Errors And Contradictions In Bible

[savedbygrace]

Hello. Just thought I'd jump in here and share my thoughts on your thread. First of all, it takes faith to believe in the Bible. You either have it or you choose not too. According to God's Word, He tells us that all scripture was recorded by men who were inspired by God Himself. The Word of God is alive. In it you'll find the keys to everlasting life, that is, if you indeed want eternal life. Again, according to scripture, you're going to spend eternity in either Heaven or hell, it's a choice. God doesn't force anyone to receive salvation, it is a gift. You know, as much time and energy as you have put into trying to find fault in God's Word, you could be trying to find out wether or not God is real. The Bible is what it is and obviously you've been reading It and it sounds like you're at a standstill with It at the moment. So why not go straight to the Source, and have a chat with God Himself, and ask Him to show you if His Word is in fact true or not. Trust me, He'll answer you............... Don't be afraid too, because He is a God of love and wants very much for you to understand..............

Creation of the World
(a) Bible. Book of Genesis. Chapter 1. Verse I and 2:- “In the beginning GOD created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of GOD was hovering over the waters.”
At the initial stage of the formation of the universe only a gaseous mass like a smoke existed. To mention the existence of water at this stage is simply human imagination of Bible writers. Science considers it to be an error. Today’s Bible is conceived in the minds of men. Nothing is so firmly believed except that which is known the least.
(b) Bible. Book of Genesis. Chapt. 1. Verse 3 to 5:- “And GOD said, ‘let there be light’, and there was light. GOD saw that the light was good, and HE separated the light from the darkness. GOD called the light ‘Day’, and the darkness he called night. And there was evening, and there was morning—the First Day.”
Here science has a problem. This is the First day when the light has come. But where has it come from? If the source of light was Sun, then according to the Bible it appears much later on i.e. on the Fourth day as we will see later. Stars also appear on the Fourth day. So how can there be light three days in advance of Sun or stars? These are imaginary descriptions of events. There is a lot of human manipulation.
(c) Bible. Book of Genesis. Chapter 1. Verse.6 to 8:- “And GOD said, Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water. So GOD made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. GOD called the expanse ‘sky.’ And there was evening, and there was morning—the Second Day.”
Here again there is an imagination of human mind. We have already seen earlier that the Sun and the stars had not appeared till then. So in the absence of Sun how can there be evening and morning? And how could there be water above in the sky?
Bible writers did not know that one day science would be so much developed that it would find faults with the Bible.
(d) Bible. Book of Genesis. Chapter 1 Verse 9 to 13:- “And GOD said, Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear. And it was so. GOD called the dry ground land, and the gathered waters
HE called seas. And GOD saw that it was good.
Then GOD said, Let the land produce vegetation: Seed-bearing plants and ‘trees on the land that hear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds. And it was’ so.
The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And GOD saw it was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the Third Day.”
Here again the science has a problem. How come vegetation and trees with fruit and seed can flourish in the absence of Sunlight? (According to Genesis the Sun would appear much later i.e. on the Fourth Day) Surely human authors have taken a lot of liberty with the Bible text.
(e) Bible. Book of Genesis. Chapter I. Verse 14 to 19:- “And GOD said, Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, and let there be
lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth.
And it was so. GOD made two great lights— the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night.
He also made the stars.
GOD set them in the expanse of the sky to give light to the earth, to govern the day and the night and to separate light from darkness.
And GOD saw that it was good.
And there was evening, and there was morning—the Fourth Day.”
Here again there is a problem. In earlier verses — I 3 it has been said that the earth was already created on the First Day and there was vegetation and trees with fruits and seed. Now it is the Fourth Day and Bible now tells us that on the Fourth Day the Sun and the moon have appeared. But we know from science that the earth and the moon emanated from their original star—the Sun. So here again the Bible statement is other way. round. The Sun should have been mentioned first, light and darkness, vegetation, plants and trees and seeds should have followed thereafter. Order is God’s First Law. Today’s Bible was written in the understanding of man and it was written in the language of man.
(f) Bible. Book of Genesis. Chapter 1. Verse 20 to 23:- “And GOD said. Let the water teem with living creatures. and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky. So GOD created the great creatures of sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind.
And GOD saw that it was good. GOD blessed them and said, Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on earth.
And there was evening and there was morning on the Fifth Day.”
Here again Science has a problem with Bible. Bible says that the winged birds came on the Fifth Day and that too along with the fish. But Bible also says that it was on the Sixth Day that the Animals came on the earth. Coming of the birds before the coming of animals is not acceptable to science. According to science the fish came first, then animals came, and then came the birds—in that sequence. Bible is full of defects. And lately the Vatican has begun to accept the defects.
(g) Bible Book of Genesis. Chapter 1. Verses 24 to 31:- “And God said, Let the land produce living creatures according .to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind.
And it was so.
GOD made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds.
And GOD saw that it was good.
Then GOD said, “Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground.
So GOD created man in his own image, in the image of GOD he created him; male and female HE created them.
GOD blessed them and said to them, Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground.
Then GOD said, I give you every seed bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food~ And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground— everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food.
And it was so.
GOD saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the Sixth Day.”
Here the error as pointed out by science is that the Bible has placed the birds on the Fifth Day of creation while the animals are made to appear later on the Sixth Day.
Here again the sequence of events, according to science is other way round. Appearance of Animals should come before the appearance of birds. Is Bible really the word of GOD?
There is plenty of human manipulation.
(h) Bible. Book of Genesis Chapter 2 Verse 1 to 3:- “Thus the heavens and the earth were completed in all their vast array.
By the Seventh Day GOD had finished the work he had been doing; so on the Seventh Day he rested from all his work.
And GOD blessed the Seventh Day and made it holy, because on it he rested from all the work of creating that he had done.”
Here comes the human manipulation. Allude an act to GOD so that it becomes justifiable for folks to follow it. Men willingly believe in what they themselves wish for. Much later Mark at 2:27 said, “Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.” The truth is that Sabbath is for man not for God.
If GOD did it, why should not they also do it. A typical Jewish line of thinking. It is also worth bringing to the notice of our readers that these three verses (Chapter 2 Verse 1-3) did not exist in the earlier YAHVIST text of Bible. It is a later addition in Bible by Jews. Why?
We know that all the days that are mentioned in Bible in the creation of the universe are very long periods of time spread over million and millions of years. But here abruptly we come to a day, which is only twenty-four hours long. It is just to justify the SABBATH —the Day of rest of the Jews.
Here again there is an addition in the Bible. This later day addition in the Bible is therefore deliberate, imaginative and purely whimsical just to justify the Day of Sabbath.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Ron dear, facts are something that have the qualities of being actual or something that has actual existence or an actual occurrence. You try and present your arguments as being based in fact. In fact you were not there during Genesis so you do not know that what you say is indeed fact.

Christians on the otherhand accept God and His ways through faith. Now faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. You also accept what you believe on faith (again, you were not there).

The beauty of Christian faith is that in it there is blessed hope for things eternal. You I am afraid have no such hope. Spending one's time looking backward does not engender hope for the future. Sorry.

 

[blueman]

Ron,

I know you been harping on this for awhile and you should try to come up with a fresh, new thread. Most of your arguments are speculative at best, with no factual basis. Since you are the skeptic, the onus is on you to invalidate the Bible, both Old and New Testament. Here is a few things you need to know, even in light of the fact that the Bible has levels of divergence that are present in scripture:

- Acheaology: Places, cultures and kings both in the Old and New Testament have been validated by leading archeologists, both Christian and Non-Christian alike.

- 1st Century historians in the Jewish (Josephus) and Roman (Tacitus) communities have validated the existence and ministry of Jesus.

- Approximately 10,000 Jews were converted from Judaism to Christianity within 20 years of Jesus's resurrection. This was considered a "damning of one's soul" in ancient Jewish culture.

- Saul of Tarsus, a hater of Jesus and all Christianity stood for and persecuted/killed many Christian followers converted to Christianity subsequent to encountering the resurrected Christ on the road to Damascus

- 10 of the 11 disciples were murdered. Keep in mind, after Jesus cruxifiction, they all scattered in mourning and fear, devastated over the slaughter of their Messiah. They returned in a very short period preaching salvation through Jesus Christ with vigor, with the only assurance that they would probably meet their own death as a result? Why would they want to sacrifice their life if promulgating a lie or falsehood?

- The New Testament gospels were written by eyewitnesses or people who had direct contact with eyewitnesess to Jesus's life, ministry, death and resurrection, well within their lifetimes and could have been disputed by contemporaries of that time.

- Jesus met all of the messianic prophecies depicted in the Old Testament and Jewish Talmud and written some 700 years prior to His birth

- There were many witnesses to Jesus's resurrection and a creed passed down after His cruxifiction and referenced in 1st Conrithians 15 cites approximately 500 witnesses. Now keep in mind, both the religious leaders and Roman authorities knew where Jesus was buried after His cruxifiction and could have disputed the claim being made by many people who encountered the resurrected Jesus. There is no doubt based on historical record that the tomb was empty.

This is just a few rational and historical facts for the trustworthiness of the Bible. The fact that their is some divergence makes it even more credible based on the fact that something that was conspired or made up would be sure to remove or eliminate any evidence of divergence. These authors were writing in a fairly independent way and there does not appear to be any evidence of a conspiracy to promulgate false doctrine.

"God gives us free will and a choice to accept or reject His purpose for our lives"

WWW.LIFE-CHOICE.NET

 

[JerryL]

Samuel:
Israel 80 'lp, 30 'lp Judah 40 'lp, 70 'lp

Identical.

The man who copied Chronicles accidentally copied 800 'lp and 300 'lp (adding zeros has plagued scribes from almost all languages. Plato's texts of Atlantis added a zero, making the island too big for Plato's sea, hence it was moved to the Atlantic, and never found) For Israel the 'lp was written as thousand both times and added. Result? 1,100,000 homies. For Judah the scribe figured the second number couldn't be larger than the first, so he only added a zero to the 40 and added them. The result? 470,000 homies. The scribe who copied Samuel added zeros to the first set from each tribe and then totalled them all up together. 800 'lp + 30 'lp + 400 'lp + 70 'lp. To get even numbers he added 30 + 400 + 70 and got 500,000 for Judah. For Israel he gets 800,000. The mistake is assuming both times 'lp refers to thousand.

Which combination of 8, 3, 4, and 7 equals 11 again? (the 1.1 million total), I've not managed to see that in your post.

Perhaps this is why my friend prefers things like the color of Jesus's robe, or the method of Judas's death, or the liniage of Joseph or and of the scores of others. I like numbers.

That said, let me look at your claim:
http://www.mechon-mamre.org/e/et/et25a21.htm

And Joab gave up the sum of the numbering of the people unto David. And all they of Israel were a thousand thousand and a hundred thousand men that drew sword; and Judah was four hundred three-score and ten thousand men that drew sword
​

Hrm. Not good enough. Let's look for the Hebrew:

יהיו דיוד-לא םעה-דקפמ רפסמ-תא באוי ןתיו ה 5
ברח ףלש שיא ףלא האמו םיפלא ףלא לארשי-לכ :ברח ףלש שיא ףלא םיעבשו תואמ עברא הדוהיו
​

as compared to

well shoot, can you find 2 Sam 24 in Hebrew? I'm having trouble tracking it down.

I'm also curious why you would suspect that everyone else has it wrong. That is to say, if you google apologetics for this (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=number+soldiers+joab&btnG=Search) You'll find lots of Bible scholars discussing it, but none (none I saw) making your suggestion

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

- Acheaology: Places, cultures and kings both in the Old and New Testament have been validated by leading archeologists, both Christian and Non-Christian alike.

- 1st Century historians in the Jewish (Josephus) and Roman (Tacitus) communities have validated the existence and ministry of Jesus.

- Approximately 10,000 Jews were converted from Judaism to Christianity within 20 years of Jesus's resurrection. This was considered a "damning of one's soul" in ancient Jewish culture.

Where on earth did you come up with such nonsense? :biglaugh:

• All folklore contains residual history, and to say that "places, cultures and kings ... have been validated by leading archeologists" is absurdly misleading if not pathetically dishonest. Where, for example, is the 'validation' of the Exodus/Conquest?
• Josephus is widely recognized as a worthless interpolation, and neither Tacitus nor Suetonius, both writing circa 115 CE, serve in any way to substantiate a historical Jesus.
• Your "10,000 Jews" is self-serving fiction.

Thanks for the comic elief ...

 

[blueman]

Where on earth did you come up with such nonsense? :biglaugh:

• All folklore contains residual history, and to say that "places, cultures and kings ... have been validated by leading archeologists" is absurdly misleading if not pathetically dishonest. Where, for example, is the 'validation' of the Exodus/Conquest?
• Josephus is widely recognized as a worthless interpolation, and neither Tacitus nor Suetonius, both writing circa 115 CE, serve in any way to substantiate a historical Jesus.
• Your "10,000 Jews" is self-serving fiction.

Thanks for the comic elief ...

As a skeptic, the onus is on you to invalidate the historical facts I just stated, not give me your sarcastic opinion. Thanks

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

As a skeptic, the onus is on you to invalidate the historical facts I just stated, not give me your sarcastic opinion.

You have stated no historical facts.

 

[dan]

Which combination of 8, 3, 4, and 7 equals 11 again? (the 1.1 million total), I've not managed to see that in your post.

800,000 plus 300,000 equals 1.1 million (or a thousand thousand and a hundred thousand). The original texts read 80 'lp 30 'lp, but they multiplied them by ten and then added them. It's all in there, just read it again. For the 4 and the 7 they only multiplied the four times ten and added them, getting 470, 000, or four hundred threescore and ten thousand.

 

[blueman]

You have stated no historical facts.

Disprove it then. Your a naturalist, so you don't believe in the supernatural to begin with. Why don't you do your research and then get back to me. There are many skeptics out there who honestly acknowledge biblical, archeaology and other corraborating (1st century historians) evidence as factual.

It kills me that skeptics like yourself don't put the historical record of Alexander the Great under any scrutinity and his biography was written 400 years after his death like you do the Bible, especially the New Testament Gospels that were written well within the lifetimes of the authors and witnesses who had access to the ministry of Jesus.

 

[dan]

I'm also curious why you would suspect that everyone else has it wrong. That is to say, if you google apologetics for this (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=number+soldiers+joab&btnG=Search) You'll find lots of Bible scholars discussing it, but none (none I saw) making your suggestion

I suspect they have it wrong because they present no argument of any substance. Those Bible scholars you googled are more of those guys who hang their faith on the Bible being "inerrable," and they are just wrong. The fact that none make my suggestion does absolutely nothing to disprove what I have proven. I think it's ridiculous to say my argument is baseless because it isn't what everyone else thinks. It's like looking at Einstein's Theory of Relativity and saying, "You know this can't be true because no one else seems to teach this." That's the thing with solving a problem that no one has an answer to - no one else has the answer! So you shouldn't be puzzled by the fact that it isn't widely known.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

It kills me that ...

Babble all you wish. You made deceptive claims, now defend them. You cannot, of course, and so you protest your worthless protests. It's tiresome.

 

[Merlin]

these are facts

you surely know that there are no facts in religion, just belief. Of course if you have grown up where faith is presented to you as fact, then to you it is fact.

If I can give you some advice, it does not to your own soul any good to attack anybody else's beliefs. What can you possibly achieve?

Carry on developing your own religious faith to find your own communion with God, and the allow the Lord to work in his own way in the minds of others.

 

[JerryL]

800,000 plus 300,000 equals 1.1 million (or a thousand thousand and a hundred thousand).

But ignoring the number problem, that doesn't fit the translation:

In all Israel there were one million one hundred thousand men who could handle a sword, including four hundred and seventy thousand in Judah.​

Unless you want to assert that the Biblical translators incompitent compared to you, you are stuck with 8+3 not being *all*, as you have not included the 47. I'm also incredulious that a translator would have taken what you claim (40 lp 70 lp) and translated at 470,000 as opposed to 400,000 and 70,000

5And Joab giveth the account of the numbering of the people unto David, and all Israel is a thousand thousand and a hundred thousand, each drawing sword, and Judah [is] four hundred and seventy thousand, each drawing sword. - YLT

5And Joab gave the sum of the number of the people unto David. And all they of Israel were a thousand thousand and an hundred thousand men that drew sword: and Judah was four hundred threescore and ten thousand men that drew sword. - KJV

​

Still don't see it... let's got back to 2 Sam 24:9

9and Joab giveth the account of the inspection of the people unto the king, and Israel is eight hundred thousand men of valour, drawing sword, and the men of Judah five hundred thousand men. - YLT
​

You said "Samuel: Israel 80 'lp, 30 'lp Judah 40 'lp, 70 'lp". In this, you presume that BIblical scholars are so inept that they can't even place the people in the right place. (and, again, you accuse that not a single Biblical translator got it right).

In short, I don't see "80,30 and 40,70" as showing up in the original texts at all... but hey, pull out the Hebrew from Sam and let's look.

5And Joab gave the sum of the number of the people unto David. And all they of Israel were a thousand thousand and an hundred thousand men that drew sword: and Judah was four hundred threescore and ten thousand men that drew sword.

I called into question your position, which is based on your say so, on the fact that it doesn't show up in thousands of years of Biblical scholarship. To be blunt, for 1900 years people have been basing their entire lives around this book (and by that, I mean clergy and Biblical scholars have made lifelon careers out of understanding it, and billions have been searching to reconcile it), and yet the translators don't agree with you, and neither does the mass of Christian scholars.

Yes, when you come and say something different than everyone I can see, you carry quite the burden to support. I should call dad, he speaks Hebrew.

BTW, did you find 2 Sam 24 in Hebrew? I asked for it.

 

[TashaN]

Hello. Just thought I'd jump in here and share my thoughts on your thread. First of all, it takes faith to believe in the Bible. You either have it or you choose not too. According to God's Word, He tells us that all scripture was recorded by men who were inspired by God Himself. The Word of God is alive. In it you'll find the keys to everlasting life, that is, if you indeed want eternal life. Again, according to scripture, you're going to spend eternity in either Heaven or hell, it's a choice. God doesn't force anyone to receive salvation, it is a gift. You know, as much time and energy as you have put into trying to find fault in God's Word, you could be trying to find out wether or not God is real. The Bible is what it is and obviously you've been reading It and it sounds like you're at a standstill with It at the moment. So why not go straight to the Source, and have a chat with God Himself, and ask Him to show you if His Word is in fact true or not. Trust me, He'll answer you............... Don't be afraid too, because He is a God of love and wants very much for you to understand..............

The problem is that God sent his holy books by prophets to us to communicate with us and it wasn't for fun !!!

If we want to know who is God we have to search and investigate who is this God, what he want from us, how we can worship him the way he want.

Nevertheless, personally i think your claim that it's a matter of accepting the bible as it's or not accepting it as a whole is unfair because we have to study the bible before believeing in it? No???

 

[dan]

But ignoring the number problem, that doesn't fit the translation:

In all Israel there were one million one hundred thousand men who could handle a sword, including four hundred and seventy thousand in Judah.​

Unless you want to assert that the Biblical translators incompitent compared to you, you are stuck with 8+3 not being *all*, as you have not included the 47. I'm also incredulious that a translator would have taken what you claim (40 lp 70 lp) and translated at 470,000 as opposed to 400,000 and 70,000

5And Joab giveth the account of the numbering of the people unto David, and all Israel is a thousand thousand and a hundred thousand, each drawing sword, and Judah [is] four hundred and seventy thousand, each drawing sword. - YLT


5And Joab gave the sum of the number of the people unto David. And all they of Israel were a thousand thousand and an hundred thousand men that drew sword: and Judah was four hundred threescore and ten thousand men that drew sword. - KJV


​

Still don't see it... let's got back to 2 Sam 24:9

9and Joab giveth the account of the inspection of the people unto the king, and Israel is eight hundred thousand men of valour, drawing sword, and the men of Judah five hundred thousand men. - YLT


​

You said "Samuel: Israel 80 'lp, 30 'lp Judah 40 'lp, 70 'lp". In this, you presume that BIblical scholars are so inept that they can't even place the people in the right place. (and, again, you accuse that not a single Biblical translator got it right).


In short, I don't see "80,30 and 40,70" as showing up in the original texts at all... but hey, pull out the Hebrew from Sam and let's look.

I called into question your position, which is based on your say so, on the fact that it doesn't show up in thousands of years of Biblical scholarship. To be blunt, for 1900 years people have been basing their entire lives around this book (and by that, I mean clergy and Biblical scholars have made lifelon careers out of understanding it, and billions have been searching to reconcile it), and yet the translators don't agree with you, and neither does the mass of Christian scholars.

Yes, when you come and say something different than everyone I can see, you carry quite the burden to support. I should call dad, he speaks Hebrew.

BTW, did you find 2 Sam 24 in Hebrew? I asked for it.

Do you have a better explanation? Because this is just rhetoric; there's no real argument here. "I'm...increduluous," "I still don't see," aren't really intimidating points of logic. And here's 2 Samuel 24:9 In Hebrew. I used the same site you did.

ט וַיִּתֵּן יוֹאָב אֶת-מִסְפַּר מִפְקַד-הָעָם, אֶל-הַמֶּלֶךְ; וַתְּהִי יִשְׂרָאֵל שְׁמֹנֶה מֵאוֹת אֶלֶף אִישׁ-חַיִל, שֹׁלֵף חֶרֶב, וְאִישׁ יְהוּדָה, חֲמֵשׁ-מֵאוֹת אֶלֶף אִישׁ.

Do you have a question about the Hebrew?

By the way, I do say something different, and I did support it. The burden remains with you to prove me wrong. And I could care less what the mass of Christian scholars think; they haven't gotten the doctrine correct yet either.

 

[JerryL]

Do you have a question about the Hebrew?

Actually, yes: can you pull out and repeat the numbers themselves.

By the way, I do say something different, and I did support it.

Actually you have not supported it. You've explained out your claims, but you've not shown that the manuscript says what you claim it says, nor have you provided any support as to the possible interpreatations of what you claim it says, nor have you provided any reason why your claimed interpretation is right and the interpretation of every major Bible scholar I'm aware of in the past 1900 years is wrong.

You have claimed, and been specific (which I appriciate), but you have not supported.

The first part of the support should be establishing that what you claim is in there is in there. You've claimed the same numbers in both passages; so let's pull out the number from the Hebrew and see that the same bits appear in both. That's a start.

 

[dan]

I assume you think I'm gonna fall into your clever little trap of not realizing that the Hebrew now says sholef instead of elef. Is that correct? Everything else fits with what I'm saying, so If it's not that I don't get what you're trying to say. The numbers are exactly as I explained them. My transliteration should suffice:

vayten yoav et-mispar mifkad-haam el-hamelekh vatehi yisrael shemone meot elef ish-kha yil sholef kherev vaish yehuda khamesh-meot elef ish

If the sholef thing is what you're getting at then that's cool, I can explain it.

 

[dan]

You've claimed the same numbers in both passages; so let's pull out the number from the Hebrew and see that the same bits appear in both. That's a start.

When did I claim this?

 

[JerryL]

You've claimed the same numbers in both passages; so let's pull out the number from the Hebrew and see that the same bits appear in both. That's a start.

When did I claim this?

In post #55.

Chronicles:
Israel 80 'lp, 30 'lp Judah 40 'lp, 70 'lp

Samuel:
Israel 80 'lp, 30 'lp Judah 40 'lp, 70 'lp

Identical.

 

[dan]

You'll notice I said that those were the original texts. We no longer possess the original texts; they were lost thousands of years ago. Through extensive research the numbers from the original texts can be extrapolated from the tainted ones we now have. Amazing, huh?