What REALLY is the point?!

[Jos]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly. What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available. IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

 

[Augustus]

Whether beliefs are "true" or not is vastly overrated. As long as they work it doesn't really matter.

We should be far more interested in the consequences of holding certain beliefs, rather than the purported reasons people hold them.

 

[Jos]

Whether beliefs are "true" or not is vastly overrated. As long as they work it doesn't really matter.

We should be far more interested in the consequences of holding certain beliefs, rather than the purported reasons people hold them.

So if even if it's fictional, as long as it's comforting or leads to a better life we should believe it? But I want to know truth and have trustworthy knowledge even if it's not comforting but unfortunately absolute truth or trustworthiness doesn't seem to exist.

 

[SalixIncendium]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly. What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available. IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

If you're walking along and trip over something, don't you look back to see what it was you tripped over?

For some, the search didn't start with the intention of finding truth, knowledge or evidence of anything, but rather understanding what it was they caught a glimpse of.

 

[syo]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly. What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available. IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

Religion is logic. The 'search for truth' is actually 'what it is logical'.

 

[Mindmaster]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly. What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available. IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

It's not necessary to have the absolute truth, just the best information you can assemble.

I too understand the dilemma that there is a rational argument for either the universe was a happy accident or it was created by a supreme being. You're irrational if you think that an advanced intelligence isn't a possibility. (We simply do not have enough information to rule that out and may never...) Our scientific knowledge of the pre-big bang period is non-existent... That means an advanced intelligent being or even culture of beings is not ruled out.

However, shoe-horning that creative force into an anthropomorphized sky daddy is just silly. It's obvious to me that if the gods exist then they were created during the initial creation -- it doesn't necessarily imply they were responsible for that creation. Those are all presumptions and illogical at that. It would be highly likely that such an intelligence would exist in a manner far beyond our ability to understand and possibly even in a different realm or dimension -- and our entire universe is just in a snow globe and all we see is the mirrored glass.

 

[bobhikes]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly. What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available. IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

Finding the truth can only be done unbiasedly and that is the point. We are all to some point biased in our thoughts. To truly find the truth you will have to be open to new thoughts and ideas. The truth itself is ordinary, but the search to get to it is inspiring and life changing.

 

[Ponder This]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly. What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available. IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

This feeling you are experiencing is a natural consequence of philosophical reflection upon certain modes of thinking which call into question the certainty of all things. It is not necessarily truth that you cannot find, but rather it is value that those philosophies have failed to uncover. Also, it may be that there are truths that you accepted as valid that, perhaps, you no longer accept as valid. You may also be having trouble with provable/unprovable truths. If you cannot prove that something is true, then how can you accept that it is true? The answer is that there are some truths that you don't have to prove to yourself - they only need to be proven to other people. For example, you know you exist. You don't have to prove to yourself that you exist, because you know it already without proof. But you might have to prove it to someone else before he will believe that you do, in fact, exist! He can make many clever arguments that you do not exist because his knowledge of you is tertiary. You do not need these proofs for yourself because your knowledge is direct.

So if even if it's fictional, as long as it's comforting or leads to a better life we should believe it? But I want to know truth and have trustworthy knowledge even if it's not comforting but unfortunately absolute truth or trustworthiness doesn't seem to exist.

It seems that you have answered your question: The reason you search for truth is because you want to know the truth. You say it seems not to exist in an absolute sense and that is a lie. There are truths that exist in an absolute sense and there are truths which are not obvious and there are truths that don't seem to exist in an absolute sense. So you will have to qualify your statement according to the question. You should also consider your mode of acquiring knowledge. How exactly are you going about it? And why is the method of acquisition reliable. For example, sitting in a room and thinking about it is one way to acquire knowledge of a certain limited type. You might write a creative work of fiction that way. But if you want to know if it is or is not raining outside, then the best way might be to stand up, walk outside your box, and take a look at the sky.

 

[Wandering Monk]

Religion is logic. The 'search for truth' is actually 'what it is logical'.

Religion is the exact opposite of logic.

 

[Howard Is]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge?

Quality of experience.

Health. Happiness. Self respect.

 

[Brickjectivity]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly.

In a given context knowledge seems consistent, so its not pointless to search for knowledge within a context. If you change your context then your knowledge is no longer knowledge. In the natural world, natural discoveries seem consistent, so the search for natural knowledge is valuable in the natural world.

What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available.

I agree. God is nonphysical, invisible and conceptual. This is what they probably mean when the NT authors say 'Spirit' or 'Spiritual'. The words they actually use are Greek Koine and have the root 'Pneuma' which refers to breath and wind. Similarly the term 'Word' is the Greek word 'Logos' which was coined by Heraclitus and refers to that which causes form within chaos. It refers to plans, to order.

IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

The first thing is I think to search for self knowledge. Knowing yourself and others. An NT author asks "How can we say we love God who is unseen when we don't love our own brother who is clearly visible?" Love and compassion are valuable in the context where God is, and in that context knowledge about them has value but maybe not in the natural world directly where they are ephemeral, perhaps meaningless or limited.

 

[George-ananda]

What's the point in searching for truth or knowledge? It doesn't seem as though we can know anything for sure or with any type of certainty and even if we were to get knowledge, it's possible that we'll interpret it wrongly. What's the point in asking for evidence in favor of or against a God's existence? It seems as though one could argue both for and against one given the evidence available. IDK what to believe and the search for any type of truth and knowledge seems pointless, idk, I'm rambling.

I think the type of problem you are describing comes when we start with the question 'Does God exist?'. That question is too big for our minds.

What happened with me is that I got interested in the question 'what are we?'. Are we just a temporary physical biological machine or are there aspects to us that are beyond the physical. From my serious study of the paranormal and psychic phenomena I had to think there must be something 'more'. But what is that 'more'. This lead me to masters and adepts claiming insight into the mature of all this for me to consider.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

So if even if it's fictional, as long as it's comforting or leads to a better life we should believe it? But I want to know truth and have trustworthy knowledge even if it's not comforting but unfortunately absolute truth or trustworthiness doesn't seem to exist.

Because if it's not harming anyone, it is no one's business. If someone wants to believe flying leprechauns govern the universe, as long as they aren't bullying people over it, demanding legislation in favor of, and demanding they get to dictate society, it is absolutely no ones business that they believe flying leprechauns govern the universe.

 

[Jos]

For some, the search didn't start with the intention of finding truth, knowledge or evidence of anything, but rather understanding what it was they caught a glimpse of.

Right understanding is a part of acquiring knowledge or truth or am I misunderstanding your point?

 

[Jos]

Religion is logic. The 'search for truth' is actually 'what it is logical'.

So by searching for truth I'm actually searching for religion? How does that follow?

 

[Jos]

It's not necessary to have the absolute truth, just the best information you can assemble.

Right but the question that always nags me is if I have the best information and even if I did have the best information can I interpret it correctly especially since I'm fallible and prone to error and can I trust that others are intepreting the info correctly since other humans are also fallible? I just feel as though I can't know anything with any sort of security right now and I wonder if I should trust scientists at all.

I too understand the dilemma that there is a rational argument for either the universe was a happy accident or it was created by a supreme being. You're irrational if you think that an advanced intelligence isn't a possibility. (We simply do not have enough information to rule that out and may never...) Our scientific knowledge of the pre-big bang period is non-existent... That means an advanced intelligent being or even culture of beings is not ruled out.

Yeah that's one question that I'm really struggling with. IDK, I think that one can make arguments both for and against either position but the fact that neither position can be proven even way is bugging me.

However, shoe-horning that creative force into an anthropomorphized sky daddy is just silly. It's obvious to me that if the gods exist then they were created during the initial creation -- it doesn't necessarily imply they were responsible for that creation.

Maybe, that seems possible but then they wouldn't be eternal and as special or powerful as we thought.

Those are all presumptions and illogical at that. It would be highly likely that such an intelligence would exist in a manner far beyond our ability to understand and possibly even in a different realm or dimension -- and our entire universe is just in a snow globe and all we see is the mirrored glass.

Also makes sense and it also makes sense if it wasn't concerned with human affairs unlike what a lot of theists tend to postulate. It makes no sense whatsoever for a being to care about humanity.

 

[Jos]

Finding the truth can only be done unbiasedly and that is the point. We are all to some point biased in our thoughts. To truly find the truth you will have to be open to new thoughts and ideas. The truth itself is ordinary, but the search to get to it is inspiring and life changing.

Yes I know that my biases can get in the way but that's exactly the point, everyone has biases and it's basically impossible to put away our biases and look objectively at the truth... even if we did get the truth our biases could lead to us misinterpreting it.

 

[bobhikes]

Yes I know that my biases can get in the way but that's exactly the point, everyone has biases and it's basically impossible to put away our biases and look objectively at the truth... even if we did get the truth our biases could lead to us misinterpreting it.

Like with my favorite story the Alchemist it takes a lot of work and time and many beliefs shredded but it can be done.

 

[Jos]

This feeling you are experiencing is a natural consequence of philosophical reflection upon certain modes of thinking which call into question the certainty of all things. It is not necessarily truth that you cannot find, but rather it is value that those philosophies have failed to uncover

Yes but I'm pretty sure I'm searching for trustworthy knowledge rather than value. I'm looking for truth not value.

Also, it may be that there are truths that you accepted as valid that, perhaps, you no longer accept as valid. You may also be having trouble with provable/unprovable truths. If you cannot prove that something is true, then how can you accept that it is true?

Yep that's basically it.

The answer is that there are some truths that you don't have to prove to yourself - they only need to be proven to other people. For example, you know you exist. You don't have to prove to yourself that you exist, because you know it already without proof.

Yeah I've been telling myself that that's the only thing I can be certain of.

But you might have to prove it to someone else before he will believe that you do, in fact, exist! He can make many clever arguments that you do not exist because his knowledge of you is tertiary. You do not need these proofs for yourself because your knowledge is direct.

True, fair enough.

You say it seems not to exist in an absolute sense and that is a lie.

It's more like I'm struggling with being able to identify an absolute truth if I were to see it.

There are truths that exist in an absolute sense and there are truths which are not obvious and there are truths that don't seem to exist in an absolute sense. So you will have to qualify your statement according to the question.

I'm just saying that if truth were to exist I feel as though I wouldn't be able to identify or know it if I were to see it.

You should also consider your mode of acquiring knowledge. How exactly are you going about it? And why is the method of acquisition reliable. For example, sitting in a room and thinking about it is one way to acquire knowledge of a certain limited type. You might write a creative work of fiction that way. But if you want to know if it is or is not raining outside, then the best way might be to stand up, walk outside your box, and take a look at the sky.

The thing is though that I don't really have one since I'm doubtful that any method can get to any sort of truth. I'm just lost right now.

 

[Jos]

Quality of experience.

Health. Happiness. Self respect.

Yes I know it can lead to those things but recently I've been feelings the opposite of it recently since I've been trying to find truth/knowledge. It's scary not knowing whether you can trust your own senses and stuff.