What is a soul, for those who believe in its existence?

[LuisDantas]

This article is about addiction and how to deal with it, but it spends considerable effort at discussing how arbitrary the perception of a "real me" is.

People are dying because we misunderstand how those with addiction think

I think it connects quite nicely into the arbitrary nature of soul-beliefs.

Generally, I want to know how believers in the existence of a soul reconcile that belief with the neurological realities of people.

For instance, it is well known that a starving person becomes very irritable and loses self-control, usually losing those traits a short while after being fed. Does that mean that one's soul does not determine the behavior of hungry people? How does one decide what is caused by metaphysical factors and what is caused by environmental, biological and neurological factors?

 

[George-ananda]

For instance, it is well known that a starving person becomes very irritable and loses self-control, usually losing those traits a short while after being fed. Does that mean that one's soul does not determine the behavior of hungry people? How does one decide what is caused by metaphysical factors and what is caused by environmental, biological and neurological factors?

Self-control and mind-control is a variable attribute of the mind/soul complex. A trained Buddhist monk can behave much better under fasting conditions than an undisciplined mind/soul complex.

 

[Nakosis]

This article is about addiction and how to deal with it, but it spends considerable effort at discussing how arbitrary the perception of a "real me" is.

People are dying because we misunderstand how those with addiction think

I think it connects quite nicely into the arbitrary nature of soul-beliefs.

Generally, I want to know how believers in the existence of a soul reconcile that belief with the neurological realities of people.

For instance, it is well known that a starving person becomes very irritable and loses self-control, usually losing those traits a short while after being fed. Does that mean that one's soul does not determine the behavior of hungry people? How does one decide what is caused by metaphysical factors and what is caused by environmental, biological and neurological factors?

Isn't Buddhism about affecting the neurological realities of people?

Yes I get hungry, I get irritable. I can change that by focusing my thoughts elsewhere.

In seems possible to obtain mental control over physiological realities. Control over feelings basically.

The awareness of our conscious reality is not reality. It's a pseudo reality created by our subconscious mind. I believe a person can learn to have some affect over the reality created for us by our subconscious mind.

I suppose I'd see soul as the conscious self.

 

[Fool]

This article is about addiction and how to deal with it, but it spends considerable effort at discussing how arbitrary the perception of a "real me" is.

People are dying because we misunderstand how those with addiction think

I think it connects quite nicely into the arbitrary nature of soul-beliefs.

Generally, I want to know how believers in the existence of a soul reconcile that belief with the neurological realities of people.

For instance, it is well known that a starving person becomes very irritable and loses self-control, usually losing those traits a short while after being fed. Does that mean that one's soul does not determine the behavior of hungry people? How does one decide what is caused by metaphysical factors and what is caused by environmental, biological and neurological factors?

the addiction is to a soul's personification, to it's image. a person who becomes enthralled in maintaining this image, attached to this portrayal of self at the expense of it's whole self is in conflict. the shadow, the parts that tradition, or cultures have demeaned must be incorporated; whether society likes the image, or not; otherwise you'll have the dr. jekyll/mr. hyde scenario.


if the image has self-loathing and self-loving then the war has already begun in heaven. it is easier to fall than to rise.

if the life/soul has no beginning, no ending, then there is seen no destination, no where to rest the head, and the journey is eternal. if life is a journey, eternal movement. then there is only the journey. self has no where to be but here, now. self is already in the journey.

i will be what i will be

 

[Valjean]

From a Vedantic viewpoint, there's only one "soul" or consciousness mains.

I have many 'independent' electric devices in my house, but they all function by tapping into a single electrical source. My neighbors, indeed, everyone, taps into the same mains.

Likewise, living beings all tap into the same "Soul." to power their consciousness.

 

[sun rise]

Generally, I want to know how believers in the existence of a soul reconcile that belief with the neurological realities of people.

The 'soul' is that which comes into existence in latent form when the 'drop' separates from the ocean which is God. The soul develops in consciousness until it is fully developed in the human then persists from lifetime to lifetime until the soul is reunited with the source, God.

What happens during one life is based on the ego people are born with into a current life. The ego is like clothing which people put on over their soul.

Neurological realities are thus the experiences of the temporary personality structure of that life and thus related to the temporary ego.

 

[Quintessence]

For me, a conflict doesn't arise because of how I understand the nature of spirits (I use the word "spirit" rather than "soul" - the two terms are interchangeable to me). The spirit of a thing would include what humans call "neurological realities," not exclude them. I use the word "spirit" in a way that references the totality of something's nature (aka, character, essence, identity, persona). It's a more animistic take on the meaning of the word that isn't very common in Western culture, though. More conventional ideas about soul/spirit in Western culture didn't strike me as logically consistent, which is why I discarded that form of Western dualism many years ago in favor of a more animistic take on the meaning.

 

[LuisDantas]

Isn't Buddhism about affecting the neurological realities of people?

Yes. And about denying the existence of a resilient soul as well.

 

[Nakosis]

Yes. And about denying the existence of a resilient soul as well.

That's fine the ego, conscious identity, seems tied to this lifetime, and more precisely this moment IMO.

The article is interesting, I seen the mind as divided for quite awhile. Their conclusion being drugs as the answer. Assuming I'd suppose we cannot control part of the mind we are not consciously aware of.

I, and I'd think Buddhism would disagree with that in part.

Accepting that the ability to consciously influence subconscious desire varies greatly from person to person, it is possible.

I know the struggle of watching yourself almost unconsciously doing actions that you consciously know are harmful to yourself. In fact you ascert you're going to resist only to come to the conscious realization that your are in the middle of doing exactly what you had just decided to resist doing.

It is also very easy once a habit is broken to take it back up again like it was never gone.

However people do break bad habits, people are successful, just not very often. We hold the few who do up as examples for the rest of us.

So while it is far from easy, and perhaps some folks are simply not capable of it, I believe it is possible to affect subconscious desire.

I don't know by how much but I think we are far from reaching any limit in that regard.

 

[`mud]

Ahhh...soul vs spirit, or Spirit, allowing a capital for the 's' on that one.
Religion believers link their `souls` to some sort of `god`,
the `soul` being of their belief system.
Most of them think that their `soul` will go on after they die,
into some heaven or hellish existance.
I feel my `Spirit` will go on eventually to the Cosmos, sans cognition.
It will have it's own form, however that will be.
But the believer's `soul` will survive in some way to become one reunated with ones body.
I think their `god` will make that happen, somewhere using something of creative magic.
I guess it comes down to one of those `Pascal` situations, with no real input from one's own choosing. But maybe not, I think one has no choice, but it's a bet at best.
I hope my `Spirit` meets all the other `souls` in the Cosmos, somewhere out there,
but in heaven....I think not.

 

[RedDragon94]

This article is about addiction and how to deal with it, but it spends considerable effort at discussing how arbitrary the perception of a "real me" is.

People are dying because we misunderstand how those with addiction think

I think it connects quite nicely into the arbitrary nature of soul-beliefs.

Generally, I want to know how believers in the existence of a soul reconcile that belief with the neurological realities of people.

For instance, it is well known that a starving person becomes very irritable and loses self-control, usually losing those traits a short while after being fed. Does that mean that one's soul does not determine the behavior of hungry people? How does one decide what is caused by metaphysical factors and what is caused by environmental, biological and neurological factors?

Let me think about how I want to word this question.

How does not having a soul make you deal with addiction any better?

 

[Srivijaya]

This article is about addiction and how to deal with it, but it spends considerable effort at discussing how arbitrary the perception of a "real me" is.

People are dying because we misunderstand how those with addiction think

I think it connects quite nicely into the arbitrary nature of soul-beliefs.

Generally, I want to know how believers in the existence of a soul reconcile that belief with the neurological realities of people.

For instance, it is well known that a starving person becomes very irritable and loses self-control, usually losing those traits a short while after being fed. Does that mean that one's soul does not determine the behavior of hungry people? How does one decide what is caused by metaphysical factors and what is caused by environmental, biological and neurological factors?

Interesting piece on addiction. In Buddha dharma we quantify this as the three poisons and the four nutriments, but the issue goes way deeper. No need to add a soul. If we accept the synthesis of self-grasping and dependent origination we can see the results on our physical form (rupa). Dualism is the ultimate addiction and the resultant 'person' is a process of consumption within space-time, which is also the only place this process can occur.

 

[Shadow Link]

"Do people always do what they think is best? In other words, do our actions always reflect our beliefs and values? When someone with addiction chooses to take drugs, does this show us what she truly cares about — or might something more complicated be going on?"


Gal 5:17 - For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.


I think, respectfully, as seekers we're trying to find a balance between these two things(flesh and spirit) because it is the reality we live in. Wether the condition we find ourselves in is mostly tilted one way or the other determines which side needs most attention to shift us back to the fulcrum(center). Most importantly we have to understand our human nature as being predictable in this regard. It's battle after battle until the war is over. The victory is winning control of ourselves through the means of gaining some by dying some. IMO, even though the scripture above mostly addresses for us to gain spiritually, the opposite can definitely be applied — its just less common.

 

[Sapiens]

A soul is what makes humans different from animals ... if you believe such claptrap.

 

[osgart]

The soul is merely the seat of cares, loves, hates, and ambivalences. The soul is that unifying essence of being. What its made of is entirely unclear. It is different than the mind that comes to know it. Even fully understanding consciousness, you have only grasped the mind, and not the soul. Consciousness merely brings experiences to the soul.

 

[Trailblazer]

The soul is merely the seat of cares, loves, hates, and ambivalences. The soul is that unifying essence of being. What its made of is entirely unclear. It is different than the mind that comes to know it. Even fully understanding consciousness, you have only grasped the mind, and not the soul. Consciousness merely brings experiences to the soul.

As I have said on previous occasions, the soul is the sum total of the human personality and it is all that we take with us after we die physically and take our flight to the spiritual realm of existence. Once there the soul takes on a form, a spiritual body made up of elements in that realm. We cannot possibly understand what that will be like until we get there.

Although associated with the mind, the soul is much more than the mind; it is the Essence of who we are, that which we are totally incapable if understanding, at least not in this mortal world. The soul is responsible for our consciousness in both this life and the next. It animates the physical body but when we no longer have a physical body it still continues to exist, since it does not need a physical body to exist.

“Thou hast asked Me concerning the nature of the soul. Know, verily, that the soul is a sign of God, a heavenly gem whose reality the most learned of men hath failed to grasp, and whose mystery no mind, however acute, can ever hope to unravel. It is the first among all created things to declare the excellence of its Creator, the first to recognize His glory, to cleave to His truth, and to bow down in adoration before Him. If it be faithful to God, it will reflect His light, and will, eventually, return unto Him. If it fail, however, in its allegiance to its Creator, it will become a victim to self and passion, and will, in the end, sink in their depths.” Gleanings, pp. 158-159

“And now concerning thy question regarding the soul of man and its survival after death. Know thou of a truth that the soul, after its separation from the body, will continue to progress until it attaineth the presence of God, in a state and condition which neither the revolution of ages and centuries, nor the changes and chances of this world, can alter. It will endure as long as the Kingdom of God, His sovereignty, His dominion and power will endure. It will manifest the signs of God and His attributes, and will reveal His loving kindness and bounty.”
Gleanings, pp. 155-156

“The nature of the soul after death can never be described, nor is it meet and permissible to reveal its whole character to the eyes of men. The Prophets and Messengers of God have been sent down for the sole purpose of guiding mankind to the straight Path of Truth. The purpose underlying Their revelation hath been to educate all men, that they may, at the hour of death, ascend, in the utmost purity and sanctity and with absolute detachment, to the throne of the Most High.” Gleanings, pp. 156-157

 

[Deeje]

In the Bible, the "soul" is the living breathing creature...it never means some kind of disembodied spirit that departs from the body at death. Whilst breathing, a soul keeps living and functioning. The brain is the housing for consciousness so that when the brain is damaged, it can lapse into a coma for a very long period of time. There is no consciousness as those who have come out of comas will attest. Once the brain dies, the soul dies because all the mechanisms that keep it alive will cease to function.

Addictions happen because brains get used to having substances alter brain chemistry. Brain damage can result which can be permanent.

Those who see the soul as something distinctly different from the body have no answers to the questions of where consciousness goes because it floats off to somewhere invisible. Who said?

 

[osgart]

In the Bible, the "soul" is the living breathing creature...it never means some kind of disembodied spirit that departs from the body at death. Whilst breathing, a soul keeps living and functioning. The brain is the housing for consciousness so that when the brain is damaged, it can lapse into a coma for a very long period of time. There is no consciousness as those who have come out of comas will attest. Once the brain dies, the soul dies because all the mechanisms that keep it alive will cease to function.

Addictions happen because brains get used to having substances alter brain chemistry. Brain damage can result which can be permanent.

Those who see the soul as something distinctly different from the body have no answers to the questions of where consciousness goes because it floats off to somewhere invisible. Who said?

I see it as an unified energy substance, that animates the brain. Something kind of like chi. The energy is undetectable but a very real substance.

I am surprised that you dont believe in spirit. So what resurrects and goes to heaven, the atomic structure?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

A soul is what makes humans different from animals ... if you believe such claptrap.

According to what? Not the Bible, it uses "soul" in reference to animals and people.

Hebrew Concordance: ne·p̄eš -- 115 Occurrences

If Bible believers say otherwise, they've been misinformed.

 

[Trailblazer]

Those who see the soul as something distinctly different from the body have no answers to the questions of where consciousness goes because it floats off to somewhere invisible. Who said?

We have no answers because the soul is a mystery of God... We will know more after we die though.

“Thou hast asked Me concerning the nature of the soul. Know, verily, that the soul is a sign of God, a heavenly gem whose reality the most learned of men hath failed to grasp, and whose mystery no mind, however acute, can ever hope to unravel. It is the first among all created things to declare the excellence of its Creator, the first to recognize His glory, to cleave to His truth, and to bow down in adoration before Him. If it be faithful to God, it will reflect His light, and will, eventually, return unto Him. If it fail, however, in its allegiance to its Creator, it will become a victim to self and passion, and will, in the end, sink in their depths.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 158-159

After the body dies, the soul floats off to the spiritual realm, often referred to as heaven, where it takes on another form that best suits its celestial habitation. The spiritual realm is not visible to us until we get there because it cannot be seen with physical eyes.

“The answer to the third question is this, that in the other world the human reality doth not assume a physical form, rather doth it take on a heavenly form, made up of elements of that heavenly realm.”
Selections From the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 194