a racist comment), voted for Trump. They are not a safeguard against dictatorship, rather they welcomed one with palm fronds, praises, and pandemics.
This is the fruit I have spoken to you about. John MacArthur Jr. was one of those part of that poisonous version of Christian faith. Here's the proof of what I said, in his disregard for public safety in the name of faith. "By their fruits you shall know them." The words for this are selfishness, and disrespect to others. This is not the fruits of Love. It is fake love, a smug wolf in sheep's clothing.
BTW, from the article:
The county’s ban on indoor gatherings because of COVID-19 is neutral and generally applicable, the judge found, “because it applies to ‘all events and gatherings’—regardless of their purpose.” Ergo, at trial the county would likely prevail in its decision to include indoor religious services in the ban. (Beckloff noted that the regulations specifically allow for outdoor religious services.)
This is NOT religious persecution. It's public safety, Ken. Don't you care about not infecting your own flock you are responsible for? If not, what is wrong with you???
John MacArthur’s COVID-disbelieving church loses round 1
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That was the reason given back in early Feb., but that is no longer the case as everyone is advised to wear a mask to avoid catching the virus.
exchemist
Veteran Member
That is my prediction based on the deaths until now. My reasoning goes like this.
- The epidemic started in March, so it's been going 6 months. 220,000 have died in that time, a lot of which was during summer when the conditions are not very favourable for transmission of the virus.
- The infection rate is increasing dramatically again all across Europe, as we get into the cooler weather. N America can be expected to have the same dynamics.
- There will not be full-scale roll-out of any vaccine until the spring.
- There are some treatments that can reduce the death rate, but only by about 30% or so.
- The immune proportion of the population in the US is <10% after 6 months, so won't be more than 20% by the end of the winter.
We can therefore expect that somewhat less than a further 220,000 will die in the next 6 months, say half that to be conservative. Hence my figure.
But if you can point to where my reasoning is faulty, please do. I'm in the UK so I may have missed some move to contain the virus in the US which will mitigate the death toll.
That is still the case, the evidence shows a far greater reduction in an infected person transmitting the virus if wearing a mask
With a far greater chance of a mask wearer contracting the virus if exposed to a non mask wearing infected person.
The mask is to reduce the spread, not to prorect the wearer.
It may be the difference between the pond in expressing humor
I would disagree with that statement. I would say it would be the same coming and going.
Telling someone not to breathe is not humour even with Trump dictating the rules
Sorry the science doesnt agree with you
It's actually just basic science. It's the same principle as when you throw a rock into a pond. The further the distance from the point of contact, the less impact the ensuing wave will have, as the same amount of force is spread out or dispersed. When a person sneezes, all those individual viruses are right there, and if 95% of them get blocked, there are only 5% going into the air. With no mask, it's 100 %. But in the other direction, it's about distance from the source. No matter where you are, unless you're kissing the person, and they sneeze, there are less viruses the further you are away, and there are other points of contact, besides the mask area, like your eyes, and secondary, anywhere, and then your hands.
Six feet is just a guideline, where its greatly reduced. Not nothing, but at a minimum. It also has a whole lot to do with air flow. That's why airplanes are deemed somewhat safer because they're designed to have air flow vertically, not horizontally. A really poor situation would be in a car with no air flow art all, no windows open, or fan on.
So... how long do you think they should keep churches closed infringing on the 1st Amendment of Constitutional rights
You have no idea of what I do.... so trying to make it personal won't help you.
Well, what's more important? Me satisfying my social needs or your life? Hardly even worth thinking about, it seems.
They aren't infringing upon. Period. You can meet all you want. But you have to follow public safety protocols, like not meeting inside unstable buildings, for instance. Do you really, seriously need to have this explained to you?
Do you disregard public safety concerns in your rush to meet in a church building? It's a simple question of you as a pastor. Do you care about public safety? Yes, or no?
If NO, please explain your justifications?