Bishka
Veteran Member
gnostic said:To me, Moses' new prophet seemed to have very little to do with a Messiah. Again, I don't understand why we are getting so sidetracked.
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What are we getting sidetracked on?
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gnostic said:To me, Moses' new prophet seemed to have very little to do with a Messiah. Again, I don't understand why we are getting so sidetracked.
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the reason i was talking about the messiah was to put over the point that moses was talking about a prophet otherwise he would have mentioned the son of god bit and there was no messah principle at that time, so i think jesus is out,as for mohhammed its to far into the future too much will happen to the Irealites before mohhammeds coming for it not to be a prophet before mohhammedgnostic said:This is really off-topic.
I wouldn't real know much about the Messianic prophecies in the OT, and have not investigate in anyway, but didn't the Messianic phenomena came about, during the time of their return from exile in Babylon?
They didn't have a king, so they desire an ideal king from David's line.
To me, Moses' new prophet seemed to have very little to do with a Messiah. Again, I don't understand why we are getting so sidetracked.
On the Islamic front, I don't think a promise of new prophet have anything to do with one last prophet, thus your Muhammad. It does speak of any last prophet, but a prophet who would lead the Israelites. It doesn't have anything to do with Arabs, or more precisely, Ishmaelites, or starting a new religion.
kai said:the reason i was talking about the messiah was to put over the point that moses was talking about a prophet otherwise he would have mentioned the son of god
bit and there was no messah principle at that time,
kai said:so i think jesus is out,as for mohhammed its to far into the future too much will happen to the Irealites before mohhammeds coming for it not to be a prophet before mohhammed
gnostic said:Who said that requirement for the Messiah would be the "son of god" or even a prophet or king?
I have no idea.beckysoup said:but what if that part was taken out of the Bible?
gnostic said:I have no idea.
I don't think any pre-Christian Judaism (as well as pre-Christian texts) ever thought that the Messiah being "son of God".
gnostic said:I have no idea.
I don't think any pre-Christian Judaism (as well as pre-Christian texts) ever thought that the Messiah being "son of God".
I may have a elder sister who is LDS, but it was not the path that I took.beckysoup said:Well, then I guess you haven't researched what the LDS believe.
From what I understand, the Oral Torah was everything that precedented the Written Torah of Moses.AlanGurvey said:Gnostic, when do you believe the oral torah came into being?
beckysoup61 said:How did we get talking about it? Ezzedan got extremley offtopic and went off on a completley unrelated topic.
Moses' prophecy doesn't directly relate to the Jewish principle of a Messiah, since the idea wasn't fully formed. However, why does that automatically mean that Jesus wasn't the one he was talking about? You're saying that the prophecy wasn't about the Messiah, so it couldn't be Jesus...but then go on to say that Jesus wasn't the Messiah, anyways. I'm confused at your logic there. Jesus had a profound impact on the Jews....they either hated him or loved him. Most of them hated Him, and as a people they generally rejected Him as Messiah.kai said:in the christian bible the messiah isnt mentioned till the time of the prophets , so in reality why would jesus be the prophet moses was talking about what effect did he have on the jews .
Those things are promised to occur when Christ returns again...due to the fact that the Jews rejected Christ, he did not complete His role as the Jewish Messiah. Therefore, He promised His disciples that He would return again in glory, judge the wicked, reward the righteous, set up His eternal kingdom, etc etc.Now i am sure that i will be corrected but the moshiac is not mentioned in the torah, and the role of the moshiach was the ingathering of the exiles; restoration of the religious courts of justice; an end of wickedness, sin and heresy; reward to the righteous; rebuilding of Jerusalem; restoration of the line of King David; and restoration of temple service.
jesus didnt do any of this so he isnt the moshiach, so by default if he is the son of god he cannot be the prophet moses was talking about
FerventGodSeeker
kai said:in the christian bible the messiah isnt mentioned till the time of the prophets , so in reality why would jesus be the prophet moses was talking about .
FerventGodSeeker said:Moses' prophecy doesn't directly relate to the Jewish principle of a Messiah, since the idea wasn't fully formed. However, why does that automatically mean that Jesus wasn't the one he was talking about? You're saying that the prophecy wasn't about the Messiah, so it couldn't be Jesus...but then go on to say that Jesus wasn't the Messiah, anyways. I'm confused at your logic there. Jesus had a profound impact on the Jews....they either hated him or loved him. Most of them hated Him, and as a people they generally rejected Him as Messiah.
Those things are promised to occur when Christ returns again...due to the fact that the Jews rejected Christ, he did not complete His role as the Jewish Messiah. Therefore, He promised His disciples that He would return again in glory, judge the wicked, reward the righteous, set up His eternal kingdom, etc etc.
FerventGodSeeker
ok heres what i mean if jesus is the son of god or god himelf i think moses might have mentioned it.the jewish meshiach and the christian messiah are two different things i dont think most jews hated him they just didnt beleive in him and he was rejected as the meshiach because he did not fulfill the meshiach principles.its the christian belief only thast says he was the messiah.
kai said:ok heres what i mean if jesus is the son of god or god himelf i think moses might have mentioned it.