Signs of the Times - What’s happening to our world?

[WhyIsThatSo]

I doubt that, but if you are right then he has an awful lot to answer for.

I'm a Deist. But I can acknowledge your belief in that.
Can you acknowledge mine?

I acknowledge that your belief is closer to the truth than you know.

 

[oldbadger]

No, when this is all over, there will be cheap airline tickets. Less people willing to fly means lower prices to try and get people to fill in the empty seats. Sales occurs when products aren't selling as much compared to the past, and companies are losing more money to keep them up on the shelves. Breaking even is still better than a loss. And a 90% loss is better than 100% loss.

If we are still around after the sickness has gone, it will be interesting to see how things turn out. I do reckon that airline travel will change forever.

Hey...... It's anybody's guess I reckon.

 

[oldbadger]

I acknowledge that your belief is closer to the truth than you know.

Fair enough.
It's good when different religions can acknowledge each other.

 

[Jainarayan]

432,000 can also be seen as at least 3 cycles, with others to come.

So from Krishna we have 4 cycles, I see that may be cycles of prophecy;

4 = Moses, Zoroaster, Buddha and Jesus Christ.

As far as I'm concerned that's a misuse and misinterpretation of Hindu belief, which is altogether too common and a misappropriation among new religious movements, New Age and universalism.

 

[Jedster]

At the moment we're quarantined for at least 2 weeks in France. We're only allowed out of the house to go to the supermarket or to the hospital and even for that, we have to fill a declaration because this is France and red tape is like a national sports.
All other activities, whatever their nature, are suspended until further notice from the government.
I'm working from home, bored out of my mind, but at least I can work in sportswear and play music in the background, plus I have plenty of coffee

The JWs here(UK) are still active. I had visit a couple of days ago and I noticed in town yesterday, they were occupying their usual space.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

As far as I'm concerned that's a misuse and misinterpretation of Hindu belief, which is altogether too common and a misappropriation among new religious movements, New Age and universalism.

Therin lays the quandary of of the OP and what is happening to this world.

You are free to see it that way and not further explore the possibilities.

Regards Tony

 

[CG Didymus]

The one thing which bothers me with explanations like this is that the flood came after Noah not before. Noah called men to God and righteousness time and again and was ignored. Then the flood came.

As it was in the days of Noah so shall the coming of the Son of Man be, The meaning I’m espousing is that He’s already come and people have turned away and so now humanity is beginning to suffer the consequences. Yes it was probably caused by uncleanliness but I don’t believe God will allow greed and injustice to continue on earth forever. So if man won’t change then God will establish His Kingdom on earth in other ways. My understanding of God’s Kingdom is a System that will replace the current one.

But there has always been wars and plagues and earthquakes. What did we learn from the flu epidemic and the war back a hundred or so years ago? Did it lead to more people becoming Baha'is? Then there is the thing I always ask Baha'is, in the New Testament, the return happens after the wars and other tribulations.

But, if this is leading to something good, like a world filled with peace and harmony, then I won't complain too much... except maybe to Christians. But... if a seemly "perfect" world of peace and harmony still gets plagued with wars and new diseases, then I will complain to the Baha'is too.

 

[CG Didymus]

I honestly wondered about this. When more people and companies find it possible to work from home, and don't see a productivity decrease, it may just become more normal. I work from home myself already - have for many years now, and I do right by my company - whoever that is at any given time. I can tell you no company I've worked for from home has lamented hiring me. That's not me tooting my own horn - it's me pointing to the practicality of working from home as an option on both sides of the fence (company and employee).

Who's going to build things. Who's going to make things at the factories? Who's going to transport the things that people need? I'm in construction. My work is at a job site, and then I go to a different job site. If I go to a store for supplies, I'm counting on the things I need to be there. So if someone didn't cut a chunk of marble out of the ground in Italy... or a logger didn't chop down a tree in Oregon... then what? I don't get my marble tile and the 2x4's I need to do my job. If I call the tile store or the lumber company, that person might be working from home. But what is it for me for them to look at their computer and tell me that the things I ordered aren't going to be in... And they don't know when they will ever be in. Sure, they still have a job, but all the people that actually make the product and transport it to the store don't have a job and neither do I.

 

[CG Didymus]

Vaishnava texts say that in 428,898 years Vishnu will incarnate as Kalki to restore dharma (righteousness) and usher in a new golden age of the world. Moreover, not all Hindus subscribe to that belief. But it is not "end times" as Abrahamics understand it. In Hindu (and Buddhist) philosophy the universe is cyclic. It doesn't end, it just changes. The idea that we are seeing signs of the end times is preposterous as far as I'm concerned. Things such as these... war, disease, famine, "pestilence", etc. ... have been occurring for millennia. Every generation laments they're seeing the "end times".

It has been explained by Baha'u'llah that it does mean cycles are renewed, that is what end of times, or end of ages means.

The numbers you quote, if original, would have a specific meaning, not necessarily telling of a precise time line.

In Hindu cosmology there are 4 ages (yugas): Satya, Treta, Dwapara, Kali (nothing to do w/ Goddess) each lasting a longer time than the previous. They are also in order of their righteousness, with Satya being the best and Kali being the most degenerate. We are in Kali Yuga now. It began in 3102 BCE when Lord Krishna left Earth. This yuga is predicted to last 432,000 years. Hence the remaining 428,898 years before Vishnu returns.

It could or may not indicate the following, it works for me.

432,000 can also be seen as at least 3 cycles, with others to come.

As far as I'm concerned that's a misuse and misinterpretation of Hindu belief, which is altogether too common and a misappropriation among new religious movements, New Age and universalism

Therin lays the quandary of of the OP and what is happening to this world.

You are free to see it that way and not further explore the possibilities.

Why do things like this have to happen? Do Baha'is realize that they are pretty much telling people in the other religions how wrong they are to believe what they do? Baha'is need to be the ones that help unite the other religions. Why continually push them away? No proselytizing? What's the difference?

 

[Faithofchristian]

I believe we are approaching End Times - specifically "The Great Tribulation"

I believe Jesus is going to come down from Heaven, an event which will be literally awesome!

It's just a matter of when...

Any time now...

But have you any idea who comes first..
Have you any idea that there are two tribulations.
Which tribulation comes first?
In the book of Revelation.

 

[Aupmanyav]

2 = Bab and Baha'u'llah which will again last 500,000 years, to which details will be provided.

You forget Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, the Mahdi, of the Ahmadiyyas, with the latest message from Allah. The message that Bahaollah gave to the world was wrong, and Allah had to send a correction immediately in the form of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Why do things like this have to happen? Do Baha'is realize that they are pretty much telling people in the other religions how wrong they are to believe what they do? Baha'is need to be the ones that help unite the other religions. Why continually push them away? No proselytizing? What's the difference?

I guess you will have to ask God as to why God chooses to send Messengers and then that Messenger asks the followers to share the Faith.

No one pushes any person away by having a conversation. We have choices and choices have to be made. We can look at the value of both sides of the discussion.

That is what God gives us, who am I to say it should unfold in any other way but by deeds supported by words.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

You forget Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, the Mahdi, of the Ahmadiyyas, with the latest message from Allah. The message that Bahaollah gave to the world was wrong, and Allah had to send a correction immediately in the form of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.

I have not forgotten he was a man with many great teachings and that he has followers that practice those teachings.

Regards Tony

 

[Aupmanyav]

You still forget that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was the mahdi and not Bab. You can ask our resident Ahmadiyya.

 

[loverofhumanity]

But there has always been wars and plagues and earthquakes. What did we learn from the flu epidemic and the war back a hundred or so years ago? Did it lead to more people becoming Baha'is? Then there is the thing I always ask Baha'is, in the New Testament, the return happens after the wars and other tribulations.

But, if this is leading to something good, like a world filled with peace and harmony, then I won't complain too much... except maybe to Christians. But... if a seemly "perfect" world of peace and harmony still gets plagued with wars and new diseases, then I will complain to the Baha'is too.

Hi CG.

Humanity doesn’t evolve spiritually very fast. From recent calamities we did become more universal and have gone down the path of world trade and world solidarity and world mindedness after the great wars with the UN and such. International technologies enabled things like the olympics and world mingling. Interfaith and multi culturalism have also appeared. Yet there is much more to be done agreed.

The Baha’i view is that the Kingdom of God will be rolled out gradually not a sudden overnight event and that just like it took hundreds of years for Christianity to establish itself so too will it be with the Baha’i Faith.

There are no shortcuts. Humanity advances spiritually slowly and gradually and often through tests and suffering rather than willing choice so I believe we are headed towards world peace and world unity but the path is torturous because we resist it not realising that it is a far better place that Baha’u’llah is seeking to take us to. Fear of the unknown is what makes us fearful and hesitant,

 

[oldbadger]

Why do things like this have to happen? Do Baha'is realize that they are pretty much telling people in the other religions how wrong they are to believe what they do? Baha'is need to be the ones that help unite the other religions. Why continually push them away? No proselytizing? What's the difference?

Some religions are just determined to push themselves forward in any situation, working the numbers, manipulating the prophesies, seeing their 'truth' in every tragedy, war, peace, advance, etc etc that occurs.

........ and reversing themselves in to every other religion, culture, tenet and group.

It can be interesting to observe, this kind of evangelistic 'knitting;', but it can also be intensely irritating at times.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Some religions are just determined to push themselves forward in any situation, working the numbers, manipulating the prophesies, seeing their 'truth' in every tragedy, war, peace, advance, etc etc that occurs.

........ and reversing themselves in to every other religion, culture, tenet and group.

It can be interesting to observe, this kind of evangelistic 'knitting;', but it can also be intensely irritating at times.

Ok but I believe this is supposition. What IF we are only guilty of telling other religions the truth that their Promised One has come? Is that a crime or some kind of insult? The foundation of all these allegations against Baha’is I believe, is the assumption we are wrong. What if we are telling you and the world the truth?

Aren’t Christians waiting for Christ’s return as are other religions their Messiah? What IF He has come? Then isn’t all we really stand guilty of is letting them know their Beloved has appeared?

Everyone seems to automatically be assuming the posture that we are wrong. What if we are telling the truth?

If we do speak the truth then doesn't Christ if He returned have any say over Christians or the Bible? If Christ returned wouldn’t He have the right to tell Christians that they misinterpreted the prophecies? The same with Buddha. Ananda asked the Buddha who will they follow when He is gone and He said a future Buddha Maitreya so if that Buddha has arrived then haven’t Buddhists been instructed to turn to Him?

We individual Baha’is have no authority whatsoever. It is Baha’u’llah, Who we believe to be the Promised One Who is the Authority and claims to be the Lord of all religions and He has rebuked Kings and religious leaders appealing to them to change their ways.

Does that cause disunity? Of course. Baha’u’llah came to bring truth not to appease the worlds religious leaders. For His claims He was exiled and imprisoned for 40 years. So the world, as it listens to it’s religious leaders is going to be vehemently opposed to Baha’u’llah, the Baha’i Faith and Baha’is notwithstanding their own Holy Books speak of Him. But there will be many fair minded people who won’t go down that path as we are peaceful people to those who know us. Not perfect but peaceful.

It is to be expected that we will, because of the claims made by Baha’u’llah be vehemently opposed at every turn by one and all.

...a large multitude of people will arise against you, showing oppression, expressing contumely and derision, shunning your society, and heaping upon you ridicule

There is no gain personal or other for Baha’is to tell humanity that their awaited Promised One has come.

The clash is that this news does not go down well at all with religious leaders who I believe want to maintain control over their followers as if they are their own personal possessions.

I believe a Promised One is seen as the greatest threat to the authority and power of religious leaders which is why whenever a Christ or a Muhammad appear They are crucified, tortured, imprisoned and exiled. Refer to history.

So although the Baha’i message and Baha’is are peaceful, the Authority of Baha’u’llah I believe as the Promised One is seen as a threat to all religious leaders who inform their followers likewise that He is a false prophet and such and that we are stirrers up of mischief or satanic when in fact we are guilty I believe of nothing but informing them that their Promised One has appeared.

So I believe that until courageous people arise who will disregard tradition and the common views held by priests and look with their own eyes appear that we will be opposed, hated, ridiculed and shunned in every which way possible to silence our voice.

But I wouldn’t be automatically assuming that Baha’u’llah is not the Promised One. It could be true.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Our world is fast changing. Now this virus is closing down the world.

Does your religion say anything about these times? My religion says plenty.

So what does this virus mean to religionists? Is it a prophecy of your Faith? Or do you think it is preparing the world for something?

Please share your views as I have many passages in my Faith referring to these times but want to know what you all think, believe and feel.

Those without a Faith may like to comment on the financial and social implications of the world shutting down, how long it might last and what long term effect it could have.

Will this cause permanent changes to humanity?

In short: no.

Virus outbreaks have been coming and going throughout human history.
The only reason they are less common these days, is thanks to all advances in medical science and hygiene in general. Now there is a new and dangerous virus for which we do not yet have a proper cure / vaccine.

This used to be the case for most viruses. Now you may perhaps understand how lucky you are to be alive today, with all the technology and understanding we have, instead 200 years ago or more.

There's nothing particularly special about Covid-19.
The black plague for example was much much worse.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Here's an interesting article that claims the white collar 'work from home' remedy for COVID -19 will be something that sticks! Permanently.

Coronavirus will change how we shop, travel and work for years

It might end up being THE answer to climate change.

Already today, carbon emmissions have been dropping tremendeously. It is estimated that carbon emmission in china alone has dropped by 2% these past weeks.

The air in Italy has never been cleaner the past decades.

In that sense, I kind of hope that the crisis lasts for long enough so that people become forced to do business differently. At the moment, they are just closing shop. This can't be done indefinatly - money is going to run out eventually and business will need to be rebooted.

If it lasts long enough, that new way of doing business and living life will become "the new norm".
This indeed has the potential to turn society around. To view economy, business, travel and industry in a different way.

I'm the kind of guy who lives by the slogan "Every problem is an opportunity in disguise". I always try to find that bright side of things and get all positives out of a negative.

This whole crisis is a very big negative. What a waste it would be, if nothing positive comes out of it, right?

I think we should cease this opportunity to show and understand with hard data, how this entire episode affected carbon emissions and climate change. And then see which of these measures currently being taken, could actually become the real norm (without, obviously, stripping freedoms away of people). Like teleworking from home... If that could become the new norm, it would be TREMENDOUS.

 

[loverofhumanity]

In short: no.

Virus outbreaks have been coming and going throughout human history.
The only reason they are less common these days, is thanks to all advances in medical science and hygiene in general. Now there is a new and dangerous virus for which we do not yet have a proper cure / vaccine.

This used to be the case for most viruses. Now you may perhaps understand how lucky you are to be alive today, with all the technology and understanding we have, instead 200 years ago or more.

There's nothing particularly special about Covid-19.
The black plague for example was much much worse.

Very glad it’s not a plague but it’s being treated as if it’s a plague? Why? Maybe indecurity that there’s no vaccine?