why did they want to crucify jesus

[Sabour]

That God, the Most High, is not subverted by you or I. You'll be blessed to discontinue believing and repeating the lie that He is subverted by the wills of men.


And this will also answer any question you've presented in this thread.

Well your twist of things is interesting.

Let me ask you this, so God does what he wants and what we do have no consequence of how things would go. Is that what you are saying?

 

[Desert Snake]

Too bad I can't frubal the Oops that drew a smile on my face lol.

Well there are a lot of things people don't know about Islam. What christianity has to say about the antichrist ?

heh heh..yeah, I can't frubal you either lol..

You know, that isn't really my specialty. I also don't have a Bible at hand.

 

[Desert Snake]

Allah knows all things, past, present and future. Your ignorance makes you an idol to yourself, and a blasphemer. But, God provides you with all He determines to.

Wrong! we have free will. Biggie with true Abrahamic religious belief.

 

[Sabour]

heh heh..yeah, I can't frubal you either lol..

You know, that isn't really my specialty. I also don't have a Bible at hand.

Too bad I wanted some frubals. Hehe

Well okay no worries. This is like the third time I ask this question on this forums and have no answer.

 

[Desert Snake]

All of Allah's creation are subservient to Him-- not only the angels and jinn, but all of His creation. There is no free will; not even Allah is free, because He is constrained in Himself, having one unchangeable, indivisible will.

Completely false!

 

[Sleeppy]

Well your twist of things is interesting.

Let me ask you this, so God does what he wants and what we do have no consequence of how things would go. Is that what you are saying?

God determines all things. You don't understand that God is the one who creates reality, and truth? Understand that God is your Creator, and His will is not able to be vain. But your will, it will constantly be shown as a vanity, for you to see and remember.

 

[fantome profane]

Why else apply good historical information to a story lined account if not to make it real?

We constantly are reminded that these events in the gospels could not have happened as they were written which in turn generates speculation as to how they would have really and truly happened should we apply good historical information to them. For example Jesus' body would have been tossed and eaten by animals because that is how it was done.

Why bother with how it was done when the story reads perfectly as it is. If the events could not have happened as they were written it is probably because we are reading fiction. I don't have a problem with fiction, do you?

I don't have a problem with fiction. But I think that the historical Jesus fits the evidence a little bit better.

Well the mythical Jesus is not speculation because that he was mythical is simply the default.

No, it is not.

 

[Sabour]

God determines all things. You don't understand that God is the one who creates reality, and truth? Understand that God is your Creator, and His will is not able to be vain. But your will, it will constantly be shown as a vanity, for you to see and remember.

Can we not talk general and get into details, what are you exactly trying to tell me here ?

 

[Sleeppy]

Can we not talk general and get into details, what are you exactly trying to tell me here ?

I'm telling you the truth. You've come here asking the other creations about the commands of God, but haven't even rightly considered yourself! Your body itself is comprised of an innumerable number of atoms; none of these you can number or control, but God Himself fashioned and commands each one.

 

[Sabour]

I'm telling you the truth. You've come here asking the other creations about the commands of God, but haven't even rightly considered yourself! Your body itself is comprised of an innumerable number of atoms; none of these you can number or control, but God Himself fashioned and commands each one.

So if I went out to the balcony and threw my self from the fifth floor. Nothing would happen?

 

[Sleeppy]

So if I went out to the balcony and threw my self from the fifth floor. Nothing would happen?

If a young child falls from the fifth floor- would something happen? God determines all things. You'd both likely break yourself, and possibly die; but God is the one who knows.

And not only does He know what happens, but when, where and why also.

 

[steeltoes]

I don't have a problem with fiction. But I think that the historical Jesus fits the evidence a little bit better.

And you could very well be right about that, but how are we to know?

 

[fantome profane]

And you could very well be right about that, but how are we to know?

Look at the details of the story, look at the historical circumstances, consider the motives of the authors, and then make your determination.

 

[Sabour]

If a young child falls from the fifth floor- would something happen? God determines all things. You'd both likely break yourself, and possibly die; but God is the one who knows.

And not only does He know what happens, but when, where and why also.

Nice.

You'd both likely break yourself and possibly die... So what we actually do has a consequence afterall.

I have a free will because I can throw myself or I can stay seated where I am.

God determines all things yes. He created us in a way that we must not throw ourselves from the balcony because that would harm us. So things we do have consequences in accordance to how we are created.

God is the one who knows. No doubt. Because He created us and He exactly knows what path we would choose. He knows how we would be "investing" our free will.

Now had the question been if I thrown myself from the floor number 100 your answer would have been different.

So see friend? What we choose to do has a consequence.

You say that no it doesn't neglecting the fact that you actually chose to believe that Jesus peace be upon him died for your sins which shows that what one does actually matters.

Why do you believe that if it will have no consequence? Isn't it a hope for a reward? How does choosing to follow the commandments instead affect the outcome?

According to your version of how you see things, if God wills to grant you heaven, He will. This doesn't depend on whether you believe or not so why are you troubling your mind? Why are you even trying to convince me?

 

[roger1440]

Maybe they killed him because he was a carpenter

I don't think so.

 

[steeltoes]

Look at the details of the story, look at the historical circumstances, consider the motives of the authors, and then make your determination.

, but no guarantees that we will come to the same conclusions.

 

[fantome profane]

, but no guarantees that we will come to the same conclusions.

Where would be the fun in that?

 

[roger1440]

So I was searching the internet for an answer to this question.

Why there was a need to crucify Jesus peace be upon him.

Couldn't they just have just killed him.


According to what I found, it all begins with Jesus peace be upon him saying that he came to fulfill the law.

According to the law, everything that is crucified would be cursed.

Deuteronomy 21:23 His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God that thy land be not defiled, which the Lord thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

So being able to crucify Jesus peace be upon him would disprove who he was because if he did come to fulfill the law, he can't be cursed by that law.

This is a video that explains it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMat9Iz8dPE

Thoughts please on that and especially on why do you believe they wanted to crucify Jesus.

What do you think Jesus meant by "fulfill the law"?

 

[Sleeppy]

Nice.

You'd both likely break yourself and possibly die... So what we actually do has a consequence afterall.

I have a free will because I can throw myself or I can stay seated where I am.

God determines all things yes. He created us in a way that we must not throw ourselves from the balcony because that would harm us. So things we do have consequences in accordance to how we are created.

God is the one who knows. No doubt. Because He created us and He exactly knows what path we would choose. He knows how we would be "investing" our free will.

Now had the question been if I thrown myself from the floor number 100 your answer would have been different.

So see friend? What we choose to do has a consequence.

You say that no it doesn't neglecting the fact that you actually chose to believe that Jesus peace be upon him died for your sins which shows that what one does actually matters.

Why do you believe that if it will have no consequence? Isn't it a hope for a reward? How does choosing to follow the commandments instead affect the outcome?

According to your version of how you see things, if God wills to grant you heaven, He will. This doesn't depend on whether you believe or not so why are you troubling your mind? Why are you even trying to convince me?

Of course; what we do has consequence. But, God precedes creation; His will is our consequence. We are the consequences of His will. God is not the consequence of our will; we did not create God. So if a young child jumps from the 100th floor balcony, and dies, you should remember that God is the one determining when, where, how, and why-- not the child.

Any man may die for the sins of family and friends. God is anointing humanity, individually and as a whole. Martin Luther King preached, marched, was jailed, and died for the sins of the United States, not very long ago. His words and deeds are still living because of Allah's will. Dr. King is not God, but His will is manifest in him. Martin Luther King was a good man, was he not?

Mark 10:18

And Jesus said to him, `Why me dost thou call good? no one [is] good except One -- God.

 

[Mycroft]

this thing makes no sense, why God needs Crucifixion of his son for forgiving human beings?

That's a very good question. And no, it makes no sense. Which is why I don't believe a word of it. Surely a divine superbeing could just say 'You're forgiven' and be done with it.