What are your thoughts on the Presidential election?

[Yerda]

As I see it, Mr. Trump's problems began sometime ago when he departed from the economic populism that was of such huge importance to his working class base. He did that early in his presidency, and it -- in combination with several other important factors (such as his racism, misogyny, and all around incompetence) -- has led to a relatively small, but hugely significant erosion of his hardcore base -- and an even greater erosion of his not-so-hardcore 2016 base.

For example, he's lost about 6% of his hardcore non-college educated women supporters. Given that he won the electoral college by less than 100,000 votes, that all by itself might prove decisive. But he has lost even more than that! While his popularity with most Republicans continues to go up, the number of people calling themselves Republican continues to go down even faster.

That's interesting. I had the impression that his overall support was ticking up slowly.

 

[exchemist]

How many crimes has Trump committed as President? Is Trump insane, stupid, has dementia or more than one of these?

I hope you see what that question triggered and it's not "discussion" because the question itself was not a discussion question but a debate question.

I think the OP question is both fair and highly pertinent. I have read several pieces in recent days, in reputable newspapers, mentioning out that Biden seems to have a tendency to forget words. And he is 77, so it is not a ridiculous question.

I, like most of the world outside the USA, am desperate to see him beat Trump, but I have to say I am worried that he may be come across as a bit too doddery for the job. He himself seems to recognise he needs an energetic VP who is known to be a capable administrator.

 

[Stevicus]

Never say never. People didn’t think Germany would become the Third Reich either.

America is not Germany. Germany had a history of monarchism and rigid obedience to authority. People who are conditioned to readily give an oath to a king or a kaiser would have no problem giving an oath to a fuhrer.

 

[Revoltingest]

1984 + Handmaiden's tale + Deliverance.

The fact that Trump was elected at all shows just how easily a large portion of the U.S. can be manipulated into doing whatever people want them to do. Just tap it with a bible and wrap it in a flag.

Even worse, Democrats have been either approving or entirely unaware of creeping authoritarianism by their favored leaders.
- Obama's ramped up persecution of whistle blowers.
- Loss of the right to jury trials by the Petty Offense Doctrine (Clinton).
- Attempt to curb people's right to free speech regarding housing (Clinton).
- The 1994 Crime Bill (Biden, Clinton, others).
- Expanding the takings clause to property not for private (not public) use (USSC).
- Keeping military draft registration, & for males only. And even to
reactivate it (Rangel).

Democrats hate Trump, & see him as the bringer of oppression.
But they're perfectly happy with their own doing the same.

 

[metis]

Do you think Trump has made a case for re-election?


What should be the important issues that should decide it for you?

To the above questions, no, and basic honesty.

What would be significantly different if Biden wins vs another four years of Trump?

Yes, but if the Senate remains with a Pub majority it would be quite difficult to get many positive changes made. Even former chief editor of the "National Review", George Will, has stated that the congressional Pubs that support Trump must also be voted out of office.

 

[icehorse]

i'm worried for the US and for all humanity

 

[icehorse]

Even worse, Democrats have been either approving or entirely unaware of creeping authoritarianism by their favored leaders.
- Obama's ramped up persecution of whistle blowers.
- Loss of the right to jury trials by the Petty Offense Doctrine (Clinton).
- Attempt to curb people's right to free speech regarding housing (Clinton).
- The 1994 Crime Bill (Biden, Clinton, others).
- Expanding the takings clause to property not for private (not public) use (USSC).
- Keeping military draft registration, & for males only. And even to
reactivate it (Rangel).

Democrats hate Trump, & see him as the bringer of oppression.
But they're perfectly happy with their own doing the same.

There is too much truth in this.

You can guess my next thought: Almost all of DC is in the pockets of large corporations and billionaires. And those oligarchs / plutocrats are DESTROYING our society.

 

[Revoltingest]

There is too much truth in this.

You can guess my next thought: Almost all of DC is in the pockets of large corporations and billionaires. And those oligarchs / plutocrats are DESTROYING our society.

Too easy a boogeyman to blame.
Voters vote for the leaders with record of causing the crap that happens.
Democrats re-elected Clinton after he signed the 1994 Crime Bill, fought
jury trials, & did other non-progressive things.
Ref....
https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/pubs/pdf/pa271.pdf

 

[icehorse]

Too easy a boogeyman to blame.
Voters vote for the leaders with record of causing the crap that happens.

Voters are usually not given much of a choice. Do you think there are many DC-level politicians that are NOT heavily coerced by big business?

 

[Revoltingest]

Voters are usually not given much of a choice. Do you think there are many DC-level politicians that are NOT heavily coerced by big business?

Voters have a great deal of choice available.
What they lack is diversity of results.
Consider Joe Biden, the same-old-same-old.
Democrats picked him over a wide array of alternatives.
Blame corporations for what voters want?
Pish posh!
Barsh!
Flimshaw!
Piffle!

 

[Wandering Monk]

How many more elections with crap candidates. We really are on the way down.

 

[icehorse]

Voters have a great deal of choice available.

Can you clarify this point? It seems to me that our broken two party system offers voters very little choice.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I'm really interested in what RFers are feeling about the election. How do you see the campaigns playing out? What do you expect to see from the candidates? Who will win?

Do you think Trump has made a case for re-election?


What should be the important issues that should decide it for you?

What would be significantly different if Biden wins vs another four years of Trump?

Tell me, tell me.

I posted this in this forum as opposed to the N American debates section to try to avoid arguing. You never get the really interesting takes when people's backs are up.

I think its going to be more of the same status quo and business as usual politicking.

Promises are made, its predictable they will pretty much go unfulfilled, taxes will certainly go even higher, and the debates will, as to be expected, change sides with the right on offense and the left on defense.

Filibusters will become a new art form.

 

[Twilight Hue]

How many more elections with crap candidates. We really are on the way down.

I think its perpetual as long as two parties protect their monopoly on power.

 

[Revoltingest]

Can you clarify this point? It seems to me that our broken two party system offers voters very little choice.

Consider the differences between Biden alternatives, eg, Yang,
Gabbard, Harris, Sanders, etc. The people picked Biden over them.
This cannot be blamed upon corporations limiting major candidate
choices to Trump vs Biden. Both were chosen by the masses.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I think Trump will win, but I'm not sure of course. Because of the pandemic, mail in voting, and the general animus between the parties, I believe the election results will be hotly contested with accusations of fraud, regardless of who wins. However I believe if Trump wins, there will likely be major riots throughout the country in the name of "He cheated, so we're justified". If Biden wins, Trump will not accept the results but he will leave office peacefully. There will be much unrest among Trump supporters but no riots. Yes, I believe some pissed off liberals are more likely to burn down their cities than are pissed off Republicans. I'm concerned and am not looking forward to November.

I haven't seen the Democrats do anything at all differently from last election. Sure, this Republican president is their most hated, ever; but they seem to think that will mean something to the electorate. The only thing that has changed is maybe the pandemic. The Democrats make exactly the same play as last time, exactly the same mistakes, don't care what happens as a result, won't compromise, won't listen, determined to scuttle the ship. The Republicans, same as ever. Its the same election, again. The result will be (surprise?!) THE SAME. The change candidate (trump) will win. What did they expect?

Since I always guess the wrong candidate then Biden is a shoe in, but it really seems like nothing has changed yet the Democrats think it has. Literally they do the same things every four years. They're so predictable that I can't believe the Republicans can lose; and have you heard about the Republicans new ability to suss votes using AI and computing tech? The Democrats haven't to my knowledge taken advantage of that same new tech. They bring knives to gun fights.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I'm really interested in what RFers are feeling about the election. How do you see the campaigns playing out? What do you expect to see from the candidates? Who will win?

Do you think Trump has made a case for re-election?


What should be the important issues that should decide it for you?

What would be significantly different if Biden wins vs another four years of Trump?

Tell me, tell me.

I posted this in this forum as opposed to the N American debates section to try to avoid arguing. You never get the really interesting takes when people's backs are up.

Let me ( a person who can vote either way and has voted for candidates in each party ) lay this down for you. The Democrats and the Republicans both, every year, all year long claim that the world will end if the other party has its way. Its noise, annoying noise that can get you upset if you listen to it too long. Take Trump for example. Yes, he's the most obnoxious candidate in some time; but if the Democrats actually believed that he represented the end of the country they would compromise on issues in order to get their own candidate in. They won't compromise. They'll continue to try to get the country to prevent creation science being taught in schools, tow the line on climate change, support gay marriage and gay rights, support pro choice etc etc. They're going to run their candidate as if he were running for president of Europe even though he isn't. Win or lose they have a way they want things done. This means they don't actually believe Trump is the end of the country. Notice that when Obama won the election nobody rebelled or overthrew the government, and if Biden wins nobody will overthrow the government, either. The Republicans screamed bloody murder about Obama's victory, yet they did not have any popular support for overthrowing the election process. Does this help clarify how I'm not just being optimistic? We have a process that we accept called an election, and we will only accept an elected president.

 

[sun rise]

Biden seems to have a tendency to forget words. And he is 77, so it is not a ridiculous question.

That's called "senior moments" and is not a symptom of dementia. From the list of early signs of dementia it's much more likely Trump is on that path Senior Moment or Dementia? Know the Difference

Both were chosen by the masses.

Biden was chosen for one overriding reason - having someone non-threatening (older white male) who can beat Trump. I'd prefer a wheelchair bound black Hispanic radical socialist woman, of course, but there's a flood tide of Republicans who want Trump gone and are willing to help Biden. I don't see them doing to same for Harris or any of the other candidates who dropped out.

Biden is accurate in calling himself a transitional figure.

I haven't seen the Democrats do anything at all differently from last election.

What do you expect Democrats to do? Specifically.

 

[Brickjectivity]

What do you expect Democrats to do? Specifically.

They and the Republicans have been crying wolf for so long and so many times. The Democrats have marked the Republicans as their equals by doing so. I've worked in offices and in construction, and the outcry against the Republicans and Democrats never ceased, day after day. It was nothing but sickening like having to eat oatmeal constantly. Meanwhile both parties conspired against voters.

Prove they are serious about their concerns about Trump by:
1. Identifying which voters they need to win over from the Republicans which will definitely get them a win in November, and pursuing them instead of pursuing the good graces of Europe. They already pander to the corporations, so this is not above them. They can do it.
2. Announcing a change in policy for this purpose: saving the country from destruction. I keep hearing it, but I don't see anybody actually behaving like its true.
3. Make it a major policy change on something such as: Gun Control, Gay Rights, Pro Choice, Immigration. A switch to Pro Life would win voters.
4. Either that are stop the ceaseless claims that the Republicans are destroying the country, that the situation is so bad that if I don't vote Democrat that the world will go up in flames. Let the Democrat party put up or shut up. Then they can challenge the Republicans to do the same. The Republicans won't, and the Democrats will win and save the country from eminent destruction.
5. Republicans also should do this, but they aren't the ones about to lose this election.

 

[Revoltingest]

Biden was chosen for one overriding reason - having someone non-threatening (older white male) who can beat Trump.

He's still your choice...not one you can blame on evil corporations.