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Featured Signs of the Times - What’s happening to our world?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by loverofhumanity, Mar 14, 2020.

  1. loverofhumanity

    loverofhumanity Well-Known Member
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    Our world is fast changing. Now this virus is closing down the world.

    Does your religion say anything about these times? My religion says plenty.

    So what does this virus mean to religionists? Is it a prophecy of your Faith? Or do you think it is preparing the world for something?

    Please share your views as I have many passages in my Faith referring to these times but want to know what you all think, believe and feel.

    Those without a Faith may like to comment on the financial and social implications of the world shutting down, how long it might last and what long term effect it could have.

    Will this cause permanent changes to humanity?
     
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  2. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
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    Is coronavirus a prophecy of your faith? Baha'u'llah died in 1892 and the first virus was discovered by humans in 1892, yet Oceans does not even reveal a mention of the word virus before Shoghi Effendi, in truth Baha'u'llah possibly may not have even been aware of the word.
     
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  3. Landon Caeli

    Landon Caeli ~◇~

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  4. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    You want me to be a prophet? Yeah, it is serious but it will pass away like what happened during many other disasters. It will not cause any 'permanent damage' to humanity. It is not some Allah's retribution. It was most probably just because of unhygienic conditions in a Chinese meat shop.
    @Landon Caeli , some of the changes were already coming.
     
    #4 Aupmanyav, Mar 14, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2020
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  5. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    I find what is recorded at Luke 21:11 does say about these times because 'pestilence' is included.
    This is leading up to permanent changes.
    Besides the global declaring about God's Kingdom of Daniel 2:44 now being spread world wide as per Matthew 24:14, this means we are nearing the ' final signal ', so to speak, in that the powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security... " but that proclaiming will prove to be the precursor to the coming ' great tribulation ' of Revelation 7:14,9
    before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, will usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill.
    Then, there will be ' healing ' for earth's nations as mentioned at Revelation 22:2.
    ' Healing ' as described in Isaiah 35th chapter. No one will say, " I am sick..." as per Isaiah 33:24.
    There will be ' health ' as Jeremiah 33:6 wrote.
     
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  6. Debater Slayer

    Debater Slayer Born-again Glompist
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    Viruses are a part of nature. Many people arrogantly think nature revolves around us, not the other way around. Just like previous pandemics, I believe this will pass and that it says nothing supernatural or unknown about the world. We're just caught in another aspect of nature that shows us how little control we actually have over the planet and its ecosystems.

    The planet has been through multiple extinction events, reshaping of continents, and large-scale climate changes before. This is nothing to Earth and just something big to us, but it will still pass.
     
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  7. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Any more change and I am going to check out and go to the next world. :(

    I know that is not what you asked, but I have about had it. If this is God's wrath, as Shoghi Effendi quoted Baha'u'llah saying in The Promised Day Is Come, pp. 3-4 I honestly cannot understand why everyone has to suffer for what some people did in the past. Moreover, why a purportedly loving God even created a world in which He knew that people and animals would suffer is beyond me. It would certainly be enough to make an atheist out of me, if I did not believe in Baha'u'llah. I do not blame Baha'u'llah for creating this world which is a storehouse of suffering, but I do blame God.

    Now, let the religious apologetic begin.
     
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  8. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    My sister-in-law was a strong Baha'i and she died of liver cancer in 2001. As I recall her telling my brother, who was also a strong Baha'i, she did not want to fight the cancer and was glad she was dying because she did not want ti be around to see what was going to happen in the world. My sister died of cancer in 2004, but she did not want to die. Sorry, but I cannot reconcile an All-Loving God with all the death and suffering in the world. This is not an emotional thing, it is a logical thing. It makes no sense why a Loving God would allow so much suffering, when it did not have to be this way.
     
  9. dfnj

    dfnj Well-Known Member

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    People are really superstitious. People attribute the craziest meaning to all their life experiences. People are really insane when it comes to pareidolia. Everything means everything. Everything is evidence supporting some conclusion.

    I'm not saying the virus is not dangerous as hell. What am saying is if I survive the virus I have my shirt washed and ready to wear (again):

    I survived the end of the world again shirt | Zazzle.com
     
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  10. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Does your religion have a consequence (and end-state) if we don't have peace among humanity in the future?
     
  11. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    We do not see that as a possibility because we believe that eventually there will be peace and a new world older.
    We may have to go through hell to get there though...

    “God’s purpose is none other than to usher in, in ways He alone can bring about, and the full significance of which He alone can fathom, the Great, the Golden Age of a long-divided, a long-afflicted humanity. Its present state, indeed even its immediate future, is dark, distressingly dark. Its distant future, however, is radiant, gloriously radiant—so radiant that no eye can visualize it......”
    The Promised Day is Come, p. 116
     
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  12. dfnj

    dfnj Well-Known Member

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    I am sorry to hear about your loss. So forgive me for commenting but I want to say something about you not being able to reconcile an all-loving God. Here's my argument why we have so much death and suffering in the World yet we still have an all-loving God. The idea has to with Apophatic theology and how we define God. God is perfect, whole, and complete. Being perfect, whole, and complete, God does not have any needs or desires. Since our needs and desires are the source of all that is evil in the World, since God has no evil, God is absolute goodness. Or in other words since God has no need or desire to judge anyone then God is All-loving.

    God did not create the Universe out of some need or desire. God created the Universe out of an overflowing abundance of energy. But our Universe is not perfect, whole, and complete like God. Our Universe is full of imperfections. Nature is full of imperfections. Our human bodies are full of imperfections. It is these imperfections in the Universe, nature, and in ourselves that is the source of all our suffering. Your sister's human imperfections were the cause of her dying from cancer not God's lack of caring.

    The only way God could have prevented all the suffering in the World would have been by creating each of us with omnipotent powers. Only by having omnipotent powers would we be strong enough to overcome all our imperfections. The thing is if we have omnipotent powers then we would not be separate from God. We would be one with the mind of God. We would be God. God did not create us as clones of Himself.

    We were all created to fulfill our part in God's plan. And that plan is we exist to realize God's omnipotence. We exist so God can share in our experiences of having limitations by God sharing in our experiences of love, joy, frustration, suffering, and death. Every choice we make is God realizing what would happen if. I believe we live in a cyclical Universe were over an unimaginable amount of time God gets to experience every possible choice we can make.

    This way of thinking seems logical to me as long as you accept the assumptions I making. You can't prove an assumption. Assumptions are chosen to be true.

    My way of thinking has a really interesting twist to the Adam and Eve creation story. The story is not about sin. The story is about making peace with the tree of knowledge. Once we discover our own imperfections, we are not really cast out from Eden. We just no longer experience it. Many times when people find out they were created with imperfections we turn to our creators and hate them. We hate our creators because they are responsible for all our weaknesses. And our weaknesses are the source of all our suffering. We love our parents for their strengths. But we hate our parents for their weaknesses. This is because our parent's strengths are our strengths. Our parent's weaknesses are our weaknesses. It's only when we accept who we are and love ourselves in spite of our own imperfections that we are able to have a good relationship with our parents.

    The same is true for God. We love God for our strengths. We hate God for not creating us with omnipotent powers. We have to stop judging God. Until we make peace with the tree of knowledge, that is, make peace with our own imperfections in ourselves, the people around us, nature, the Universe we will not be capable of fully loving and appreciating all of God's blessings flowing all around us. Once we make peace with the tree of knowledge we are able to experience again some of the good parts of Eden we lost when we were expelled.
     
    #12 dfnj, Mar 15, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2020
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  13. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Now, that is something new. Did your Allah create the universe or it was Bahaollah? Bahais, who created the universe? And secondly who sent prophets / sons / messengers / mahdis to the world? I read that Bahaollah claims to have done that.
     
  14. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

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    Greta has been saying more than your religion, I think.
    As viewed from space,atmospheric pollution levels are dissipating all over the planet......
    So Greta can be sure that any God that exists is working hard for her! :)

    I don't know of a religion that can't nod its head wisely and declare, 'See? This is what we were told!'
     
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  15. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Allah created the universe.
    Allah sent Prophets and Messengers into the world. Baha'u'llah did not send them.

    “Give ear, O My servant, unto that which is being sent down unto thee from the Throne of thy Lord, the Inaccessible, the Most Great. There is none other God but Him. He hath called into being His creatures, that they may know Him, Who is the Compassionate, the All-Merciful. Unto the cities of all nations He hath sent His Messengers, Whom He hath commissioned to announce unto men tidings of the Paradise of His good pleasure, and to draw them nigh unto the Haven of abiding security, the Seat of eternal holiness and transcendent glory.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 144-145
     
  16. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    • Baha’u’llah mentions in Aqdas, page 43, “There is no God but I the Honored, the Wise.”
    • He again writes in Aqdas, page 144 “Accept whatever is commanded by Baha (himself) the Lord of Eternity.”
    • In Aqdas, page 8, Baha’u’llah says, “We have sent down all the Messengers and we have revealed all the Books.”
    • In Istaqaaraat, page 34, Baha’u’llah writes, “The Master of Eternity lies in prison” (referring to his imprisonment and confinement).
    • In his Tablets, Page 217, Baha’u’llah writes, “All, save me are created from my command.”
    • In his Al-Mubeen, page 34, Baha’u’llah writes, All praise is for you O Baha’u’llah, the Creator of existence.
    • In the same book, page 190, he says, Obey the commands of your Elevated, Splendorous God, Baha’u’llah.
    • Again in Al-Mubeen, page 297, Baha’u’llah again refers to himself as, You Most Beneficent Lord, Baha’u’llah”,
    • In his Tajalliyaat (Tajalli number 4), page 5, Baha’u’llah decrees,Most surely I am Allah. There is no God save me. I am the Lord of everything. The O my creatures, you worship me alone.
    • Abdul Baha writes in Badaaé-ul-Asaar, page 139, Baha’u’llah is unique, incomparable. It is necessary for everyone to turn towards Baha’u’llah in his prayers.
    • In Maftoon, page 15, Bahaullah writes to his son Abdul Baha, This is a letter from Allah, the Honored and the Wise (Baha’u’llah) to Allah the Gracious, the Aware (Abdul Baha).” Thus not only did the father, but even the son claimed divinity for himself.
    https://www.quora.com/Where-in-the-writings-of-Bahaullah-does-he-claim-to-be-a-prophet

    Bahaollah's ego knew no bounds.
    Desist Trailblazer, when you know that your loving Allah does not let sins, willful or inadvertent, go unpunished. You are talking like an atheist now.
     
    #16 Aupmanyav, Mar 15, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2020
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  17. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I already proved to you that quora website was full of lies and misquotes, and I do not have time to do that again tonight
     
  18. SomeRandom

    SomeRandom Still learning to be wise

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    My personal philosophy is “try not to be a dumbass.”
    It’s a new infection and yes will kill people. Probably more so the more vulnerable members of society and that is of course awful.

    These things happen and have happened throughout Millenia. Many people just don’t remember or weren’t alive when something that “big” happened. Like I’m from a generation who has never seen polio, much less knew anyone who died or were affected by it. Because I was born in a time where you just get a vaccine for it and don’t have to worry about it. It almost seems mythical to me in a way.

    We just have to take precautions and calm down.
     
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  19. Eddi

    Eddi Well-Known Member

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    I believe we are approaching End Times - specifically "The Great Tribulation" :(

    I believe Jesus is going to come down from Heaven, an event which will be literally awesome! :D

    It's just a matter of when...

    Any time now...
     
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  20. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Any time now..... Christians have been saying that forever, and still no Jesus. :oops:

    I believe Jesus has already returned and we are living in the End Times.
    Nobody, except Christians, ever said there would be no more tribulations AFTER Jesus returned and there is no basis for that in the Bible.
     
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