For Hunters

[painted wolf]

Why do you hunt?
Mostly for food, skins, bone, sinue, and other things.
What do you hunt?
As of right now only a few squirll and some fish but eventually Deer and possibly Bear and Moose.
I see the act as more of an ambush. You bait the animal, you sit up in a treehouse and wait for it to come to you, and you have a gun, while the animal has nothing...Do you think it's really "hunting"?
With a bow, or in the case of the bb gun for the squirll...yes
with a semi/full auto gun... no
Do you own any pets?
not currently but I have had several animals share thier time with me
Does your pet (if you have one) have a soul, or a personality?
yup
Are all animals in the same category?
yup
If animals are all animals, do they have souls?
yup
If your pet has a soul, and it's an animal, and other things are animals, wouldnt that mean they have souls too?
yup
How do you feel about the term "murder"?
complicated word with a lot of emotion behind it... basically it is the purposefull killing of someone in your peer group.
If you tell me that hunting deer is because of their overabundance of population, why dont people either:
1) start making the deer domestic and kill them for their meat?
deer (red deer) are domestic... doesn't do anything about wild overpopulation, spread of disease, and loss of low growing ground plants. (like American ginsing wich is almost extinct... deer just love that stuff) YOu can always tell a place that has too many deer, the forest floor is bare of herbacious plants and small saplings.
2) leave the deer alone, and try to bring wolves back into the picture to do the job they've been deprived of?
I'm all for that and donate to my local wolf shelter
Does hunting make you feel like more of a man?
Nope, I'm a girl
If you are a woman, does it make you feel more powerful?
Nope, it reminds me of my place in the world and my responcibilities though. I pray and try to remain respectful to the animals that I must kill and I remember when I die that I will become food for others. No filling me with sick preservitive chemicals.
Would you want to be around some or live with someone who enjoyed killing living things?
Enjoyed, no... but several people I live with hunt, one was a butcher. There is a difference between enjoying the process of hunting and enjoying bringing death to another living being.
There are many people in the world, if we wanted to get a challenge, why dont we hunt people?
we do, we call it war


yes, I have read "the most dangerous game" it was a very good story.

wa:do

 

[standing_alone]

Painted Wolf, your post was great. Frubals!

 

[Ody]

Personally i find hunting to be nausea inducing at the least

 

[Buttons*]

I guess yall are right, my questions were targeted.
I didn't mean to include the Native American population, since i have great respect for the way they do things.
I meant, moreso, the people who kill simply to kill...

sorry for making the questions so loaded

 

[Quoth The Raven]

Personally i find hunting to be nausea inducing at the least

Some of us feel that way about Kosher killing.

 

[turk179]

I spent some time in West Virginia and most of the people I knew there only hunted for the possibility of hanging a rack on the wall as a trophy. I do not agree with this at all. There are a lot of people that kill only for the meat but in my opinion if buying meat in the grocery store wont set you back any then there should be no reason for hunting down animals.

 

[jeffrey]

I hate that, people that hang dead animals on their walls. Some, on a deer, mount their front legs and have the deer hold the murder weapon, like an advertisement for the gun! 'This here is a Winchester 30/30. Sure knocked my arse in the mud, you'll like it too!' :devil:

 

[Squirt]

I hate that, people that hang dead animals on their walls. Some, on a deer, mount their front legs and have the deer hold the murder weapon, like an advertisement for the gun! 'This here is a Winchester 30/30. Sure knocked my arse in the mud, you'll like it too!' :devil:

I hate that, too. I am sickened by the sight of a head of a beautiful animal hanging on the wall of some individual who feels like a big shot for having taken its life.

 

[Ody]

Some of us feel that way about Kosher killing.

Kosher killing is for food and neccesity , hunting primarily here in california is for sport

 

[michel]

I don't hunt. I once did - on a cruise when I was ten years old; I horrified the others who didn't like my idea of throwing my catch back in. I don't like hunting, but I understand those who do for food, or for clothing.

 

[Green Gaia]

I don't hunt - because I don't have to. But you better believe if my kids were hungry and I had no other way to get food other than to go hunt, that I'd do it. I don't disparage those who hunt for food and actually eat what they kill. I do have a problem with killing just for a trophy, however, because it seems like such a waste, but that's just me.

 

[Squirt]

I don't hunt - because I don't have to. But you better believe if my kids were hungry and I had no other way to get food other than to go hunt, that I'd do it. I don't disparage those who hunt for food and actually eat what they kill. I do have a problem with killing just for a trophy, however, because it seems like such a waste, but that's just me.

Killing because you truly need the food is different entirely. God put animals on the earth and gave man dominion over them. That means He expects us to be responsible for how we treat them. I'm sure He wouldn't want us to let our children starve if we could provide for them by taking the life of an animal. But killing for sport is not ever justified, in my opinion.

 

[Ðanisty]

I guess yall are right, my questions were targeted.
I didn't mean to include the Native American population, since i have great respect for the way they do things.
I meant, moreso, the people who kill simply to kill...

sorry for making the questions so loaded

Don't worry about it Buttons. Hunters are often misunderstood and certainly there are hunters out there that make the rest look bad. In fact, those are the guys who usually end up on the news.

 

[MdmSzdWhtGuy]

I haven't hunted anything recently, but I have hunted often over the years. I have hunted Deer, Rabbits, Squirrels, Dove, Quail, Turkey, Wild Pigs, Crows, Coyotes and I can't really think of anything else. Everything I have ever hunted I have eaten, unless it was a nuisance species (crows, coyotes).

Hunting is enjoyable to me. It is primal to eat what you kill. A hard thing to describe to the non-hunter I suppose. Non-hunters get all bent out of shape over the cruelty of killing an animal. Well, where do you suppose those hamburgers come from? They don't grow on trees. All animals, including you and me, die. Whether taken by a hunter, or by old age, disease, or a predator, all animals are going to die.

I don't recall all the questions posed by the OP, but I assume they are the typical anti gun anti hunting rhetoric. Why do I do it? It is enjoyable, gets me out in nature, and appeals to my more primal nature.

Does it make me feel more like a man? I presume that to be a smarmy sarcastic comment, more than a legitimate question. If you mean does it make me feel big and tough, then no, it does not. Taking the life of another living creature, and then feeding that creature to myself and my family makes me feel as if I am a part of nature, and gives me true reverence for all life.

I am not going to go into all the other questions, as I don't recall them, but, in short, I hunted, as a source of entertainment for several years. I know live in DFW and frankly hunting isn't what it was when I was a kid. Now it is a rich man's pursuit, as one must own vast tracts of land, or be able to pay large fees to go onto private ranch's to hunt animals, that are often kept there merely for the purpose of having some rich individual come along and shoot them.

I get a lot of the enjoyment of the outdoors, and communion with nature that I used to get from hunting, from playing golf, and without the messiness, and yes, guilt, associated with hunting. I still own guns, and always will, but unless my financial fortunes change vastly for the better, which is something I do not expect, then I don't anticipate I will be counting myself as a hunter again any time soon.

B.

 

[kreeden]

Okay, i have some questions. If they sound rambling and jumpy... its cause i've thought alot about them, and they come to me at a fairly fast rate... hard to put them all down:

Why do you hunt?
What do you hunt?
I see the act as more of an ambush. You bait the animal, you sit up in a treehouse and wait for it to come to you, and you have a gun, while the animal has nothing...Do you think it's really "hunting"?
Do you own any pets?
Does your pet (if you have one) have a soul, or a personality?
Are all animals in the same category?
If animals are all animals, do they have souls?
If your pet has a soul, and it's an animal, and other things are animals, wouldnt that mean they have souls too?
How do you feel about the term "murder"?
If you tell me that hunting deer is because of their overabundance of population, why dont people either:
1) start making the deer domestic and kill them for their meat?
2) leave the deer alone, and try to bring wolves back into the picture to do the job they've been deprived of?

....there's more to come.... but this should be enough to get people started

I don't usually get into debates , because that is not the reason I feel that I am here . But you bring up some very good questions Buttons , and I will try to answer them as best as I can . But first , a little background on myself . I grew up in the country ... hillbillie if you like . But I no longer hunt ... to fat and lazy ... besides Canadian gun laws has made it a pain .

Ok , I hunted for food and I grew up traping animals for profit { although there really isn't much profit in fur ... } . Yes , I grew up as one of those people PETA warn you about . But the way I was raised , it was no different then raising chickens for eggs or meat . In fact , the way I saw it , it was better as the animal was free , unlike those raised for food . Granted , hunting is a one sided contest , the animal still has a chance . More then you may think .

I am not going to list everything that I have hunted , or traped . It is a rather long list . But I have usually only " baited " an animal if I were traping . There were laws agaisnt that in N.S. . However , many hunters today are " road hunters ". They drive untill they see something , and shoot it ... which is why they now have laws restricting that .

Of course , laws are broken . { not that I would EVER break one mind you } .

No , I don't " own " any pets . But yes , they have Spirits too . { I'm not sure what a " soul " is , but I figure that if something has a Spirit , it has a soul . Besides , I am not more then an animal myself . } And I believe that plants have Spirits too .

Murder is an over used term that can refer to killing anything . Does a Wolf " murder when it kills for food ? I don't think so , although others may . I'm sure that ranchers do when that food happens to be their livestock . But I still just see the Wolf as doing what it does to survive . The same as when a child is killed by a Cougar or Bear . The Bear or Cougar aren't " murders ". However , they have become a danger and most be dealed with .

Personally I hope that we NEVER domesticate another creature . I know that isn't a reasonable wish , but still . We make slaves of them and inbreed them for our own amusement . And that is a far worst crime , IMHO , then murder . But then , I'm a little wierd that way ...

 

[kreeden]

I guess yall are right, my questions were targeted.
I didn't mean to include the Native American population, since i have great respect for the way they do things.
I meant, moreso, the people who kill simply to kill...

sorry for making the questions so loaded

Ok , I have to reply to this too ... What are you saying here Buttons ? That if you are First Nations , it is ok to hunt , but if you are not , then it isn't ?

No , I realize that you are talking about something else . And I wish that I could say that it was all bs started by anti-hunting groups . But I have seen too much waste and the likes myself to say that . And yes , I have met people like you are talking about , who get a thrill out of the killing ...

There is a thrill in the kill . A natural thrill of going one on one with a creature whose every sense has been developed for it's survivial . But that is lost on some ... either that or they become " drunk " with it . But then , there are far too many of us who have pets that we torture , children that we abuse ...

BTW , perhaps I don't get the same thrill as some because I grew up with hunting as a way of life? But I get as much thrill tracking an animal and getting a good picture of it , or even just out witting it . { as in having a Deer run , circling it and have it walk right up to me ... it is a matter of knowing the animal to the point of knowing how it thinks and yes , I do get quite a thrill out of that } . But I have NEVER been able to figure out where the " sport " is in shooting fenced , half tame animals ...

You know , the biggest thrill I ever got in a hunt was one summer , hunting rattle snakes . I was unarmed , other then for a knive and stick . And I got one under a rock , but couldn't figure out what to do with it . It got to keep it's rattle , and I got to learn a little first hand experience about a wonderful creature ... and that is what the thrill of the hunt is all about to me . You learn things about the animal that you would never learn watching it in a zoo .

Sorry if I got a little long winded on you here . But as I said , I am an animal , and I'm proud of it ....

 

[standing_alone]

I want to commend MdmSzdWhtGuy and Kreeden for their excellent posts. I don't hunt (but I fish), but I think it is more noble to go out and shoot your own food than to just go to a supermarket and buy it, but that's just me. Like Thoreau said (and this is paraphrasing, I don't have my copy of Walden on me, sorry): "Pity the boy who has never fired a gun. He is no more humane, but an important part of his education is lacking." I'm sorry I don't have the actual quote, verbatim, but I think it makes an excellent point.

 

[painted wolf]

I have to add my two cents on the supermarket meat.

Unless you are buying small farmed, free range humane animal products, you are contributing to far more suffering than hunting brings.
Many factory farmed animals live horrible lives, filled with suffering and degrading treatment.
At least the hunted animal lived a free life, and when you kill it you know (and can prevent to a large part) its level of suffering uppon its death. You can at least say your thanks and ask forgiveness in person.

We are so disconnected from our food in the 'modern' world that we can all to easily forget that our hamburger was once a living creature.... a life we will never know.
Our eggs were "produced" in an automated factory where the chicken is just another cog in the machine... not a free being, just another part of the machine.

wa:do

 

[TurtleGirl]

I won't take up space posting my answers to the questions because my life-partner painted_wolf has already answered them much the same as I would have. We have very similar views on hunting.

I would like to respond to one statement and raise another point.

There are a lot of people that kill only for the meat but in my opinion if buying meat in the grocery store wont set you back any then there should be no reason for hunting down animals.

If I had the ability to hunt for all of our food then I would, but I disagree that supermarkets provide better food or more humane slaughtering of animals. There is no honor or respect in the penning of animals and mechanization of the "hunt." There's more honor and respect for the animal if you take the time to honor the animal with your time and effort to earn the sacrifice it is making for you to continue living.

As for quality of supermarket meat...

The newly recognized foodborne pathogens tend to be carried and shed by apparently healthy animals. Food tainted by these organisms has most likely come in contact with an infected animal's stomach contents or manure, during a slaughter or subsequent processing. A nationwide study published by the USDA in 1996 found that 7.5 percent of the ground beef samples taken at processing plants were contaminated with Salmonella, 11.7 percent were contaminated with Listeria monocytogenes, 30 percent were contaminated with Staphylococcus aureus, and 53.3 percent were contaminated with Clostridium perfringens. All of these pathogens can make people sick; food poisoning caused by Listeria generally requires hospitalization and proves fatal in about one out of every five cases. In the USDA study 78.6 percent of the ground beef contained microbes that are spread primarily by fecal material. The medical literature on the causes of food poisoning is full of euphamisms and dry scientific terms: coliform levels, aerobic plate counts, sorbitol, MacConkey agar, and so on. Behind them lies a simple explanation for why eating a hamburger can now make you seriously ill: There is [crap] in the meat.

Source: Fast Food Nation, Eric Schlosser, p. 197

Beyond that I have a slightly off-topic beef (pardon the pun) with vegetarianism for the sake of preserving animals' lives. Vegetables and fruits are living things, also. They have lives and spirits just as the animals and require the same respect. As for humane reasons, just remember: whenever you bite into a raw vegetable, that is a living thing still alive until the moment you bite into it and chew it to death. Far less humane if you ask me.

As for hunting for sport/trophy, it's disrespectful and I'm willing to bet that most, if not all, religions/spiritual beliefs/common sense pratices shun greed and pride to this hurtful degree. Mind you, I won't purport to know all religions/spiritual beliefs/common sense practices. That would be foolish of me.

 

[Smoke]

Vegetables and fruits are living things, also. They have lives and spirits just as the animals and require the same respect.

We can eat fruit without killing the plant; in fact, one could argue that the purpose of fruit is to be eaten. However, it's very difficult to live on a fruitarian diet, and I for one would not want to try it.