How Progressive are you? (poll)

[Quintessence]

I don't know what "intersectionality" is either, @beenherebeforeagain. What's supposed to be intersecting with what now?

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

I don't know what "intersectionality" is either, @beenherebeforeagain. What's supposed to be intersecting with what now?

okay, just read the wikipedia article...it appears to be the novel idea that everything is connected to everything else...

 

[Kenny]

I only voted for "Lived experience deserves as much merit as expertise." -

The rest leaves too much to be defined. Even the term "progressive" means one thing for one person and something else for another.

 

[Quintessence]

okay, just read the wikipedia article...it appears to be the novel idea that everything is connected to everything else...

Um... isn't the word for that "interconnectedness?" Oh, Western culture... you're weird.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Um... isn't the word for that "interconnectedness?" Oh, Western culture... you're weird.

also, systems theory...

many academics require coming up with "new" things to write articles about...I'm afraid that sociology/political science feels the need to come up with their own versions and terminology for things others have long been calling other names for a long time...

 

[YmirGF]

okay, just read the wikipedia article...it appears to be the novel idea that everything is connected to everything else...

That is not actually correct. Intersectionality is a hierarchy of oppression and the intersection of multiple forms of oppression. Likewise, it has its roots in Standpoint and Critical race theory, placing the blame for virtually all oppression at the feet of the white supremacist patriarchy.

@icehorse Sorry, was unable to vote for anything in the poll and amusingly share many of the points brought up by @Debater Slayer

Hmmm. Maybe we need a thread about Intersectionality simply to inform people what it is. (We can go after Gender Studies later on... Muahahahaha.)

 

[Rival]

That is not actually correct. It is a hierarchy of oppression and the intersection of multiple forms of oppression. Likewise, it has its roots in Standpoint and Critical race theory.

Basically snowflakes making a snowman.

 

[Nakosis]

I only voted for "Lived experience deserves as much merit as expertise." -

The rest leaves too much to be defined. Even the term "progressive" means one thing for one person and something else for another.

Ok, but how do you get expertise except through live experience? Is there some thought out there that expertise can be gained without experience?

 

[Orbit]

Well, this thread neatly "outs" all the anti-progressives lol

 

[Kuzcotopia]

Well again, these are hard ideas to summarize. If you think the basic idea is good, but didn't like the wording in the poll, I'd ask you to say "yes" anyway, thanks.

I'm a progressive and a liberal, but I couldn't check even one of these boxes. . . . Where's the common-sense economic regulation, education reform, criminal justice reform, infrastructure, welfare and health insurance reforms, and so on?

I think that this poll is making incorrect assumptions about what progressivism is and what it is not.

 

[YmirGF]

Well, this thread neatly "outs" all the anti-progressives lol

Well, that's progressive, in and of itself, eh?

 

[Nakosis]

This poll is an attempt to discover how many RFers support some common progressive ideas, and which of these ideas are most widely supported here. Many of these are complex ideas, hard to boil down to a short sentence, so I'm requesting that if you support the spirit of a particular idea, but don't like the phrasing of the question, answer yes anyway.

Thanks.

Progressives believe in social reform and promoting liberal ideas...

Liberals believe in government action to achieve equal opportunity and equality for all. It is the duty of the government to alleviate social ills and to protect civil liberties and individual and human rights. Believe the role of the government should be to guarantee that no one is in need. Liberal policies generally emphasize the need for the government to solve problems.

Conservatives believe in personal responsibility, limited government, free markets, individual liberty, traditional American values and a strong national defense. Believe the role of government should be to provide people the freedom necessary to pursue their own goals. Conservative policies generally emphasize empowerment of the individual to solve problems.

Conservative vs. Liberal Beliefs

So I always saw the biggest difference is the distrust of the government versus the distrust of the individual.

In any case there is more than just the social justice aspect to being Progressive.

 

[YmirGF]

Progressives believe in social reform and promoting liberal ideas...

Liberals believe in government action to achieve equal opportunity and equality for all. It is the duty of the government to alleviate social ills and to protect civil liberties and individual and human rights. Believe the role of the government should be to guarantee that no one is in need. Liberal policies generally emphasize the need for the government to solve problems.

Conservatives believe in personal responsibility, limited government, free markets, individual liberty, traditional American values and a strong national defense. Believe the role of government should be to provide people the freedom necessary to pursue their own goals. Conservative policies generally emphasize empowerment of the individual to solve problems.

Conservative vs. Liberal Beliefs

So I always saw the biggest difference is the distrust of the government versus the distrust of the individual.

Likewise, neither group is monolithic and there is far more play between the camps than most will admit. In many ways I am quite progressive, but I am also a conservative at heart.

In any case there is more than just the social justice aspect to being Progressive.

I would cut @icehorse some slack as it seems that he is confused by SJW issues and progressive issues. Due to the overlap, it's not hard to understand his confusion.

 

[Nakosis]

Likewise, neither group is monolithic and there is far more play between the camps than most will admit. In many ways I am quite progressive, but I am also a conservative at heart.

Same here. I suspect both groups are represented in the media mostly by the extremists.

I would cut @icehorse some slack as it seems that he is confuse by SJW issues and progressive issues. Due to the overlap, it's not hard to understand his confusion.

I was more curious for myself wondering exactly what is a Progressive... though I've also seen Progressives portrayed as an fringe group of the Democrats.

 

[YmirGF]

Same here. I suspect both groups are represented in the media mostly by the extremists.

Agreed.

I was more curious for myself wondering exactly what is a Progressive... though I've also seen Progressives portrayed as an fringe group of the Democrats.

As near as I can tell, Progressives are to the left of tradition Liberalism, and social justice warriors are an even further left sect of progressives and are much more militant.

For example, during the furor over Evergreen college in Washington state, Liberalism was included in the student backlash, portrayed as pretend Allies that actually only reinforced the status quo and were seen as a big part of the problem due to entrenched systemic white privilege.

 

[Revoltingest]

I don't know what "intersectionality" is either, @beenherebeforeagain. What's supposed to be intersecting with what now?

I remember reading what it is.
And I remember finding it not worth remembering.
So I no longer know what it is.
Rights, equality, & justice shouldn't become arcane & difficult concepts

 

[YmirGF]

I remember reading what it is.
And I remember finding it not worth remembering.
So I no longer know what it is.
Rights, equality, & justice shouldn't become arcane & difficult concepts

I've been looking into it for about 6 months now and have only lately have become knowledgeable enough to create a coherent sentence about it. It is very dense (intellectually) wording in the theory that utilized enhanced meanings to common terms. You trip on that for the first while until you understand the nuanced nature of the enhanced jargon.

 

[Revoltingest]

I've been looking into it for about 6 months now and have only lately have become knowledgeable enough to create a coherent sentence about it. It is very dense (intellectually) wording in the theory that utilized enhanced meanings to common terms. You trip on that for the first while until you understand the nuanced nature of the enhanced jargon.

I think I know even less about it than before I read your post.
(I'm just an engineer. Things need to be simple.)

 

[Kenny]

Ok, but how do you get expertise except through live experience? Is there some thought out there that expertise can be gained without experience?

I think, (I could be wrong), that you can have head knowledge expertise but no experience. Maybe, as I mentioned before, it also falls into the category that one's person defintion is not the same as another person's definition.

 

[YmirGF]

I think I know even less about it than before I read your post.
(I'm just an engineer. Things need to be simple.)

To be honest for the first month or so I could only read for a few minutes at time because either my brain imploded or my eyes crossed making it impossible to continue.