• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

The Catholic Church should be shut down

The Emperor of Mankind

The Emperor of Mankind

Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic
Sorry for taking so long to respond. I'll answer both questions simultaneously.

metis said:
And why would you want that?
Click to expand...

LuisDantas said:
What would destruction of the RCC even achieve, exactly?
Click to expand...

Well it would remove a strongly regressive force which is causing so many problems for our species. The global child abuse scandal is merely the latest in a line of problems that can be traced back to the Church.
  1. The spread of AIDS in parts of Africa due to the Church's lie-filled preaching against the use of condoms;
  2. Aiding the escape of Nazi war criminals after WW2 to mostly Catholic countries like Argentina;
  3. Human trafficking of children in Spain - the Church stole children from families that the tyrant Franco deemed were unfit to have children and gave them to 'more deserving' families i.e. richer ones and/or families that agreed with Franco's regime;
  4. Campaigning against most if not every socially progressive advancement in Europe for at least the last century;
  5. Approval of and encouragement of cultural genocide against various 'New World' peoples including participation in the residential school system;
  6. Stealing babies away from single mothers in various countries and then subjecting said single mothers to slavery in the Magdalene Laundries. This continued until as recently as the 1990s;
  7. Campaigning against legal access to abortions for women - thus denying them the right of bodily autonomy as well as forcing them to seek illegal and less safer measures out of desperation. This resulted in both women finding themselves put into the Magdalene Laundries and children sometimes going into Church-run orphanages which are now also being opened up to accusations of criminal activity and abuse of children. Oh, and then there are the women who die completely preventable deaths due to complications arising from pregnancy that could be stopped by having an abortion like Savita Halappanavar due to Church-influenced anti-choice laws in Ireland;
  8. According to a retired Vatican ambassador, the current Pope who is constantly touted as a reformist who will actually do something tangible about the child abuse scandal apparently knew of allegations made against Cardinal McCarrick yet not only did nothing but continued to cover for him. Hardly the actions of a reformist who believes in transparency;
And finally, a few reasons which are more personal beliefs than anything else but I'm sure you'll seize on these in an attempt to dismiss the rest of what I've written out of hand;
  1. The Church promotes a nihilistic view of humanity and its doctrines are repressive nonsense our species would do well to rise above;
  2. The Church actively stamped out the worship of not only my gods but also repressed the religions of numerous other peoples in its single-minded approach to force everyone to adopt its creed;
Whether the Church is deliberately targeted by international efforts with the express purpose of shutting down like the criminal organisation it is; or whether it is fined down, diocese by diocese, and its hierarchy (where guilty) are imprisoned for their actions in engaging in or in covering up child abuse or any of the other crimes the Church is complicit in to the point where the Church can no longer function; either way I'm game for that.
 
LuisDantas

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
The Emperor of Mankind said:
Well it would remove a strongly regressive force which is causing so many problems for our species. The global child abuse scandal is merely the latest in a line of problems that can be traced back to the Church.
Click to expand...

I will read your list carefully later, but for now let me say that removing a bad influence isn't always a good thing. We should consider what other consequences are likely to arise from the way in which the removal is done.

You would not believe how bad it is here in Brazil that there are people wanting to vote in Bolsonaro, supposedly because he would "remove" the bad influence of Dilma/Lula/ the Worker's Party/ "The Left".


Edited to add: That said, I have now read your list and I do not have much if any issue with any of what you say. I just think that we should attempt to make the changes organic and palatable by the larger community in order to avoid further damage.
 
Last edited:
LuisDantas

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
paarsurrey said:
Are they personally involved in any crime?
Click to expand...

What exactly constitutes a crime is for judges, tribunals and juries to decide, but it sure looks like they are both guilty of very serious crimes of covering up other crimes of paedophilia.

If not, why should they step down, please?

Regards
Click to expand...
As acknowledgement of their (perhaps not yet sufficiently demonstrated) role in attempting to obstruct justice for the victims of paedophilia.

And as a first step in asking for forgiveness from the worldwide Catholic community.
 
paarsurrey

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
LuisDantas said:
What exactly constitutes a crime is for judges, tribunals and juries to decide, but it sure looks like they are both guilty of very serious crimes of covering up other crimes of paedophilia.


As acknowledgement of their (perhaps not yet sufficiently demonstrated) role in attempting to obstruct justice for the victims of paedophilia.

And as a first step in asking for forgiveness from the worldwide Catholic community.
Click to expand...
It is a moral aspect. I don't mind if they do it voluntarily.
Regards
 
LuisDantas

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
oldbadger said:
Absolutely. About 4000 of them?
And the 410,000 innocent priests could rely upon our
support?
Click to expand...
They should... although it can be a major headache to establish the boundaries of responsibility in such a huge and strongly hierarchical organization.
 
oldbadger

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
LuisDantas said:
They should... although it can be a major headache to establish the boundaries of responsibility in such a huge and strongly hierarchical organization.
Click to expand...

Fair enough..... so we need to be careful about where we throw our stones, who we defame and who we blame, not clutching at weak indirect evidence and looking upon it as sure-fire fact.

Each charged person deserves a defence. Each convicted person needs a just sentence.
 
oldbadger

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
The Emperor of Mankind said:
However many there are; along with those who covered up said abuse and helped move the abusers from place to place so as not to arouse the suspicion of the secular authorities as they could well be complicit in the crimes.
Click to expand...

Yes. Sure. That's called aiding and abetting a crime where I live, and carries the same sentence as the original criminal action, usually.

But there is also Perversion of the Course of Justice, and where any might try to 'fit up' an innocent then they should get a sentence commensurate with such a serious crime.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top