1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Jesus as a Jew...

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Ellen Brown, Apr 21, 2019.

  1. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    9,536
    Ratings:
    +2,902
    Religion:
    Christian
    Muslims don't believe in blood sacrifice or original sin.
     
  2. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,956
    Ratings:
    +1,906
    I may likely continue researching the Navajo (Lakota) belief system. I am 'different' and that belief completely accepts those like me. Someday perhaps the Christians will stop allowing the LGBT speak for those like me, Two Spirit in the way of the Dine, not the way of the LGBT advocates. If she wishes to adopt an Abrahamic faith, I will help and meditate for her.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  3. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,770
    Ratings:
    +675
    Religion:
    Christian
    they may not believe in original sin but they do believe in a type of blood sacrifice

    first type of blood sacrifice through Jesus death on the cross
    second type of blood sacrifice a criminal execution (unique to their view)

    see wiki
    In Mormonism, blood atonement is a controversial doctrine which teaches the view that the atonement of Jesus does not apply because some crimes are extremely heinous. Instead, to atone for these sins, the perpetrators should be killed in a way that allows their blood to be shed upon the ground as a sacrificial offering.

    I have a protestant view and don't agree and a criminal should look to Jesus for mercy with his work on the cross and not do the DIY thing
     
    #23 whirlingmerc, Apr 21, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
  4. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    9,536
    Ratings:
    +2,902
    Religion:
    Christian
    Muslims don't believe in blood sacrifice for atonement of sin.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,956
    Ratings:
    +1,906
    One part almost exactly paraphrases Jesus' own words when Allah SWT asks him what he did here on Earth. Loosely quoted, " I did only what you told me to do". It is frustrating that I can not just search the Quran in Google, like I can with the Bible. :( "I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me." John 5:30 KJV
     
    • Like Like x 1
  6. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    Ratings:
    +1,216
    Religion:
    Baha'i inspired liberal
    You could download “Oceans” and tick the “Islam” box.
    It allows you to search across several different translations.
    sacred-traditions
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
  7. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    9,536
    Ratings:
    +2,902
    Religion:
    Christian
    Thanks......
     
  8. The Anointed

    The Anointed Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2018
    Messages:
    1,615
    Ratings:
    +169
    Religion:
    biblical believer
    Jesus was a Jew on his mother's side, Mary the daughter of Hannan, and grand daughter to Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was the high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC and is believed to have been murdered at the orders of Herod the Great.

    But Jesus was a Macedonian on his father's side, who was Joseph the son of Heli, a Davidic and Hasmonean prince, called Alexander Helios III, the son of Cleopatra and Mark Anthony, who [HELI] was apparently executed, in 13 B.C., in the world where many Davidian aspirants, as the “young lions of Judah”, were eliminated by the cruel and tyrannical King Herod the Great.

    Ephesians 2: 14; "For Christ himself has bought us peace, by making Jews and gentiles one people. With his own body he broke down the wall that separated them and kept them enemies, etc.

    (Romans 1:16) For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is God’s power for the salvation of everyone who believes, of the Jew first and of the Greek as well.
     
  9. Katzpur

    Katzpur Not your average Mormon

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2005
    Messages:
    29,541
    Ratings:
    +5,486
    Religion:
    LDS Christian
    The idea of blood atonement never has been an official part of Mormon doctrine. (Maybe that's that's what people mean when they say it was "controversial.") It was something Brigham Young taught, nobody has taught it for over 120 years and the practice. The fact that Utah still gives death-row convicts the firing squad as a choice for means of execution is not related in any way to a belief that Jesus Christ's Atonement doesn't cover some sins. We are firm in our convictions that His sacrifice covers virtually every sin (except blasphemy against the Holy Ghost) a person can commit.
     
    #29 Katzpur, Apr 21, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    9,536
    Ratings:
    +2,902
    Religion:
    Christian
    Jesus was a Jew, or perhaps he was Vespasian.

    The Roman Piso Family Authored the New Testament
     
  11. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,770
    Ratings:
    +675
    Religion:
    Christian
    so Brigham Young had some mistakes... which is only human
    and was he taught by Joseph Smith?
     
  12. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    9,536
    Ratings:
    +2,902
    Religion:
    Christian
    Story of Jesus Christ was 'fabricated to pacify the poor ...
    www.independent.co.ukNewsUKHome News
    Oct 10, 2013 · Story of Jesus Christ was 'fabricated to pacify the poor', claims controversial Biblical scholar. Joseph Atwill, who is the author of a book entitled 'Caesar's Messiah: The Roman Conspiracy to Invent Jesus', asserts that Christianity did not begin as a religion, but was actually a sophisticated government propaganda exercise used to pacify the subjects of the Roman Empire.
     
  13. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,770
    Ratings:
    +675
    Religion:
    Christian
    There were also wild speculations about the whole thing made up by people on hallucinatory mushrooms but no substantiation for it

    Jesus is in many non biblical references not the least of which is Flavius Josephus the Jewish/Roman historian
     
  14. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    9,536
    Ratings:
    +2,902
    Religion:
    Christian
    This claim is that Josephus and his family wrote the gospels.

    The Piso Family and the Story of The Bible
     
  15. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,956
    Ratings:
    +1,906
    Thank you.
     
  16. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,956
    Ratings:
    +1,906
    He is a Shia Muslim, and in my experience they are very nice. It is too bad that the government of Iran and that of America do not get along. As Ahmadinejad said, they know who Jesus is. The issue is that due to cultural and philosophical differences we can not agree on the translation. It is all a sad complicated muck up, and in my opinion, the Sunni can be very bad to deal with in that discussion.

    I think that all this ill will and disagreement among those who believe is a form of universal heresy, where we try to define God too closely, when he has not said who he is. All I know of is, "I am that I am".
     
  17. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,956
    Ratings:
    +1,906
    I am sorry for being petulant and obnoxious. My claim is that those who reject do not know or love God.
     
  18. The Anointed

    The Anointed Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2018
    Messages:
    1,615
    Ratings:
    +169
    Religion:
    biblical believer
    Nope! As I have already stated in post #28; Jesus was a Jew on his mother's side, Mary the daughter of Hannan, and grand daughter to Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was the high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC and is believed to have been murdered at the orders of Herod the Great.

    But Jesus was a Macedonian on his father's side, who was Joseph the son of Heli, a Davidic and Hasmonean prince, called Alexander Helios III, the son of Cleopatra and Mark Anthony, who [HELI] was apparently executed, in 13 B.C., in the world where many Davidian aspirants, as the “young lions of Judah”, were eliminated by the cruel and tyrannical King Herod the Great.

    Ephesians 2: 14; "For Christ himself has bought us peace, by making Jews and gentiles one people. With his own body he broke down the wall that separated them and kept them enemies, etc.


    (Romans 1:16) For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is God’s power for the salvation of everyone who believes, of the Jew first and of the Greek as well.


    [*content removed by RF staff*]​
     
    #38 The Anointed, Apr 21, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 22, 2019
  19. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,770
    Ratings:
    +675
    Religion:
    Christian
    And who 'made up' the apostles Peter, Paul, John.... ?

    Problem there is corroboration for Luke Paul and Peter as well as Jesus form oteher
    non Biblical sources even arguably form Jewish sources

    Josephus being born around 37ad quite a bit after Jesus death and died circa 100ad
    doesn't make for a reasonable source for the conspiracy theory More likely he was just a historian
    and pieced things together as well as he good from records
     
    #39 whirlingmerc, Apr 21, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
  20. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    9,536
    Ratings:
    +2,902
    Religion:
    Christian
    Vespasian and the whole Piso family. Have you read any of the links?
     
Loading...