Looks like Americans go against the war with Iran

[Saint Frankenstein]

I think it's high time to address the middle East and settle things once and for all. One way or another. People are simply getting tired of this violent part of the world and wish to put an end to it. At least collectively.

You mean America? Yes, people are tired of this violent part of the world and wish to put an end to it. What a stupid post.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Tell you what.

YOU people handle the situation, if you don't want the US to do so. All you have to do is fix it so that terrorists can't fly planes into buildings, attack ambassadors from other nations, behead citizens of other nations...you know. like that. Until you do that, don't yell at us because we actually attempt to do something about it.

Whether we do it 'right,' or make the correct decisions or not, at least we are doing something.

Iran has nothing to do with 9/11. It was mostly Saudis behind it and most Islamic terrorism is propagated by Saudis.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Anti-War Protests Form In Downtown Boston After Killing Of Iranian General
Protesters in US Rally Against Prospect of War With Iran

It seems like More and more Americans have gotten enough of wars with the middle east.
Demonstrations in many American cities

If only the corporate warmongering whores in office actually cared what the people want. Millions of people around the globe took to the streets to protest the invasion of Iraq in 2003 in probably the biggest series of protests in human history. Did it matter? No.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I've laid out my plan before.
But I'll gladly do it again.
The short version....
- Get to know them.
- Acknowledge & apologize for our past misdeeds.
(This is emotional manipulation. It also happens to be sincere.)
- Ask for their concerns.
- Express ours.
- Bargain.

I wonder if you know that that just about describes how the six-day war ended?

How do you negotiate with anyone who's deep desires and fears you know nothing about? And how can they negotiate with you? Listen, sincerely, speak honestly. Works wonders, really.

 

[Revoltingest]

I wonder if you know that that just about describes how the six-day war ended?

I don't know much, including that.

How do you negotiate with anyone who's deep desires and fears you know nothing about?

That was step #1 in my post.

And how can they negotiate with you? Listen, sincerely, speak honestly. Works wonders, really.

That's my experience.

Tooting me own horn here....
I once had a commercial who was a professional facilitator.
He overheard me negotiating with a tenant who had a problem.
He was impressed that the first thing I did was acknowledge
the tenant's complaints & feelings. It costs nothing to do that,
but it works wonders....as you say.

You see, I don't have God on my side. Unlike Trump, & other
believers in office, I can't rely upon divine intervention to provide
good results. It's best to use reason to determine how to proceed.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I don't know much, including that.

That was step #1 in my post.

That's my experience.

Tooting me own horn here....
I once had a commercial who was a professional facilitator.
He overheard me negotiating with a tenant who had a problem.
He was impressed that the first thing I did was acknowledge
the tenant's complaints & feelings. It costs nothing to do that,
but it works wonders....as you say.

Credit to you, then...people's feelings are real, and it costs you nothing to acknowledge them. Having done so, you've also legitimized your own.

 

[Revoltingest]

Credit to you, then...people's feelings are real, and it costs you nothing to acknowledge them. Having done so, you've also legitimized your own.

My only relevant feeling was to handle the situation for minimum cost.

 

[BSM1]

I remember analysis presented to us that Iraq would welcome us as heroes.
How'd that go?
Iraq tried for 8 years to defeat Iran. Even with our military assistance, they
failed. And if you know that they'd be crippled by hitting 4 targets, don't you
think they'd know this too, & take precautions?
Even if we did eventually crush Iran, we'd be there spending billions helping
them recover. And over half of that money would be squandered & siphoned
off without accounting.

I wonder if the kind of people who sign up to be soldiers would ever wise up,
& think to themselves...."Dang. This is a stupid war. I'm killing people just
because Trump & God hate them. To Hell with this....I refuse."

I sure they have. Again, they're not completely stupid. However, I have already heard broad hints from a few Congressmen about what would probably be our first targets.

Also, not to disrespect in any manner, but not having served you don't realize that few, if any, soldiers area as political as you or I. When they are in harm's way, they don't think as deeply on such things as what is politically right/wrong, or expedient. They are fighting , for the most part, to 1) stay alive; 2) kill the enemy; and 3) protect their buddies who are right there with them. Maybe later over a beer they may have the "why" conversations, but in the s**t these thoughts are very, very far in the background.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

You see, I don't have God on my side. Unlike Trump, & other
believers in office, I can't rely upon divine intervention to provide
good results. It's best to use reason to determine how to proceed.

Do you really think, honestly and in your heart of hearts, that Trump, McConnell, and all the rest really and truly suppose that they "have God on [their] side?" I'll be bolder, and ask if you think, honestly and in your heart of hearts that Trump, McConnell, and all the rest actually believe in the God that they profess to?

Because I am prepared to write -- right here on RF -- a treatise demonstrating that they do not. (I won't pretend I could get that done without several weeks of effort, so don't ask for it tomorrow.) You live in a world of lies. You are trying to think logically and reasonably in a reality that cares nothing about logic and reason.

And Revoltingest...trust me...I honestly believe that humanity's only hope is coming to understand who and what we are. If we cannot do that (and sadly, I doubt we will), then I think humanity is coming to an end. Some other species, some other life-form, will see out the end of this planet in a few billion years -- but it won't be us.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

(sigh) I really wish you didn't have a point.

The problem is with the partisanship. The left won't LET the American military do the job properly. We don't need to nuke the place, but we do indeed need to bomb enough to 'do the whole job."

Bomb with "faith, hope, and love"?

 

[Revoltingest]

I sure they have. Again, they're not completely stupid. However, I have already heard broad hints from a few Congressmen about what would probably be our first targets.

Congressmen....aren't those the critters who sailed into the Iraq & Afghan
wars full of confidence. A few trillion dollars later, it's still a big mess.

They're already planning for war, eh. And they believe it will be just a few
key targets, & then the job is done with no risk to us, eh. It sounds like
they're convincing themselves that war is the best option...an echo chamber.

Also, not to disrespect in any manner, but not having served you don't realize that few, if any, soldiers area as political as you or I.

I've known many, & am fully aware they're
not the sharpest tools in the shed.

When they are in harm's way, they don't think as deeply on such things as what is politically right/wrong, or expedient. They are fighting , for the most part, to 1) stay alive; 2) kill the enemy; and 3) protect their buddies who are right there with them. Maybe later over a beer they may have the "why" conversations, but in the s**t these thoughts are very, very far in the background.

I'm familiar with this. But when not in harm's way,
there's opportunity to think of the larger picture.
Btw, I'm not counting on this to end wrongful wars.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

(sigh) I really wish you didn't have a point.

The problem is with the partisanship. The left won't LET the American military do the job properly. We don't need to nuke the place, but we do indeed need to bomb enough to 'do the whole job."

Very Christian of you... Easy to spew such words when it's not you on the other side of the bombs. I've long believed that America deserves to have bombs dropped on it for what it has done to peoples around the world and disgusting stances as I see in this thread and elsewhere. What goes around comes around. Our lives are not worth more than anyone else's. If I'm one of the victims, so be it. I hate this bloodthristy, willfully ignorant country.

 

[Revoltingest]

Do you really think, honestly and in your heart of hearts, that Trump, McConnell, and all the rest really and truly suppose that they "have God on [their] side?" I'll be bolder, and ask if you think, honestly and in your heart of hearts that Trump, McConnell, and all the rest actually believe in the God that they profess to?

Individuals say this, but of course there's always the possibility they're
lying...pandering to believers. But I've known enuf Christians to say
that there are many who believe God is on their side, & against their
enemies.
Even if Trump doesn't believe it, this still whips up support for war.
And we see here even on RF that many want it.

Because I am prepared to write -- right here on RF -- a treatise demonstrating that they do not. (I won't pretend I could get that done without several weeks of effort, so don't ask for it tomorrow.) You live in a world of lies. You are trying to think logically and reasonably in a reality that cares nothing about logic and reason.

Reason is still useful.
But some strongly resist it.

And Revoltingest...trust me...I honestly believe that humanity's only hope is coming to understand who and what we are. If we cannot do that (and sadly, I doubt we will), then I think humanity is coming to an end. Some other species, some other life-form, will see out the end of this planet in a few billion years -- but it won't be us.

I'm optimistic that we'll be around for a long time....astronomical
kind of time. I prefer that it be peaceful & prosperous.

 

[Stanyon]

So you're attaching armbands to your straw men now.

They put them on themselves without even realizing it, rehashing the old Jewish "puppet master " trope because Israel dared to applaud Trump. We live in some very sick.times indeed

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I can't wait for them to blame Israel at some point since Netanyahu congratulated Trump and said they stand with us. I have already seen in another place some claiming Israel is pulling U.S.
strings and they consider themselves lefties. The funny thing is all they would have to do is add ZOG (Zionist Occupied Government) in a sentence or two and they would fit right in at a White Nationalist site.
They seem to dislike Trump more than a war criminal that orchestrated genocide, rape, and torture on a mass scale in Syria. It's amazing and disgusting to watch them crawl on their bellies kowtowing like Japanese to their shrines for war criminals.

It's not a secret that America's foreign policy serves Israel's warmongering government's interests more than ours. Our foreign policy is basically guided by militerist far-right Zionists like the Kushners, who have the ear of the president. These people are traitorous.

 

[Stanyon]

If only the corporate warmongering whores in office actually cared what the people want. Millions of people around the globe took to the streets to protest the invasion of Iraq in 2003 in probably the biggest series of protests in human history. Did it matter? No.

Trump ran on a "no new war" ticket and he did not win the popular vote.

 

[Revoltingest]

They put them on themselves without even realizing it, rehashing the old Jewish "puppet master " trope because Israel dared to applaud Trump. We live in some very sick.times indeed

Your new avatar looks familiar....I've seen him somewhere before.

 

[Stanyon]

It's not a secret that America's foreign policy serves Israel's warmongering government's interests more than ours. Our foreign policy is basically guided by militerist far-right Zionists like the Kushners, who have the ear of the president. These people are traitorous.

Throw a ZOG in there! You used to be a Nazi correct? Ever post on Stormfront?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Throw a ZOG in there! You used to be a Nazi correct? Ever post on Stormfront?

You're the white nationalism supporter, not me.

Also, if you'll notice, I was specific about the sort of Zionism that's the problem. I don't care if Jews have their homeland (as long as they treat their neighbors and the Palestinians with dignity). I just don't want my country hijacked and put in the service of any foreign state. I think we need to dump both Israel and Saudi Arabia as "allies" until they change their ways.

 

[Revoltingest]

Wow.....it took a full 5 pages before this thread went all Jewzi.
(That's when it's Nazis vs Jews.)