Is it all right for Muslims to kill Hatun Tash?

[firedragon]

The Muslim's at the corner identified the man with a knife as a Muslim.

Can you provide empirical evidence that a Muslim or Muslims identified the man as a Muslim?

He may have very well been a Muslim. Absolutely. But the previous experience is that the big deal people created with a bearded man slapping Hatun for showing some images of a supposed Muhammed, was indeed "a Christian".

So can you show who identified this attacker as a Muslim?

 

[firedragon]

Hatun was assaulted on several occasions, and the last I saw was by an Arab.

So he had a beard. But it was proven, and everyone knows he was Christian.

 

[Justanatheist]

No. Its not alright.

How do you know it was a Muslim?

Previously some man slapped her, and people like this post made a big deal out of it and tried their best to spread some hatred because it has its gains. But ironically the man who slapped her was investigated and found out to have been a Christian all his life. So it was a conspiracy.

So how do you know this is not the same? Do you know who tried to stab this lady personally?

No we do not know if it is a Muslim you are quite right.

Also there is not one single no go area in the UK, they do not exist. There are areas of cities I would advise a young women not to walk at night, I was brought up in one!. It has nothing to do with the religion of the people who live there.

 

[ChristineM]

Free speech is free or not free, whether in London or America. And like Paris, London or Dearborn, Michigan, they have no go zones, where if you are a young white female, you best not enter, and the police generally try to avoid. A Muslim congress women apparently has two husbands, and one of them is her "brother", and apparently she made a marriage tax deduction before she was married. Kind of like not keeping US laws. In Sharia law, Muslims are except from taxes. Taxes are for Christians and Jews.

London's No-Go Zones (nysun.com)
Islamic Extremists Have Seized Control Of U.S. Cities, Says NRA Seminar – ThinkProgress

Murder law is murder law. And straw men are irrelevant.

The subject is 'is it ok for people (muslims) to kill in cold blood', it is not whether they are bigamist or tax evaders.

 

[oldbadger]

I heard of that one time a Christian man attacked her and they played it as if it had been a Muslim.

Who told you that?

 

[Shakeel]

There are plenty of Muslims in China too so it's a moot point.

I'm just under the impression that people are freer in India than China

Yes, but there's a full blown genocide going on - you know, forced castration, forced marriage, demoralization etc.

Anyway, Muslims in India are at least 14% while in china it's about 2%.

Whether India is free or not, depends on who you ask. Muslims would disagree, but so long as you don't try to be too religious or moral, you might do okay as far as the government is concerned.

 

[firedragon]

No we do not know if it is a Muslim you are quite right.

Also there is not one single no go area in the UK, they do not exist. There are areas of cities I would advise a young women not to walk at night, I was brought up in one!. It has nothing to do with the religion of the people who live there.

The question I raise is not to say that it is not a Muslim. It may very well be. You never know.

If you go to the park you will know how these people are. Anyway, what the poster above is not addressing is the previous episode that was absolutely foiled because the guy who attacked Hatun, the Christian preacher was himself a Christian. He had a beard, so these evangelists immediately took up on that episode and of course started their campaign against Muslims. But when it was openly shown that the guy was a Christian, and he himself claims he is Christian, Hatun and the whole gang all over the internet and the park suddenly "stopped talking".

Its hypocrisy.

Nevertheless, I must say all over the world there are places that are not safe for a woman to go at a particular time, and sometimes even the whole day. In California, there are areas where its like dead silent in the night after 7 or 8 PM. Hard to believe because its just "not safe". Wow. Even a country like India has these areas. Even Egypt does. This is how the world is.

There are some countries I can be dead sure that my sister or mother or wife can walk at midnight or 3 AM wearing whatever they want and one could be 99.9999999% assured that nothing will happen. Mentioning these cities will be considered bias because the other person is bias and doesnt like to hear these things.

Its a strange phenomenon.

Peace brother. I just wish that humans tried to analyse and understand not only each other, but also sociological backgrounds to all of these things we discuss. I wish people are not attacked for even preaching hatred. Freedom of speech is very important. But that's my opinion, I have no great research to back up these sentiments as the ideal manner of living and governance.

Cheers.

 

[oldbadger]

Because if enough of them were imported they could change the law here through democratic processes to reflect Islamic law.

On the side........... Many Happy Returns.

In the UK the law has changed (since 2006) to reduce the strengths of vigilantes such as sharia nutcases.

 

[oldbadger]

That's true, but then who will have children on your behalf? Alone your economy will crash and you might end up with Chinese passports..

Even a Chinese passport might be preferable to that of a Theocracy. True.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

The question I raise is not to say that it is not a Muslim. It may very well be. You never know.

If you go to the park you will know how these people are. Anyway, what the poster above is not addressing is the previous episode that was absolutely foiled because the guy who attacked Hatun, the Christian preacher was himself a Christian. He had a beard, so these evangelists immediately took up on that episode and of course started their campaign against Muslims. But when it was openly shown that the guy was a Christian, and he himself claims he is Christian, Hatun and the whole gang all over the internet and the park suddenly "stopped talking".

Its hypocrisy.

Nevertheless, I must say all over the world there are places that are not safe for a woman to go at a particular time, and sometimes even the whole day. In California, there are areas where its like dead silent in the night after 7 or 8 PM. Hard to believe because its just "not safe". Wow. Even a country like India has these areas. Even Egypt does. This is how the world is.

There are some countries I can be dead sure that my sister or mother or wife can walk at midnight or 3 AM wearing whatever they want and one could be 99.9999999% assured that nothing will happen. Mentioning these cities will be considered bias because the other person is bias and doesnt like to hear these things.

Its a strange phenomenon.

Peace brother. I just wish that humans tried to analyse and understand not only each other, but also sociological backgrounds to all of these things we discuss. I wish people are not attacked for even preaching hatred. Freedom of speech is very important. But that's my opinion, I have no great research to back up these sentiments as the ideal manner of living and governance.

Cheers.

And I wish for people to stop preaching logic as if it works on all of the world for all cases involving humans.

 

[oldbadger]

Well, as this happened in London, which has a Muslim mayor, whose idea of law is Sharia law, ............................

Stop you there....!

Hear what the London Mayor spoke, about this situation:-

The Mayor
Date:
Monday, 26th October 2020

Regarding Hutan’s case, Met officers have informed me of the following:

• Hatun was escorted out of the park for her own safety after a large and hostile crowd had gathered around her. She was then moved away from the park to prevent any disorder from occurring.
• A subsequent decision was taken to clear the crowd from Speakers Corner due to rising tensions.
• Hatun was informed by police that she could be liable to arrest should she return to Speakers Corner that evening.
• Contrary to the information you have received, I can confirm that there is no current bar on Hatun attending or returning to Speakers Corner. She is not accused of any crime and is free to attend Speakers Corner with no restriction.

It is routine for Royal Parks Police Officers to review events at Speakers Corner and consider if an individual has over stepped the mark of what is lawful, or within the traditions of this historic location.

As you know, freedom of speech is a principle that I hold dear. One of the best things about London is the fierce way in which we protect this right and people’s ability to exercise it. However, as I’m sure you will appreciate, the police have to balance this right with managing behaviour that could lead to public disorder. It is crucial that healthy debates do not lead to violence, and I support the rights of police officers to remove individuals in order to prevent a breach of the peace.

 

[Shakeel]

Who told you that?

YouTube. They make these videos where something either actually happens or they lie it happened or fake it happened and pretend to be shocked. I think it's sad because Hatun is probably just manipulated to do it.

 

[firedragon]

They shouldn't kill anyone.

They shouldn't, but they do.

Just yet another example of the religion of peace in action.


More accurately, the religion of rest in pieces would be better suited for these people.

Let me give people like you an answer very similar to the same bogus propaganda that you spread.

Quoting the poster @2ndpillar

Is it all right for a Christians to kill any one from any other religion, even if the Christian scripture says to slay/kill any apostate, and Jesus himself killed a boy who defied him while God killed so many communities of human beings, even babies, animals, while saving only the virgins sometimes for God knows what? The New Bible's, written in the late 21st century, were made the canonical Bibles in the 20th century, and all others thrown left for other abslutists, there are at least 23,000 living manuscripts of the Bible with every single one having variations which if counted overtakes the number of verses in the Bible, which things are absolutely irrelevant to the bigotry that can be shown against people.

I think people who play this cheap gutter game should be returned with similar gutter games.

 

[firedragon]

Stop you there....!

Hear what the London Mayor spoke, about this situation:-

The Mayor
Date:
Monday, 26th October 2020

Regarding Hutan’s case, Met officers have informed me of the following:

• Hatun was escorted out of the park for her own safety after a large and hostile crowd had gathered around her. She was then moved away from the park to prevent any disorder from occurring.
• A subsequent decision was taken to clear the crowd from Speakers Corner due to rising tensions.
• Hatun was informed by police that she could be liable to arrest should she return to Speakers Corner that evening.
• Contrary to the information you have received, I can confirm that there is no current bar on Hatun attending or returning to Speakers Corner. She is not accused of any crime and is free to attend Speakers Corner with no restriction.

It is routine for Royal Parks Police Officers to review events at Speakers Corner and consider if an individual has over stepped the mark of what is lawful, or within the traditions of this historic location.

As you know, freedom of speech is a principle that I hold dear. One of the best things about London is the fierce way in which we protect this right and people’s ability to exercise it. However, as I’m sure you will appreciate, the police have to balance this right with managing behaviour that could lead to public disorder. It is crucial that healthy debates do not lead to violence, and I support the rights of police officers to remove individuals in order to prevent a breach of the peace.

Honestly, England has managed a very difficult task of keeping free speech while addressing extremism. In my honest opinion, England has been the one country in the whole world who could be deemed foremost in this aspect.

I have not done any serious research on this subject so this is not an absolute statement. Just how I perceive it. I would actually reiterate your words "fierce". I remember in Harry Potter, Cedrick was called a "fierce friend". I use the word in the same manner.

Its a fantastic achievement, which I think is absolutely difficult. No one in my opinion has done it to this extent.

 

[firedragon]

And I wish for people to stop preaching logic as if it works on all of the world for all cases involving humans.

Good wish. All the best.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Let me give people like you an answer very similar to the same bogus propaganda that you spread.

Quoting the poster @2ndpillar

Is it all right for a Christians to kill any one from any other religion, even if the Christian scripture says to slay/kill any apostate, and Jesus himself killed a boy who defied him while God killed so many communities of human beings, even babies, animals, while saving only the virgins sometimes for God knows what? The New Bible's, written in the late 21st century, were made the canonical Bibles in the 20th century, and all others thrown left for other abslutists, there are at least 23,000 living manuscripts of the Bible with every single one having variations which if counted overtakes the number of verses in the Bible, which things are absolutely irrelevant to the bigotry that can be shown against people.

I think people who play this cheap gutter game should be returned with similar gutter games.

I agree, but you don't see Christianity killing on the scale Muslims are now.

Abrahamic religion is entirely responsible for the vast majority of religious fueled violence and death in the entire recorded history of the world.

 

[oldbadger]

YouTube. They make these videos where something either actually happens or they lie it happened or fake it happened and pretend to be shocked. I think it's sad because Hatun is probably just manipulated to do it.

Hi.
Hatun has spoken at Speaker's-Corner many times, Shakeel. She obviously has her own mind and opinions, just as you do.

She can be deterred from speaking there by the police if they have good reason to believe that her presence puts her or anybody else in danger, but the fact that she got slashed across the face by a nutter will only cause other speakers to stand in her place.

Violence won't put down free speech at that place, it has existed for too long.

I used to go there on Sunday mornings, 50 years ago...... the hecklers there are famous!

 

[firedragon]

I agree, but you don't see Christianity killing on the scale Muslims are now.

Christianity vs Muslims? Lol. You mean Christians vs Muslims.

Well, there was a Christian man, who had a Christian son, who together were responsible for 180,000 innocent lives taken, and they grandfathered the suicide belt, and they did more suicide bombings than you would know. But see, I am not stupid enough to equate that to Christianity. Just that your level knowledge on this seems quite poor. Sorry, Cant help but say that. These guys were Christian, but they had a following of Hindu, and atheist mixed people, and they were driven by a Leninist worldview.

If you want to calculate deaths of people and that's your scale, one bomb killed over 100k people in Japan. What do you place your blame on for that? A whole people, one man, the inventor of the bomb, the worldview as a whole? What?

Abrahamic religion is entirely responsible for the vast majority of religious fueled violence and death in the entire recorded history of the world.

Thats absolutely false. Only 7% of all wars in history has been fuelled by anything political motivated by pseudo religious agendas.

So your statement about "in the entire recorded history of the world" is absolutely false. No, not just false, its wrong.

 

[oldbadger]

Honestly, England has managed a very difficult task of keeping free speech while addressing extremism. In my honest opinion, England has been the one country in the whole world who could be deemed foremost in this aspect.

I think that many westernised countries promote free speech and address extremism. We do our best.

I have not done any serious research on this subject so this is not an absolute statement. Just how I perceive it. I would actually reiterate your words "fierce".

You did not comprehend my post. I did not used the word 'fierce', that was the Mayor of London's answer to a question about the attack upon Hatun and subsequent police actions.

Its a fantastic achievement, which I think is absolutely difficult. No one in my opinion has done it to this extent.

Let us hope that it can progress.... we have a long way to travel.

 

[danieldemol]

@2ndpillar until the suspect is caught or at least identified I dont think we can say for sure that they are Muslim.

You might find this article useful as it explains police are not yet treating the incident as terror related;

Police slammed for failing to catch knifeman who stabbed Christian preacher | Daily Mail Online

In my opinion.