God does everything for His own Glory!

[joeboonda]

I do not believe there 'elect' and 'non-elect', I believe we are all children of God.

Hi, just jumping in. I don't think the Bible teaches that all people are children of God, rather children of wrath, disobedience, and darkness, until we have accepted Christ, then we are adopted into His family and are children of light, of God:

Ephesians 5:8
For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
Ephesians 2:3
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Acts 26:18
To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
Ephesians 5:8
For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
Colossians 1:13
Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
1 Peter 2:9
But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;
Ephesians 2:2
Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Ephesians 5:6
Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
Colossians 3:6
For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:

Romans 5 says we are from the seed of Adam and inherited his sin-nature (Jesus was born of the Holy Spirit and Mary, not of man), so we were born chidren of darkness. That, to me would indicate we were not born as God's spirit babies. God breathed life into Adam and that life was passed down through procreation. That makes more sense in light of the above verses to me.

 

[Special Revelation]

Actually, yes. For awhile last year, my husband and I taught a group of people in our congregation on the Old Testament. Like I stated, if you do not wish to participate because of some ridiculous misinterpretation, be my guest.

Becky,
That's not the same is it? I am okay with a couple leading a Bible study with other couples. Conservative Christian churches do it all the time. However, where is your husband in the Titus study? I started a new Thread "Biblical roles of Godly women". I hope you will participate on it since you have much to contribute.

 

[Special Revelation]

Hi, just jumping in. I don't think the Bible teaches that all people are children of God, rather children of wrath, disobedience, and darkness, until we have accepted Christ, then we are adopted into His family and are children of light, of God:

Ephesians 5:8
For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
Ephesians 2:3
Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Acts 26:18
To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
Ephesians 5:8
For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
Colossians 1:13
Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
1 Peter 2:9
But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Thanks brother for sharing the truth of God's Word. We are exhorted to trust in the Lord with all our heart, and lean not on our own understanding. I am always encouraged when I read your postings and Threads, because they are grounded in God's wisdom and not man's wisdom!

 

[Bishka]

Becky,
That's not the same is it?

I've seen women do it on their own as well.

I started a new Thread "Biblical roles of Godly women". I hope you will participate on it since you have much to contribute.

I refuse to participate in sexist threads.

 

[Special Revelation]

I've seen women do it on their own as well.



I refuse to participate in sexist threads.

Do you refuse to obey God's wisdom as revealed in the Bible? Please read the Thread first before making such a bold statement. The LDS organization believes that protestant Christians know the same God as they do ( I think?).

 

[Ðanisty]

Obedience to the will of God.

That's why you are a member of your faith obviously. Why though, did you join this site? What are your plans? If your answer must have something to do with God, then what is God's will for you to accomplish on this site?

It's puzzling that you appear to support Danisty who claims to be Lucifer's disciple?

Becky isn't supporting me. Becky is supporting my statement about RF. Even if Becky was supporting me, it doesn't mean she supports my religion because I didn't say anything about my religion. I have friends on this forum from many different religious backgrounds. My religious beliefs have nothing to do with what we are discussing right now. I suggest you avoid making it personal.

 

[Bishka]

It's puzzling that you appear to support Danisty who claims to be Lucifer's disciple?

That is a ignorant assumption if I have ever heard one.

You do not have a very firm grasp on what I do and do not support.

 

[Willamena]

Your heart, mind, affections, thoughts, and world view is being shaped partially through this site.

Just so; and, by extension, all of interaction in life is a battlefield.

Think about it, God is stuck being amazingly beautiful, perfectly wise, completely Holy and righteous; therefore, it is natural for Him to be the center of the universe. All life is centered around Him, because He created all life and sustains life. He is worthy of praise, honor, adoration, and our 100% loyalty. The creatures who have been granted spiritual eyes to see this reality, naturally respond with praise and honor to God... It is the only natural response that we have because we were designed to worship God for our own personal joy.

It would seem by this, then, that, contrary to your subject line "God does everything for his own Glory!", it is we who glorify God.

 

[joeboonda]

Thanks brother for sharing the truth of God's Word. We are exhorted to trust in the Lord with all our heart, and lean not on our own understanding. I am always encouraged when I read your postings and Threads, because they are grounded in God's wisdom and not man's wisdom!

Hey, thanks Spec Rev! Lots of folks do not always agree with me here, but I do my best to see what the Bible says about things before I post something too awfully lame.
Thanks again,
Mike

 

[gnostic]

Maybe that is the very reason God reveals women cannot teach and lead men in regards to spiritual truths? Eve was deceive and not Adam, according to the Apostle Paul.

I don't think Paul knows what he is talking about, when he talks about the events that happened in Genesis.

And you're not being logical, because if Eve was really deceived, then she wasn't at fault, perhaps because she wasn't as smart as Adam. And if Adam wasn't deceived, then he is surely at fault because he had deliberately disobeyed God's commandment. For Adam knew of the deception and yet choose the path of eating the forbidden fruit.

(I am only following this argument of yours, who was deceived.)

Your assertion about women can't teach because what happened in Eden, is just as illogical. If Adam wasn't deceived, then he was the one who had deliberately sinned, according to the Christian doctrine, so Adam and his male descendants should have been the ones who can't have visions, revelations, and shouldn't be able to teach, not the women's side.

 

[gnostic]

I don't think the Bible teaches that all people are children of God, rather children of wrath, disobedience, and darkness, until we have accepted Christ, then we are adopted into His family and are children of light, of God:

And it is exactly that sort of position that I am not a Christian, because such self-righteous attitude bordered upon arrogance that cause much of the woes and intolerance throughout its history.

Claiming you're children of light or of God, is just as bad as evil people, because a person who believe in their own "goodness", will eventually tried to impose their sort of goodness, even if it mean harming them for their own good. This is the sort of thing that led to persecution of people through Inquisitions in Europe.

One of the things I hate about Christian ideal, is when they tell me how to think, behave or how I live my life. I choose to be good on my own term, not some damn priest or preacher. I follow the laws as best I can, but the last thing I need is Christians, or any religious group, telling me what's good and evil.

 

[gnostic]

It would seem by this, then, that, contrary to your subject line "God does everything for his own Glory!", it is we who glorify God.

I can understand if people glorify a god. But for a god to glory himself, only shows arrogance. God then become megalomaniac and a tyrant.

 

[joeboonda]

And it is exactly that sort of position that I am not a Christian, because such self-righteous attitude bordered upon arrogance that cause much of the woes and intolerance throughout its history.

Claiming you're children of light or of God, is just as bad as evil people, because a person who believe in their own "goodness", will eventually tried to impose their sort of goodness, even if it mean harming them for their own good. This is the sort of thing that led to persecution of people through Inquisitions in Europe.

One of the things I hate about Christian ideal, is when they tell me how to think, behave or how I live my life. I choose to be good on my own term, not some damn priest or preacher. I follow the laws as best I can, but the last thing I need is Christians, or any religious group, telling me what's good and evil.

I must tell you, I am a sinner, I have not "goodness' of my own, I am an undeserving, miserable sinner saved by the grace of God. The only "goodness" I have was freely given to me by Jesus who imputed His righteousness to me. I am "positionaly" righteous before God by Christ's righteousness that He gave to me as a free gift when I trusted Him, that He paid for all my sins and gave me His righteousness in place of my own which is "as filthy rags. The inquisition was against true Christians who trusted alone in Christ alone to save them. You are greatly in error my friend.

 

[gnostic]

I think that all Abrahamic religions have the fatal flaws - ARROGANCE.

The people of Israel, ie. Israelis, Jews, Hebrews, etc., that followed Judaism were considered God's chosen people for centuries and millenniums. For this they can become arrogant.

Christianity and Islam inherited this arrogance when took on the roles of God's chosen people. This time, it was inclusive clubs, where non-Jews can join their religion. What did they do? They began persecuting the Jews for centuries, because of these so-called rights to be called God's children.

Silly Christians who see people who don't followed used words like heathen, heretics and in their faces or behind people's back, called them "evil" and telling others they would burn in hell for not converting.

The Muslims have the habits of conquering people, and introduces their religion. Any slight to them, and they will declare jihad or holy wars. And anyone who aren't converted are taxed, and the only way to avoid these weird taxes is to convert. They says Muslims have to pay higher sacrifices, such conscriptions. Well, whoopee-do. This only means that non-Muslims can't carry weapon and can't defend themselves, whereas the Muslims can freely do so, causing maim and are protected by their religion, if they go around killing, pillaging and raping civilians. It doesn't matter if you were born in the countries and live their all your lives, you would remain second citizens. So much for the good lives of non-Muslims in Arabic-Muslim countries.

I am afraid that neither Christians nor Muslims have learn lessons of Jews, are acting arrogant with their self-righteousness.

Even in secular government in Australia, religions and religious people keep trying impose Christian ideals upon all Australia. Just last week, Catholic archbishop Pell is pushing to remove the law that allows for abortions in Australia. If he don't want Catholics to use abortions, FINE. But he should butt out of politics and stop interfering with non-Christian lives that have nothing to do with damn Christianity.

It bad enough that John bl#@dy Howard to introduce clergy counselors in state schools. STATE SCHOOLS! State Schools are supposed to be secular. What do damn Christian clergies know about counselling. What if the kid don't want to talk or confide to a damn preachers?!

I sick of Christians sticking their bl#@dy noses in every damn businesses. That's why I prefer Christians to keep their self-righteousness to themselves.

The inquisition was against true Christians who trusted alone in Christ alone to save them.

The inquisitions had also used the excuse of sinners upon the heretics, and much good that do them, when they interrogated, tortured and executed them. According to them, they are saving their souls. They claimed that they are doing for their own goods. Yeah, right.

If you are sinners, then that's your business, and I prefer if you keep your damn "sinner" label to yourself. If I want to be saved, then it is my business, not yours.

I know I am not perfect, and I have never claimed to be one. But calling other non-Christian people sinners and evil is one way to have your balls cut off.

 

[JayHawes]

And it is exactly that sort of position that I am not a Christian, because such self-righteous attitude bordered upon arrogance that cause much of the woes and intolerance throughout its history.

Claiming you're children of light or of God, is just as bad as evil people, because a person who believe in their own "goodness", will eventually tried to impose their sort of goodness, even if it mean harming them for their own good. This is the sort of thing that led to persecution of people through Inquisitions in Europe.

One of the things I hate about Christian ideal, is when they tell me how to think, behave or how I live my life. I choose to be good on my own term, not some damn priest or preacher. I follow the laws as best I can, but the last thing I need is Christians, or any religious group, telling me what's good and evil.

Being Christian has nothing to do with not beleiving in God or a god. And the meaning of Christianity is "Christ-like" look at who Jesus is and what he did. Dont base your assertion about Christianity on sinful mankind, but the one who did no sin. YOu may think however you wish, but if you rebell against Gd its your own fault...for whatever you shall reap. Chriatians knowing that they're children of the Light has nothing to do with the INquisitions, your're just digging up dirt on fanatics trying to justify why you think the "children of the Light" are equal to evil. Let me just assert, those who had carried out the inquisition had never read the bible....have you? Did you have somebody to die in the inquisition, or is that just something to put your your belt of doubt?

 

[gnostic]

Chriatians knowing that they're children of the Light has nothing to do with the INquisitions, your're just digging up dirt on fanatics trying to justify why you think the "children of the Light" are equal to evil.

I am not equating Christianity to evil. I am blaming today's Christians who use the word "sins" and "evil" far too freely.

The Christians who used the Inquisitions had also used such accusations (sin, evil, etc) in the past, on the mistaken belief that they are doing the right thing, by purging their souls with torture and fire. They have demonised alleged witches and heretics.

I hoping that you won't repeat past mistake, and the only way to do that is stopping pointing fingers at people and using the word "evil", whenever someone don't agree with you. It is exactly this type of favourite accusation that Christians used that may lead to intolerance and persecution.

 

[kmkemp]

I am not equating Christianity to evil. I am blaming today's Christians who use the word "sins" and "evil" far too freely.

The Christians who used the Inquisitions had also used such accusations (sin, evil, etc) in the past, on the mistaken belief that they are doing the right thing, by purging their souls with torture and fire. They have demonised alleged witches and heretics.

I hoping that you won't repeat past mistake, and the only way to do that is stopping pointing fingers at people and using the word "evil", whenever someone don't agree with you. It is exactly this type of favourite accusation that Christians that may lead to intolerance and persecution.

Your view of Christianity seems to be twisted. We are called to never judge someone. Fanatics and superstitious people (also a sin btw) burned witches. Many "christians" don't even know what the Bible says. I'm afraid that it is these people who you are speaking of. I have never called anyone evil unless I was referring to mankind as a whole including myself. I would wager that no Christian would do likewise. We are both evil, my friend. The difference is that I have an antidote that I want to share with you. You need only swallow your pride to accept it. That is the opposite of arrogance.

 

[gnostic]

I am sorry, kmkemp. And my apologies to joeboonda, jayhawes and any Christians who may have been offended by my posts here.

I'd guess I am pretty sensitive about people who use the word "evil" too freely. "Evil" is a strong word, and I don't like people throwing this word around.

I'd guess I still upset and sensitive about the batch of emails I had receive last March from a guy, who visited my website, Dark Mirrors of Heaven. I had brought up this subject here in the topic, My One Ticket To Hell (03-21-2007).

He said I was evil and sinner for not converting to Christianity, and literally told me I would burn to hell. I know of Jesus taught in the gospel, which included not to persecute other, and not judging other. If he was not judging, then what is it?

I explained to him, why I wrote it the site. More out of curiosity and fascination than anything else. Clearly he wrote his letters in order to preach and convert, and I told him I have no interest in converting, especially in the way he went about it, which was telling me I would go to hell and that I was evil for not doing so.

I had few Christians telling me I would go to hell in the past, but not in long time. I know that not all Christians have this attitude, but I do get "irritated" if any Christian say it.

If you wish to call yourself a sinner, then do so, because it is none of my business. But I will take offence if point your finger at me, and call me "evil" or "sinner". I will react, which is why I am telling to keep "sins" and "accusation of evil" to yourself.

 

[BruceDLimber]

I posted this under Biblical Debate. Therefore, spiritual truth is defined and limited to biblical revelation only in this debate?. Does that make sense, or am I incorrect?

Hi!

There are many of us here from many different religious traditions.

We Baha'is, for example, accept both the Bible and Qur'an as legitimate, God-sent scripture in addition to our own 200 volumes of scripture!

So the Bible is well within our scriptural purview.

(And even among nominal Christians you'll find literally thousands of different understandings and interpretations of the Bible alone, let alone all the other nuances that can come into play!)

So basically, I guess the best approach is simply to keep an open mind and welcome contributions to the discusison by all and sundry!

"The more, the merrier," and all that!

Best regards,

Bruce

 

[Special Revelation]

Hi!

There are many of us here from many different religious traditions.

We Baha'is, for example, accept both the Bible and Qur'an as legitimate, God-sent scripture in addition to our own 200 volumes of scripture!

So the Bible is well within our scriptural purview.

(And even among nominal Christians you'll find literally thousands of different understandings and interpretations of the Bible alone, let alone all the other nuances that can come into play!)

So basically, I guess the best approach is simply to keep an open mind and welcome contributions to the discusison by all and sundry!

"The more, the merrier," and all that!

Best regards,

Bruce

Thanks Bruce for sharing your insight. I'm somewhat new to this site. I am assuming the definition of truth in a debate is defined with a particular Thread category. For example, when we debate under "Biblical Debate" we are debating within the box of the Bible as the sole truth? Is this correct?