The Debate of God.

[atanu]

Read carefully. They both include freedom from ALL duality, in that they recognize that the Ordinary and the Miraculous are one and the same experience.

Oh. Once you point that out.

 

[Thief]

You mean with all the mistakes made due to learning, we put others at great risk and peril.

"With every mistake
we must surely be learning,
while my guitar gently weeps."

Nay...I said what I meant.
Go back and read it again.

 

[godnotgod]

Nay...I said what I meant.
Go back and read it again.

I know what you said, but I am saying that the greater negative impact of learning and knowledge is on everyone else.

I make the distinction between intellectual knowledge and learning, and knowing, just as Jesus did when he said:

"Ye search the scriptures, because ye think that in them ye have eternal life; and these are they which bear witness of me"

It is because man places more importance on knowledge and learning, rather than on knowing about his own nature, that chaos results.

But you circumvented the original question: if, as you say, man and God had a relationship for centuries in which time man developed an intimate understanding of God, why then did man turn against God and decide to sin? Why would God wait for centuries to test man? After such a long relationship, God knew man thoroughly, so what need for testing? It sounds too ridiculous.

 

[Thief]

I know what you said, but I am saying that the greater negative impact of learning and knowledge is on everyone else.

I make the distinction between intellectual knowledge and learning, and knowing, just as Jesus did when he said:

"Ye search the scriptures, because ye think that in them ye have eternal life; and these are they which bear witness of me"

It is because man places more importance on knowledge and learning, rather than on knowing about his own nature, that chaos results.

But you circumvented the original question: if, as you say, man and God had a relationship for centuries in which time man developed an intimate understanding of God, why then did man turn against God and decide to sin? Why would God wait for centuries to test man? After such a long relationship, God knew man thoroughly, so what need for testing? It sounds too ridiculous.

Sit quietly and read Genesis over and over.
Treat it like a mantra.

Your postings seem to run that way.

 

[godnotgod]

Sit quietly and read Genesis over and over.
Treat it like a mantra.

Your postings seem to run that way.

As usual, you cannot answer questions put to you. At this point, I must say that you have little understanding of the spiritual life you claim to pursue. Time and again, you have shown no understanding of various topics, circumventing answers to questions put to you. All you seem to be capable of doing is to regurgitate memorized beliefs with which you have been indoctrinated.

I am through with you. To go on is pointless. It's like talking to a wall.

Goodbye.

 

[BruceDLimber]

But if Adam communicated and communed with God for hundreds of years, . . .

What exactly is your source for this assumption?

To my knowledge there is no such implication.

Peace,

Bruce

 

[godnotgod]

What exactly is your source for this assumption?

To my knowledge there is no such implication.

Peace,

Bruce

Please refer to post #3790, in which Thief first made the assertion to my response:

Originally Posted by godnotgod
If tabula rasa were the case, how did Man understand God's command not to eat of the Forbidden Fruit? Man did not yet have a language, nor a reference to know right from wrong. In short, Man was a clueless dumbkopf!!

Originally Posted by Thief
Nay....Adam walked with God hundreds of years....so says Genesis.
Plenty of time to learn communication.

I have not researched any such passages in Genesis, but as I recall, Adam lived for a long time, but I thought that was after the Fall. My point was that, if Adam lived for hundreds of years, as Thief asserted, and spent all that time communing with and learning from God, then why did he then choose to sin, going against hundreds of years of instruction from God?

 

[atanu]

Sit quietly and read Genesis over and over.
Treat it like a mantra.

Your postings seem to run that way.

Knowledge is at many levels. Genesis alone does not prove your point.

Jesus' teaching "Ask and it will be granted", sums up the issue.

You want to uphold the identity, so that will be granted. One who wants non-dual existence will be granted that.

I feel that you do not ponder over the scripture.

 

[BruceDLimber]

Adam walked with God hundreds of years. So says.

Where precisely does it say this?

Please provide a citation.

Thank you.

Bruce

 

[Thief]

Knowledge is at many levels. Genesis alone does not prove your point.

Jesus' teaching "Ask and it will be granted", sums up the issue.

You want to uphold the identity, so that will be granted. One who wants non-dual existence will be granted that.

I feel that you do not ponder over the scripture.

Oh I ponder alright....as far back as I can remember....literally!

Someone had told me that God is creator.
As I leaned on my windowsill late at night....a little boy out of bed.

I looked to the stars and all the many things outside.
And I said to myself...
'...if God created all of this....He is truly wonderful!....'

A chill ran over me in spite of the warm summer night.

I have been awake every night since then....pondering.....

 

[Thief]

Where precisely does it say this?

Please provide a citation.

Thank you.

Bruce

Genesis 5 verse 5....
And all the days that Adam lived were 930yrs, and he died.

You might notice there seems a great deal of sketchy report in Genesis.
Hence all these debates we have now....

 

[atanu]

Oh I ponder alright....as far back as I can remember....literally!
Someone had told me that God is creator.
As I leaned on my windowsill late at night....a little boy out of bed.
I looked to the stars and all the many things outside.
And I said to myself...
'...if God created all of this....He is truly wonderful!....'
A chill ran over me in spite of the warm summer night.
I have been awake every night since then....pondering.....

Romanticism is good. But that does not provide an answer to my point, namely, Jesus' teaching "Ask and it will be granted".

 

[Thief]

Romanticism is good. But that does not provide an answer to my point, namely, Jesus' teaching "Ask and it will be granted".

And what exactly do you desire?

 

[atanu]

And what exactly do you desire?

Upanishads teach "Any difference seen here leads from death to death".

 

[Thief]

Upanishads teach "Any difference seen here leads from death to death".

I believe this life is needful...once.

You become who you are by the sayings you make and the deeds you perform.

Then on to the next life.

If your next life fails.....'you' fail...altogether.

As if you were never born.

 

[atanu]

I believe this life is needful...once.
You become who you are by the sayings you make and the deeds you perform.
Then on to the next life.
If your next life fails.....'you' fail...altogether.
As if you were never born.

Mere wild guesses. Mere opinions.

 

[Thief]

Mere wild guesses. Mere opinions.

We continue after the last breath.....or we don't.
We continue in the next life....or we don't.

 

[Tiberius]

My guess is that we don't.

 

[Thief]

My guess is that we don't.

Now THERE's something to look forward to!

But I believe it is unreasonable that we all fail.
To many possible survivors.
Some of us are bound to continue.

 

[AdityaMookerjee]

Just can't give up the word play....can you?

If you look directly into the universe.......really?

I don't think God is playing around.
The creation is a serious statement of existence.

This life and the many unique spirits being formed is a serious event.

No kidding around.

I am not my own handiwork.
Neither are you.

Absolutely. I mean, why is this so unusual? I can empathise, that if I marvel at a steam roller, standing in front, I will be steamrollered. The point is, why do people stand in front of them, to intentionally die, when they feel that they must? There is no answer. Why are we looking at life, in this marvellous marvelling manner? The person who stands intentionally in front, doesn't know, you are going through also, the same experience. I feel really obliged, if a person looks at me. I and people like me, are giving the impression, that life is a steam roller, and you are not appreciating it, because I have material reasons, and you don't.