Texas pastor openly calls on 'Christian nationalists' to 'impose their values on society'

[Sand Dancer]

Historically it was the other way around. Muslims aren't allowed to charge interest today.

I got it wrong, sorry. I deleted.

 

[Twilight Hue]

What, the ones mentioned in the OP?

Appreciate and respect storming the Capitol, for instance?

Do you approve of the theocracy in Iran that murders women and others in the name of their God?

Incidentally, i commend the brave women in Iran for their show of defiance in face of religious oppression.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I think he has a good point, if others push their godless values to others, why they would not be allowed to do the same? And in a way that is democracy, people push their values to others in it, in any case. I think it would be better, if people would be free and independent and decide only about their own life, without any "power rings" to rule them all.

It depends on how 'their values' match to the constitution.
Democracy isn't supposed to be a pure rule of the majority over the minority.

'Godless values' is a little disparaging to progressive theists, in particular, btw. More just confusing to us actual Godless.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Historically it was the other way around. Muslims aren't allowed to charge interest today.

One of the few things I complement and admire Muslims over.

If we had honest banking like Muslims do among themselves, we would be far better off and much much happier if we eliminated interest and compounding interest ourselves as a society.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

When push comes to shove....

Texas pastor openly calls on 'Christian nationalists' to 'impose their values on society'

"Texas megachurch pastor Robert Jeffress said over the weekend that Christian nationalists had a right to "impose their values" on everyone else.

During an interview with Real America's Voice host Tim Clinton, Jeffress addressed recent concerns about the rising nationalist movement among Christians.

"We always put our love for God above everything, even allegiance to our country," he explained. "But that's not what they're really talking about. Listen carefully. They say they are opposed to people who say America was founded as a Christian nation, Americans who believe not only in the spiritual heritage of our nation, but believe that we ought to use elections to help return our country to its Christian foundation."

"If that's Christian nationalism, count me in," the pastor laughed. "Because that's what we have to do. And what's so hypocritical about this, Tim, is the left don't mind at all imposing their values on our country through the election process. They don't mind forcing their pro-abortion, pro-transgender, pro-open borders policy upon our nation."

Jeffress added: "But they object when conservative Christians try to impose their values on society at large. It's complete hypocrisy."

The pastor has previously rejected the Christian nationalist label.

That guy has it completely backward...

What he calls "imposing values" by the left, really is nothing more then allowing people the freedom to make their own decisions and live life as they see fit.

ie, if as a gay man you wish to marry another gay man, go for it. It's not our business what two consenting adults want to do!

However, what THEY try to do is forbid people from doing things. By disallowing them the freedom to make their own decisions.

THEY want to tell the gay guy "NO, YOU CAN NOT MARRY ANOTHER MAN Because we don't like it when gay men marry!"

THAT's "imposing" your values.
What he accuses "the left" of is the exact opposite of that.

Nobody on "the left" is "forcing him" to be gay or marry a gay man.
Nobody is forcing him to do or not do ANYTHING at all.

HE is the one who wants to force things on people.
"The left" just wants people to have the freedom to make their own decisions.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

When push comes to shove....

Texas pastor openly calls on 'Christian nationalists' to 'impose their values on society'

"Texas megachurch pastor Robert Jeffress said over the weekend that Christian nationalists had a right to "impose their values" on everyone else.

During an interview with Real America's Voice host Tim Clinton, Jeffress addressed recent concerns about the rising nationalist movement among Christians.

"We always put our love for God above everything, even allegiance to our country," he explained. "But that's not what they're really talking about. Listen carefully. They say they are opposed to people who say America was founded as a Christian nation, Americans who believe not only in the spiritual heritage of our nation, but believe that we ought to use elections to help return our country to its Christian foundation."

"If that's Christian nationalism, count me in," the pastor laughed. "Because that's what we have to do. And what's so hypocritical about this, Tim, is the left don't mind at all imposing their values on our country through the election process. They don't mind forcing their pro-abortion, pro-transgender, pro-open borders policy upon our nation."

Jeffress added: "But they object when conservative Christians try to impose their values on society at large. It's complete hypocrisy."

The pastor has previously rejected the Christian nationalist label.

You see, the problem is that this "pastor" is just an idiot, with not even a minimal idea of what makes a logical statement of fact.

"They don't mind forcing their pro-abortion, pro-transgender, pro-open borders policy upon our nation [...] But they object when conservative Christians try to impose their values on society at large."

See, being "pro-abortion" does not say to a single American -- not one -- that "you must have an abortion." Being anti-abortion, as the pastor is, does say exactly that -- "every single one of you must NOT have an abortion." Being "pro trans-gender" does not demand that anyone change their sex, but being anti trans-gender says "you may not, any of you, by our decree, do anything of the kind. Your masters have spoken!" One side says "we are all free to be who and what we are," and the other says "Christians Nationalists will decide for you who and what you will be allowed to be."

And that kind of thinking has caused more misery than anything else in all of human history. And he loves it!

 

[URAVIP2ME]

When push comes to shove.... Texas pastor openly calls on 'Christian nationalists' to 'impose their values on society'..............l.

When 'push comes to shove ' (if not sooner) the powers in charge will surprisingly turn on the corrupted religious world - 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3
With backing the United Nations can be strengthened to become God's ' arm of the law ' to rid the Earth of those who are Not neutral as Jesus was in being No part of the world, this world of badness under Satan - 2 Corinthians 4:4

 

[Valjean]

I think he has a good point, if others push their godless values to others, why they would not be allowed to do the same? And in a way that is democracy, people push their values to others in it, in any case. I think it would be better, if people would be free and independent and decide only about their own life, without any "power rings" to rule them all.

How do you know it's their values that are the godless ones?
Is democracy pushing values on others, or a collective decision on a workable modus vivendi?

 

[1213]

How do you know it's their values that are the godless ones?
Is democracy pushing values on others, or a collective decision on a workable modus vivendi?

They are godless values, if they are the opposite of God's will, or not God's values (God's values are for example the ten commandments).

Maybe in good situation it is modus vivendi. Today it looks like, who can force own values to others. I think best would be that people are free to live their own life as they want.

 

[1213]

It depends on how 'their values' match to the constitution.
Democracy isn't supposed to be a pure rule of the majority over the minority.

'Godless values' is a little disparaging to progressive theists, in particular, btw. More just confusing to us actual Godless.

Sorry if it was disparaging. But if Christians pushes values that comes from the God, then the others, with opposing values would automatically push values that don't come from God, that can be called then godless values. Godless means only something without God, nothing more.

What do you think democracy is supposed to be and why?

 

[1213]

Well, the problem is how to do it in practice. Because if you claim you as you decide the rights of others, they can also do it with you.

So according to my religion you have no rights at all. You are not even a human. Can you understand the problem with that?

That is the reason why I think no human should have power over other person and everyone should be free to live their own life as they want. It is as bad as the one ring in the lord of the rings, when power is centralized.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

That is the reason why I think no human should have power over other person and everyone should be free to live their own life as they want. It is as bad as the one ring in the lord of the rings, when power is centralized.

Now i want to drunk drive, drive reckless and way over the speed limit and nobody have the power to do anything about that, because it is my life and I am free to as I want.

 

[Lekatt]

Just don't expect them to appreciate and respect yours, and I'm sure you'll get along fine.

(To be clear, I'm not talking about Christians, per se, but those who merge nationalism/jingoism with religion and claim moral superiority due to...due to...something. the last bit never made sense to me)

I like your post and your poem. I think you understand more about life than others.

I believe in a higher intelligence that creates and controls our universe. But it has nothing to do with religion. I believe Jesus taught us the path and those who walk it find out it is a superior way of living. Unfortunately Christian Nationalist have forgotten or are willing to ignore the teachings of Jesus.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

How do you know it's their values that are the godless ones?
Is democracy pushing values on others, or a collective decision on a workable modus vivendi?

This still misses the essential point, I think. For too many people, "religious freedom" means "I should get to tell others what they must and must not do, based on my religion, and if I can't, how can I say I have religious freedom?"

This is, of course, a completely false premise. I happily grant to everyone the complete freedom to live their own lives according to whatever religious beliefs they might have. I do not grant to anyone the permission to try and live somebody else's life -- with or without religious beliefs.

 

[SkepticThinker]

This still misses the essential point, I think. For too many people, "religious freedom" means "I should get to tell others what they must and must not do, based on my religion, and if I can't, how can I say I have religious freedom?"

This is, of course, a completely false premise. I happily grant to everyone the complete freedom to live their own lives according to whatever religious beliefs they might have. I do not grant to anyone the permission to try and live somebody else's life -- with or without religious beliefs.

I do believe you've hit the nail directly on its head.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Sorry if it was disparaging. But if Christians pushes values that comes from the God, then the others, with opposing values would automatically push values that don't come from God, that can be called then godless values.

So, just to clarify what I meant, I didn't find it personally disparaging. I am indeed godless, and if I take you at face value (which is my intent) than my values do indeed lack consideration of God.

However, there are theists on both sides of the political divide, and all along the political continuum. One side claiming their opponents have 'Godless values' seems disparaging when there are plenty of progressives (for want of a better term) who would very much see their beliefs as being born of their holistic worldviews, with those very much being informed by their religions.

I was sticking up for leftie theists, in clumsy shorthand.

Godless means only something without God, nothing more.

I'd argue the toss on that (and am happy to if you're interested) but I'm also happy to accept that is all you meant by the term.

What do you think democracy is supposed to be and why?

A way to balance the needs, wants and wishes of each individual in society against concepts like societal cohesion and a general ability to function. It's a compromise, ultimately.

Obviously it changes in detail when discussing direct versus representative democracies, etc.

You?

 

[Valjean]

They are godless values, if they are the opposite of God's will, or not God's values (God's values are for example the ten commandments).

Maybe in good situation it is modus vivendi. Today it looks like, who can force own values to others. I think best would be that people are free to live their own life as they want.

Again, how do you know the Bible and ten commandments are God's will? How do you know there is a god, for that matter?
Maybe the Popol Vuh is the word of God. How does one test such things?

I do agree that we should live and let live, and avoid imposing our religious values on others. That's resulted in nothing but war, persecution, and millions of deaths over the centuries.

 

[Valjean]

Now i want to drunk drive, drive reckless and way over the speed limit and nobody have the power to do anything about that, because it is my life and I am free to as I want.

I'll race ya!

 

[Five Solas]

When push comes to shove....

Texas pastor openly calls on 'Christian nationalists' to 'impose their values on society'

"Texas megachurch pastor Robert Jeffress said over the weekend that Christian nationalists had a right to "impose their values" on everyone else.

During an interview with Real America's Voice host Tim Clinton, Jeffress addressed recent concerns about the rising nationalist movement among Christians.

"We always put our love for God above everything, even allegiance to our country," he explained. "But that's not what they're really talking about. Listen carefully. They say they are opposed to people who say America was founded as a Christian nation, Americans who believe not only in the spiritual heritage of our nation, but believe that we ought to use elections to help return our country to its Christian foundation."

"If that's Christian nationalism, count me in," the pastor laughed. "Because that's what we have to do. And what's so hypocritical about this, Tim, is the left don't mind at all imposing their values on our country through the election process. They don't mind forcing their pro-abortion, pro-transgender, pro-open borders policy upon our nation."

Jeffress added: "But they object when conservative Christians try to impose their values on society at large. It's complete hypocrisy."

The pastor has previously rejected the Christian nationalist label.

Christians do the will of God BECAUSE we believe.
People who do not believe in God (Non-Christians) CANNOT do the will of God.

Jesus did not say, "Go into the world and force people to do My will." We are supposed to make disciples. A deeper understanding is that the Great Commission encourages believers to be a “light” to the world that can be seen by all.

To say it differently, God expects all people to love Him but only Christians do. The others can't.

It is not a biblical demand to force anyone to live a Godly life.

Isaiah had much to say about the salvation of Gentiles through the coming of Messiah:

1 “Arise! Shine! For your light arrives!
The splendor of the Lord shines on you!
2 For, look, darkness covers the earth
and deep darkness covers the nations,
but the Lord shines on you;
his splendor appears over you.
3 Nations come to your light,
kings to your bright light (Is 60:1-3)

The Old Testament prophets spoke of the coming Messiah as a “light to the Gentiles.” That is also how Jesus is presented in the Gospels. As New Testament Christians we understand what it means to be a “light”. It comes from to the Old Testament. Israel was supposed to be a “light” to the Gentiles but so often failed miserably. Jesus called us to be a light.

Christian, just be what you are and your light will shine!

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Christians do the will of God BECAUSE we believe.
People who do not believe in God (Non-Christians) CANNOT do the will of God.

Jesus did not say, "Go into the world and force people to do My will." We are supposed to make disciples. A deeper understanding is that the Great Commission encourages believers to be a “light” to the world that can be seen by all.

To say it differently, God expects all people to love Him but only Christians do. The others can't.

It is not a biblical demand to force anyone to live a Godly life.

Isaiah had much to say about the salvation of Gentiles through the coming of Messiah:

1 “Arise! Shine! For your light arrives!
The splendor of the Lord shines on you!
2 For, look, darkness covers the earth
and deep darkness covers the nations,
but the Lord shines on you;
his splendor appears over you.
3 Nations come to your light,
kings to your bright light (Isaiah 60:1-3).

The Old Testament prophets spoke of the coming Messiah as a “light to the Gentiles.” That is also how Jesus is presented in the Gospels. As New Testament Christians we understand what it means to be a “light”. It comes from to the Old Testament. Israel was supposed to be a “light” to the Gentiles but so often failed miserably. Jesus called us to be a light.

Christian, just be what you are and your light will shine!

Yeah, you are in effect dangerous to the rest of us.