Donald Trump is digging his own grave

[Jose Fly]

Yes, that's what this is all about, whether or not Trump ruined Bidens reputation as a candidate, by using foreign information.

Ah, I see what you meant.

We know for a fact that that's what Trump did. The transcripts clearly show he used the force of his office as well as leveraged taxpayer-funded, Congress-approved military aid to Ukraine to pressure Zelenskyy to investigate his main political rival.

If you're okay with that sort of thing, I'll just let that speak for itself.

 

[Ouroboros]

In a future final episode of the reality TV-show, "The President," starring Trump and Pelosi, the final famous words will be spoken by Pelosi, "You're FIRED!"

Just kiddin'. I doubt it'll happen. There will be an impeachment investigation. The House will recommend to kick Trump out. The Senate will refuse. And that'll be it.

 

[Cooky]

Ah, I see what you meant.

We know for a fact that that's what Trump did. The transcripts clearly show he used the force of his office as well as leveraged taxpayer-funded, Congress-approved military aid to Ukraine to pressure Zelenskyy to investigate his main political rival.

If you're okay with that sort of thing, I'll just let that speak for itself.

I'm okay with it, as long as he doesn't use that information. Which he hasn't. And probably wouldn't, unless it were also verified by an American agency.

 

[Ouroboros]

If Obama or Clinton had stood on the steps of the White House and asked China to investigate Trump (or Romney, or Graham), there would have been an *immediate* call for impeachment based on treason. And that would have been the right thing to do.

If you think that the Bidens have done something wrong (for which there is *no* evidence*), then investigate, potentially using the FBI, and charge them with a crime.

Apparently Ukraine's and China's secret service and justice department are much more efficient and trustworthy than FBI, CIA, NSA, and all the other three letter intelligence acronyms. We should just dismantle ours and let the other countries do our investigations. It'll be cheaper.

 

[Jose Fly]

I'm okay with it

Then there's really nothing more to say.

 

[Jose Fly]

Apparently Ukraine's and China's secret service and justice department are much more efficient and trustworthy than FBI, CIA, NSA, and all the other three letter intelligence acronyms. We should just dismantle ours and let the other countries do our investigations. It'll be cheaper.

Well keep in mind that in right-wing media, the current narrative is that this whistleblower complaint is part of a CIA coup.

Having grown up in the cold war era, I never thought I'd see the day when Republicans sided with Russian intelligence and propaganda over our own intelligence agencies. But here we are.....

 

[Twilight Hue]

Seems clear to me: 52 U.S. Code § 30121 - Contributions and donations by foreign nationals

It's not in the Constitution.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I never heard Trump admit that he was planning on using the information to incriminate Biden prior to the next election as a candidate.

...I never heard anyone admit to that.

No need to do so. Why would you think that needs to be the case?

Biden is his number one political rival right now. What other reason does he have for this activity? You also do not seem to understand what needs to be shown in a criminal trial. The standard is "proof beyond a reasonable doubt". Criminal trials are never "absolutely proven".

 

[Subduction Zone]

It's not in the Constitution.

What? Why does it need to be in the Constitution? Very few of our laws are in the Constitution. Murder being a crime is not in the Constitution.

 

[Twilight Hue]

What? Why does it need to be in the Constitution? Very few of our laws are in the Constitution. Murder being a crime is not in the Constitution.

I dunno. Maybe you could ask the Wicked Witch of the West , she's the one ranting on about the unconstitutionality by not investigating Trump.

Anyways did they make it official yet?

 

[averageJOE]

What an absolute right wing propaganda post. How do these people get away with this brazen attempt at malicious journalism. The facts stand for themselves if they ever make the light of day. The prosecutor was taking bribes to not investigate and was shown to be completely corrupt. The IMF, European leaders and the US had had enough and wanted Ukraine to start cleaning up their internal corruption and this guy was at the center of it so they wanted him gone.

AFTER he was fired is when the company that Biden son worked for was actually investigate and a report was issued by a legitimate prosecutor who actually did his job.

But no, right wing propaganda wants l you to believe he was fired because Joe was trying to create corruption in Ukraine. It’s absolutely shameful.

It's amazing how you refer to Kyle Kulinski, one of the co-founders of the Justice Democrats, as "right wing". Do you know who the Justice Democrats are?

 

[Cooky]

No need to do so. Why would you think that needs to be the case?

Biden is his number one political rival right now. What other reason does he have for this activity? You also do not seem to understand what needs to be shown in a criminal trial. The standard is "proof beyond a reasonable doubt". Criminal trials are never "absolutely proven".

They at least have to have some evidence.

...My biggest question is whether or not Ukraine will still offer up the president's request on the information... If they do, what will Trump do with it..? That's when we can decide to impeach or not -how he handles the information he should still get.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I dunno. Maybe you could ask the Wicked Witch of the West , she's the one ranting on about the unconstitutionality by not investigating Trump.

Anyways did they make it official yet?

Pelosi is saying that Trump has now forced their hand. And if you call her calm and logical statements "ranting" what do you call the extremely emotional and idiotic outbursts of our moronic President?

 

[Bear Wild]

I'm okay with it, as long as he doesn't use that information. Which he hasn't. And probably wouldn't, unless it were also verified by an American agency.

Exactly why would he collect the information unless he was going to use it. His use of power to extort information from other countries is a crime against the integrity of the presidency. His behavior is inciting acceptance of hate and creating fear. There is a real danger to the country when a president creates false statements intentionally to discredit people and when he makes statements threatening anyone who may disagree with him are further crimes against the country. Dictatorships start this way and they should not be tolerated.

 

[Subduction Zone]

They at least have to have some evidence.

...My biggest question is whether or not Ukraine will still offer up the president's request on the information... If they do, what will Trump do with it..? That's when we can decide to impeach or not.

Nope, just asking for help is illegal. You keep repeating your errors.

 

[SkepticThinker]

They at least have to have some evidence.

...My biggest question is whether or not Ukraine will still offer up the president's request on the information... If they do, what will Trump do with it..? That's when we can decide to impeach or not -how he handles the information he should still get.

How about the transcript of the call?
How about Trump saying on television that he made the call and asked for the favour?
How about Trump saying on television several months ago that he would look at information that foreign governments provide to him about his political opponents?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Here is a video of a lawyer giving an explanation of why the "hearsay" claim fails, along with the specific laws that govern this:

 

[Cooky]

How about the transcript of the call?
How about Trump saying on television that he made the call and asked for the favour?
How about Trump saying on television several months ago that he would look at information that foreign governments provide to him about his political opponents?

Yeah, I think Trump should get all that information still. Nobody said he can't have it. And when he receives it, we can all see what he does.

 

[Cooky]

Exactly why would he collect the information unless he was going to use it. His use of power to extort information from other countries is a crime against the integrity of the presidency. His behavior is inciting acceptance of hate and creating fear. There is a real danger to the country when a president creates false statements intentionally to discredit people and when he makes statements threatening anyone who may disagree with him are further crimes against the country. Dictatorships start this way and they should not be tolerated.

We just can't make that connection. Besides, Trump is still waiting to receive the investigative reports from Ukraine.

...When he gets it, we'll see what he does.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Yeah, I think Trump should get all that information still. Nobody said he can't have it. And when he receives it, we can all see what he does.

The law says he's not supposed to ask for it. Or take it. Or use it.