The Catholic Church should be shut down

[Shadow Wolf]

What law? Your Law?

International laws that explicitly prohibit child abuse, for starters.

 

[2ndpillar]

But what about the Lizard People??

As the "dragon" (Revelation 16:13), can be considered to have traits of a lizard, those people being led by the demon spirits "like a frog" (Rev 16:13), such as Obama, Hillary, and their followers, could be considered to come under your "Lizard People" umbrella.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

The Church has already been taking actions and the number of incidents over the last decade is much lower than in all previous decades since WWII.

OK they have taken action but how many priests have gone to jail. And the number should be ZERO not just less than previous years. Obviously not enough action has been taken. Why are people afraid to demand more?

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Absolutely!
How horrified and despondent the righteous priests and followers must be about all this. How swindled, deceived and cheated they must feel.
How dreadful for them.

And how much more dreadful for the victims.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

OK they have taken action but how many priests have gone to jail. And the number should be ZERO not just less than previous years. Obviously not enough action has been taken. Why are people afraid to demand more?

Probably a lot of people want to but we don't have the Power to do anything. We can tell till the cows come home but it there's no "vote" (analogy) nothing gets done.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Probably a lot of people want to but we don't have the Power to do anything. We can tell till the cows come home but it there's no "vote" (analogy) nothing gets done.

That is exactly the attitude that allows this to continue. You DO have power. Organize a protest among people you know. Spread the word. Set one week when people stay home from church and donate nothing. That will get their attention. ACT now and see the power you have.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

That is exactly the attitude that allows this to continue. You DO have power. Organize a protest among people you know. Spread the word. Set one week when people stay home from church and donate nothing. That will get their attention. ACT now and see the power you have.

What are you doing on a large scale to help this?

I know for me Im looking for work and got to get my health in tack. Probably find a t.v. to own and sneak around the Churches to see if I'm missing any teachings that involve child abuse.

Do you work for the government, in politics, or vote (here in the US) or even part of organizations that fight for human Rights?

It's easy to talk about them-people and how awful they are. You are one of them too.

 

[oldbadger]

International laws that explicitly prohibit child abuse, for starters.

I don't know of any INTERNATIONAL laws to protect children.

I wonder how many countries support, defend or ignore FGM and MGM? People still sell their sons and daughters hands in marriage where I live, let alone the rest of the World.

And since this thread is overflowing with indignation about the whole RCC, what has anybody done about the thousands of children dying in third World countries EACH DAY? ..... and in this context please don't mention the charities that we now believe to be exploiting children.

Mrs Badger got it right when she said, 'AT LEAST 1% OF THE WORLD'S PEOPLE HAS COMMITTED CRIMES AGAINST CHILDREN, SO SHUT DOWN THE WORLD'.

 

[oldbadger]

And how much more dreadful for the victims.

The innocent priests and followers would be victims if a bunch of self-righteous folks got to shut down a religion with over a billion followers.

Now I know that you have victims of child sexual abuse on your mind at this time, so please tell us what you personally have done about child sexual abuse in your lifetime....... please? And what did you do when you personally heard about, or witnessed or suspected child sexual abuse was happening, say, in your street, or district, or at work......?

waiting...........

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Still unconstutional because it violates both the freedom of religion guaranteed by the 1st Amendment and the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th. It's also punishes the innocent.

Making the Catholic Church pay what it owes, even to the point of bankrupting it, would not violate the American Constitution.

Imprisoning all the individuals in the Church who committed crimes - including not only the abusive priests but also the senior priests and bishops who covered the abuse up - would not violate the American Constitution, even if it guts the Church’s administration to the point where it can’t function.

And the American Constitution sure isn’t the final word on a global scandal.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

It's "too big to fail".

At some point these organizations become so wealthy and powerful that they are untouchable even by the power of a national government. One of these organization will end up killing us all, someday, because we're just too stupid to keep them from gaining so much wealth and power.

I agree; it's too wealthy and powerful to be touched by any single government. However I think coordinated legal action by numerous national governments could do the trick. Death by a thousand small cuts.

 

[metis]

OK they have taken action but how many priests have gone to jail. And the number should be ZERO not just less than previous years. Obviously not enough action has been taken. Why are people afraid to demand more?

I don't know the numbers overall, and agree that the best number should be 0. However, neither should the improvement in those numbers and the procedures be ignored either.

BTW, abuse is not just found within the CC as there are scandals to be found in all denominations. The fundamentalist Protestant church I grew up in had two significant scandals and one relatively minor one when I belonged to it, but I betcha you didn't hear or read about them.

 

[metis]

Death by a thousand small cuts.

And why would you want that?

 

[metis]

Making the Catholic Church pay what it owes, even to the point of bankrupting it, would not violate the American Constitution.

Imprisoning all the individuals in the Church who committed crimes - including not only the abusive priests but also the senior priests and bishops who covered the abuse up - would not violate the American Constitution, even if it guts the Church’s administration to the point where it can’t function.

And the American Constitution sure isn’t the final word on a global scandal.

And I never said nor posted anything different.

 

[Koldo]

The innocent priests and followers would be victims if a bunch of self-righteous folks got to shut down a religion with over a billion followers.

Now I know that you have victims of child sexual abuse on your mind at this time, so please tell us what you personally have done about child sexual abuse in your lifetime....... please? And what did you do when you personally heard about, or witnessed or suspected child sexual abuse was happening, say, in your street, or district, or at work......?

waiting...........

I have not supported the rapists nor an institution known for not properly handling them ( to say the least ). I guess that's an excellent start, don't you think so ?

Can everyone else say the same ?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Wow! Looks as if you think that a large % of the RCC priests were doing all this?

But there are about 414,000 priests in the RCC, and about 4000 bad uns, which will leave about 410,000 innocents to be judged and condemned as well.......

Good Luck with that.......

A large percentage were/are doing it. Far too many. On a world wide scale. The part of that makes it even worse though, is the fact that another large percentage were/are covering it up and shuffling around abusers to other locations, rather than calling the authorities and actually holding them accountable for their heinous actions. That is the part you seem to keep ignoring in this discussion.

As I said earlier, then innocents can go start their own church (or take over the current one) and continue to be innocents. Why would they want to be part of an organization that has done what the Catholic Church is involved in with abusing children and covering it up? Why would anyone want to be part of such an organization?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Still unconstutional because it violates both the freedom of religion guaranteed by the 1st Amendment and the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th. It's also punishes the innocent.

I agree with what was said in post #250, on this.

I have never said that and have numerous posts to confirm that I don't believe as such. On another similar thread, I put forth a seven-point plan of what I'd like to see happen with how I think the Church should handle this as well as the civil authorities.

I wouldn't mind reading that.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Don't need seven points. Just shut off the money even for one week.

 

[LuisDantas]

I agree; it's too wealthy and powerful to be touched by any single government. However I think coordinated legal action by numerous national governments could do the trick. Death by a thousand small cuts.

I guess I don't really see the point of that.

Big organizations are not necessarily worse than governments, and there is no clear reason why the later would have the moral authority to attempt to destroy the former. More to the point, there is no clear reason to trust their intent or the end results.

But above all, I don't think that the RCC is quite powerful enough nor corrupt enough to deserve or need full destruction. It can probably be reformed easily enough if the people themselves want to do that. It is my understanding that this has largely happened in some countries already, such as Germany and the Scandinavian countries, albeit mostly with the national protestant churches instead of Catholicism.

We need transparency, responsibility and accountability, not grand, dramatic gestures of questionable meaning or worth. What would destruction of the RCC even achieve, exactly?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I don't know of any INTERNATIONAL laws to protect children.

The Geneva Accord alone is heavy loaded with laws that protect children