1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Jesus as a Jew...

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Ellen Brown, Apr 21, 2019.

  1. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,269
    Ratings:
    +1,605
    I have a very close friend who has been an Agnostic, and lately she has sort of been reading a few things related to Judaism. To her Christianity is a "cultural appropriation by a bunch of Gentiles so they could form their own bogus religion" to loosely quote.

    She has pondered coming to this forum to play...

    It has been many years since I have heard arguments about how Christianity came to be. I do remember one of the Apostles being reluctant to preach to Gentiles until something happened to make that OK. I thought I remembered Jesus being reluctant to preach to Gentiles at first but can not remember what or if something happened to change that.

    These days it seems to me that none of the religions have succeeded in helping man "to be all he can be".

    So, I've found a focus for a, new to me, obsession with answering these questions. Before anyone gets down to daemonizing Muslims, it should be clear to anyone with two brain cells that we all have the blood on our hands.
     
    • Useful Useful x 2
  2. dingdao

    dingdao The eternal Tao cannot be told - Tao Te Ching

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2019
    Messages:
    269
    Ratings:
    +117
    Religion:
    Nominally Taoist
    A lot of what was recorded in the bible was put there to compete with other religions of the time. Virgin birth was claimed by the emperors, miraculous healing was also practiced in Rome.
    Beware of "religious" leaders advocating violence.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  3. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,269
    Ratings:
    +1,605
    I don't have issue with Taoist ideas. I have seen lots of anger and violence, some I suffered from. These days, I seek to be personally quiescent.

    It does seem that there is a Force and an Opposition, a Yin and a Yang. The issue seems to be is what are we, as individuals supposed to do in response to what is around us?
     
  4. Hockeycowboy

    Hockeycowboy Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2015
    Messages:
    4,413
    Ratings:
    +2,568
    Religion:
    Christian
  5. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 2012
    Messages:
    15,079
    Ratings:
    +1,544
    Jesus was a firm follower of Moses, was trained as such, and remained as such till he died naturally at the age of about 120 years in a "Peaceful Abode" (not in Baghdad- a clarification for the followers of Bahaullah, please.) with fountains where he got refuge/migrated after the event of Crucifixion in which he survived against all odds, please.

    Regards
     
  6. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,269
    Ratings:
    +1,605
    Another interesting belief about Jesus.
     
  7. 1213

    1213 Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2017
    Messages:
    864
    Ratings:
    +120
    Religion:
    Disciple of Jesus
    Bible tells Jesus was sent to Jews. It also tells that Jesus sent his disciples to other nations. So the message is for all nations.

    But he answered, "I wasn't sent to anyone but the lost sheep of the house of Israel."
    Matt. 15:24


    Jesus therefore said to them again, "Peace be to you. As the Father has sent me, even so I send you."

    John 20:21

    Therefore go, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I commanded you. Behold, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."
    Mat. 28:19-20
     
  8. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    1,606
    Ratings:
    +960
    Religion:
    Baha'i inspired liberal
    If cultural appropriation makes a religion bogus it’s not like the creation and flood stories of the Jews weren’t culturally appropriated
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Winner Winner x 1
  9. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,269
    Ratings:
    +1,605

    That's nice. Many if not most modern religionists think it is acceptable to reject the non-normal. So far, only the Navajo accept those like me.
     
  10. Ellen Brown

    Ellen Brown Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    3,269
    Ratings:
    +1,605
    Yes, perhaps from the Zoroastrians or someone previous?
     
  11. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,379
    Ratings:
    +565
    Religion:
    Christian

    I'm not sure reluctant is the right word for Jesus
    With Jesus two things were going on which confuse people.

    First there was a decision to not proclaim being Messiah or Son of God until After he rises from the dead

    Second the gospel went to the Jews first and then to the Gentiles. First to 'the lost sheep of Israel' as Jesus put it
     
  12. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,379
    Ratings:
    +565
    Religion:
    Christian

    As far as the apostle's reluctance. I think God had to deliberately move to shake them up
    Jesus said at his ascension the gospel should do to Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria and then to the ends of the earth so going to the gentiles was always the intent of God.

    It took some miracles to get them on board with the gentiles, yes, but it was in God's timing

    The first gentile was an italian centurion named Cornelius. Peter was staying at a tanner house who skinned animals and tanned them for use and you can bet it smelled. With his senses regarding the Kosher assaulted he went to pray and had major hunger pangs and called out for FOOD !!!! while on the roof AND HUNGRY and had a vision of animals let down in giant sheets and a voice from heaven saying rise kill and eat.... kosher or not... happened three times... God said it represented the gentiles coming to God in the gospels... I call it SMELL-A-VISION in HUNGER-RAMA ... 3 romans centurions knock on his door not to arrest him like Jesus but to take him to preach the gospel to their leader Caronelius who was prepared with his own vision to call for peter and given his address

    Second, Saul was hunting down Christians and knocked off his horse and blinded on the way by Jesus who commissioned blind Saul to open blind eyes going far away to the gentiles.... Paul eventually repents, baptized and goes and becomes the apostle Paul to the gentiles

    that's the short version
     
  13. Dave Watchman

    Dave Watchman Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2018
    Messages:
    91
    Ratings:
    +32
    Religion:
    Waldensian
    I was just saying that on a Christian forum. I was making a case that Islam was not AS bad as some of the other religious belief systems. I posted the video where Ahmadinejad made mention of Jesus eleven times in seven minutes. The Pope did an hour speech to Congress and didn't mention Jesus once.

    Snip of Ahmadinejad at 5:40:

    "We believe Jesus Christ will return together with one of the children of the revered Messenger of Islam and will lead the world to love, brotherhood and justice. The responsibility of all followers of Jesus Christ and Abrahamic faiths is to prepare the way for the fulfillment of this Divine promise and the arrival of that joyful, shining and wonderful age. - Ahmadinejad


    Islam is just one of the three Abrahamic religions. It grew out of Ishmael, one of Abraham's sons. The Allah that they pray to is the God of their father Abraham.

    [​IMG]

    That confirms my read of the seven heads on the composite beast of Revelation 13. We're at the point where all the religious belief systems have fallen. They're all corrupt. We're at that point in Revelation where God is calling all of His People out from the Harlot. “Come out of her, my people, lest you take part in her sins, lest you share in her plagues.
    I would just tell her to read John. Then Matthew, Mark and Luke. See if she can believe.

    Believe in Jesus.

    John 1:1 (ESV)

    The light shines in the darkness,
    and the darkness has not overcome it.
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  14. David T

    David T Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2011
    Messages:
    6,143
    Ratings:
    +2,152
    "it should be clear to anyone with two brain cells"

    Oh that's an extreme minority Ellen!

    A man was executed as a heretic, a religion built up around him that eventually began to execute those they deemed heretics. What is that phenomena? I label it normal, thats how dumb the common is. Not much has changed, really changed in that regard..
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  15. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    5,521
    Ratings:
    +1,630
    Religion:
    Christian
    From the Canaanites and Babylonians.
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  16. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,379
    Ratings:
    +565
    Religion:
    Christian

    It was kind the head of that state Aminajadab to well wish Christians on the birth of Jesus
    and yes ironic that he mentioned Jesus more than the Pope

    I agree with him on some points but in the large there are some big issues
    Jesus addressed sin issues and heart issues far more than the political justice issues of the day and sin before God is a far more serious crisis (not sure how many times he mentioned issues of the heart)

    In the gospel, man doesn't pull themselves up by the bootstraps but glorify God by leaning on God's mercy by Faith through the work of Jesus on the cross. It is by grace (not sure i heard the world grace in his talk) by faith does lead to the fruit of good works which include justice and mercy love and faithfulness

    so... the intent was nice... but it missed the most important pasts of the gospel and who Jesus was
     
    #16 whirlingmerc, Apr 21, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
  17. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    5,521
    Ratings:
    +1,630
    Religion:
    Christian
    Muslims revere Jesus and Mary .. and all the patriarchs. Jesus is mentioned 33 times in the Koran.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,379
    Ratings:
    +565
    Religion:
    Christian
    Yes but Not the Jesus of the Bible. Almost but not quite.

    They confess the Torah, Psalms and Gospels but largely don't read those

    In that view Jesus is sot fully God fully man. Didn't die for sins of the world. Wasn't raised.

    However they do believe he was sinless virgin born Messiah and coming again
     
  19. sooda

    sooda Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2019
    Messages:
    5,521
    Ratings:
    +1,630
    Religion:
    Christian
    Not like Mormons. Muslims don't believe in blood sacrifice or original sin.
     
  20. whirlingmerc

    whirlingmerc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2016
    Messages:
    3,379
    Ratings:
    +565
    Religion:
    Christian
    Actually they do believe in blood sacrifice of sorts and that is the reason Utah has/had? death by firing squad so the sins of the criminal are covered by his blood

    see wiki
    In Mormonism, blood atonement is a controversial doctrine which teaches the view that the atonement of Jesus does not apply because some crimes are extremely heinous. Instead, to atone for these sins, the perpetrators should be killed in a way that allows their blood to be shed upon the ground as a sacrificial offering.
     
    #20 whirlingmerc, Apr 21, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
Loading...